Michelle Obama and the "P" word

a reply to: Aliensun

Real men talk that way do they?

Bull. REAL men do not demean themselves, or ladies by such casual disregard for good form.

originally posted by: IkNOwSTuff
Is it sexual assualt if I tell my mates about what me and my girl got upto last night even if she was into it?

I didnt hear Trump talking about assaulting people, just very crudely talking about hitting on women.
In fact he clearly states he tried it on and failed and thats the end of it.

There is enough of a scandal there with him talking about knowingly hitting on a married woman so Im not sure why all the lies and exaggeration about it being sexual assualt?

Maybe Im missing something, Ive read the transcript 3 times and fail to see any talk of sexual assualt.

Heres a link to the transcript Pussy tapes
Please highlight the part where he talks about sexually assaulting anyone

First off I think both candidates blow. Having said that, I'm no law professor, but if you just walk up to some woman that you're not in a romantic relationship with and just grab her by the pu$$y, that's sexual assault. Try it sometime and let me know how that turns out for ya.

originally posted by: Zanti Misfit
a reply to: JinMI

If Trump were a Black Man , I wonder how Some People would look at the Bus Video Incident Differently ? Probably Say....Right On Brother !

And if Chump was a Black man running for POTUS with 5 kids by 3 different women, well, you know the rest.

What was the P word, i missed it a few pages back ... Pimp?

a reply to: kruphix

They get it, they're the ones trying to spin it.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: Aliensun

Real men talk that way do they?

Bull. REAL men do not demean themselves, or ladies by such casual disregard for good form.

I believe that some Men do talk that way when they are alone with the guys. They try to one up their buddies with how bad *ss they are. Most would never say such things around a lady, nor even act upon such thoughts. Even Trump showed respect towards the actress as soon as he stepped down from the bus and greeted her with a simple handshake.

On the bus, Trump described a real lady who was married and she had refused him. He then began discussing women who are not ladies. Believe me, I have known some girlfriends who excitedly threw themselves at band members and were very unladylike! Trump's wording may be crude, but the reality is...that they were only words describing the difference between how a real lady responds and the response of one who is not!

i think it's pretty telling that even dudes trying to defend trump for literal pages don't even need to be prompted to admit that it's disgusting and crass and a shameful way to behave

like

that's the point right there dudes. doesn't matter what sort of false equivalence you try to bring to balance the situation, bottom line is this guy is running for what is nominally supposed to be one of the most important, respected jobs in the world, and even his own defenders admit that his behaviour is reprehensible.
cut scene

originally posted by: JimiBlack

originally posted by: IkNOwSTuff
Is it sexual assualt if I tell my mates about what me and my girl got upto last night even if she was into it?

I didnt hear Trump talking about assaulting people, just very crudely talking about hitting on women.
In fact he clearly states he tried it on and failed and thats the end of it.

There is enough of a scandal there with him talking about knowingly hitting on a married woman so Im not sure why all the lies and exaggeration about it being sexual assualt?

Maybe Im missing something, Ive read the transcript 3 times and fail to see any talk of sexual assualt.

Heres a link to the transcript Pussy tapes
Please highlight the part where he talks about sexually assaulting anyone

First off I think both candidates blow. Having said that, I'm no law professor, but if you just walk up to some woman that you're not in a romantic relationship with and just grab her by the pu$$y, that's sexual assault. Try it sometime and let me know how that turns out for ya.

Not my style and unless your privy to some other document besides the one Ive linked here twice I dont think Trump is grabbing random women he doesnt know either.

originally posted by: ScoobyWho
Some people are always looking to start something when there is nothing there to begin with.

To be honest, I think Ms. Obama is pretty classy and intelligent lady. This is in stark contrast to all of the recent First Ladies (including Hilary) and Trumps wife Melania. There is no contest between Ms Obama and Ms. Trump. I look forward to Ms. Obama running for a Senate seat in the near future.

No, Michelle Obama is a ZERO CLASS woman and then some. Remember how she and her own mother treated people in China a couple years ago? It was legendary how she and her mother demeaned people and demanded everyone they met in China be their servants to the point that people quit their jobs over how they were being treated by them. Nope, Michelle Obama is a disgrace to all women past and present, and future, She is the worst the gender has to offer.

NO CLASS WHATSOEVER. And that is a true shame.

you guys that say most males dont talk like that must have had a really charmed upbringing. I was solidly low to middle class as a kid and starting as young as six all my friends cussed like sailors and we all talked about girls (GIRLS!!!) as dirty as we could and it was like that well into highschool. I guess this issue reveals either that alot of people are lying about what they grew up with or they just experienced a totally different reality than many other people like myself.

then, dont even get me started on the work place environment. Have any of you "men" had a real mans job? I mean construction sites, factory work, assembly line, mechanic, ANYTHING where there are all men doing hard work for 8 to 12 hours a day? Well...i have had numerous such jobs in my life....and i will tell you something...no matter where in America i worked growing up, if i was working with all men, the break time talk was always as lewd and low as you can imagine. I have a hard time believing that the men i worked with in several different states over the course of 20 years or so were completely unrepresentative of the way men pretty much are everywhere, but I will allow for the possibility that some men just grew up being very sheltered from the real world. Yes, the real world....its brutal folks...ive youve never experienced it then youre just speaking out of ignorance.

As to the 2005 tape. I will say first that most people are not fit to accurately deconstruct that recording and be able to make any sense of it whatsoever. It comes down to a combination of basic reading comprehension, as well as a far more rare set of interpretation skills in the area of verbal communication and its many variants/constructs/nuances etc.

"Trump speak" is a very different way of talking if any of you have been paying attention. You see, if you havent even identified the basic fact that the way Trump talks in general (conversational style etc) is very very different than the way most educated people talk, then you are positively doomed at making much sense out of anything he says unless its scripted and read. This is because Trump speaks in a very disheveled, fragmented manner that is torturous to listen to and read and is often broken and fragmented enough that what he seems to be saying or wanting to say is often not at all clear. If as a skeptical analyst you were approaching the subject of how Trump communicates you would have to systematically analyze his various speaking styles in known venues and create a model of syntax and intended meaning over time to understand HOW he talks and WHAT he MEANS. I think if one was to undertake such a project they would find, as i have, that Trumps communication style leaves him ripe and vulnerable for massive misunderstandings on a regular basis. So thats the first thing to consider before even attempting to make sense of his more controversial statements/comments.

A case in point which perfectly examples what im talking about. The account by Lil Jon from the Apprentice tells of Trump calling him "uncle Tom" when Lil Jon was dressed up as Uncle Sam. This is a perfect hallmark example of just how out of touch Trump is with modern and even older colloquillisms like "uncle Tom" and his misapprehension of what those expressions mean. In this case Trump couldnt understand why what he was saying was racist, which seems to reveal a limited understanding of race relations in history and the words that come from that era and how to properly apply them in context. In this situation Trump most likely thought he was using a term correctly and not in a racist way because as soon as it was explained to him that it was hurtful he stopped using it. If he knew he was using a hurtful term and using it to hurt someone its unlikely he would have ceased using it as soon as it was explained to him.

"“He just couldn’t grasp that it was offensive,” they told Billboard. “When [Trump] decides he wants to do something, that’s his way.”
www.theguardian.com...

Now back to the 2005 tape. Realizing that coming to this tape without any framework for understanding Trumps manner of communication is certain to doom one to snap judgments i would entreat anyone with an open mind to consider a couple of points which have been pointed out by other members in different ways already.

1. the first part of the conversation Trump is speaking about pursuing Nancy from Access HOllywood who was married when he was putting his moves on her. As others have pointed out they were obviously spending time together consensually until his advances were rebuffed and he moved on.

2. the second part which everyone got upset about begs for context because it has very little. It is highly unlikely that Trump would go from speaking about trying to date a woman or make moves on her (consensual) to speaking about women he is making moves on which are not consensual or welcomed in some way. Additionally, the fact he says "when youre a star they let you do it" makes it more clear that the context he is speaking of is when he is around women who are attracted to him BECAUSE of his star power and notoriety. Being familiar with the world of rock n roll and groupies one can easily understand that what Trump is MOST LIKELY talking about here, given the previous conversation about Nancy, is talking about women he has met and interacted with who were with him willingly to have fun together. It would make much LESS sense for Trump to so drastically change gears from talking about pursuing a woman in a very traditional way, taking her out shopping etc...(a classy but awkward move) to talking about victimizing random women just because hes a star. Does anyone else not see the blatant cognitive dissonance and lack connection to the prior conversation this would require? At no time does Billy seem confused by what Trump is talking about. Those of us who have spent time actually analyzing the elements of Trump speak and how it is he frequently makes such horrible speaking gaffes can appreciate that often what Trump says isnt exactly what he means and there is MUCH lost in translation with Trump as he is simply not a good speaker or conversationalist.


Now lets talk about Michelles double standard. She is old enough and experienced enough to know that the rap culture going back to the 80s is absolutely VILE. I grew up on NWA, Public Enemy, EZ E and the like. There were definitely two main kinds of rap, the kind that played on mtv and the kind that was mostly purchased on tape and seen in concerts. Thug rap was always about violence, sexual exploitation, drugs and MONEY. If you deny that you are just being obstinate or just really dont "get it".

to be continued....

Entertainment/Entrainment: those who excuse vile themes under the umbrella of entertainment are denying some pretty fundamental aspects to entertainment. First of all entertainment is not some transitory experience which has no affect on the mind of the consumer. Entertainment, especially music, is known to bypass the frontal lobes where higher reasoning takes place. This is why its so easy to weaponize music. If you dont know anything about psychological warfare and how arts and music are used on populations then you might as well leave now because youll have no ability to appreciate or understand the pivotal role music has on culture, attitudes and behavior. Music has always been used in the military and in other avenues because of its known affect on the human psyche. If you dont know this or cannot agree to it then you are simply out of your depth to understand the context and relevance of hip hop/rap and its impact on our society.


So like others have said, the words in songs matter. Music is consumed in a way much different than other media. Music combined with words have amazing power to influences peoples behaviors and to encourage them in behaviors they would otherwise not engage in without such music. Certain rhythms, beats, musical intervals have been known for thousands of years to have powerful biological effects. When these musical elements are used with a purpose....say to summon out of people their more animalistic, base desires....what is effectively taking place is mind control albeit with a mostly compliant audience.

So....in order to appreciate the total HYPOCRISY and COGNITIVE DISSONANCE of Michelle Obamas tacit approval and acceptance of the themes in rap music, but be critical of supposed words and behavior of a man which the music talks about in glowing terms, that is in fact a double standard and just NOT LOGICAL by any normal measure of logic and reason. This a priori assumption that because a vile theme is espoused and elocuted via music it is now given carte blanche license to say anything and declare it has no effect on the audience is simply denying science and history which proves otherwise. The steady consumption of certain kinds of media DOES have a noticeable effect on many peoples psyches....not all....but many....and since the largest consumers of this kind of music are those who are at there most easily influenced (teenagers) truly concerned people would be saying far more about the entertainment industry than they currently are.


this is a double standard pure and simple. Its selective, skewed interpretations to suit the agenda of those who were against Trump anyway.

originally posted by: kruphix

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: kruphix
a reply to: FlyingFox

She didn't say she was shaken by the single word.

She was shaken at Trump casually talking about sexually assaulting women.

Transcript

And I can’t believe that I’m saying that a candidate for president of the United States has bragged about sexually assaulting women. And I have to tell you that I can’t stop thinking about this. It has shaken me to my core in a way that I couldn’t have predicted.

LOL...so if I say the line "What's up my N-word", versus saying "You're a N-word" it's all good because one means me just calling someone my friend in a different term and one is derogatory?

SPIN SPIN SPIN....my head is spinning from all the SPIN!

You aren't making much sense.

Michelle Obama never said she was offended by the words Trump used. He could have left out the P word completely and I bet she would have had the same reaction.

She is offended that he is bragging that he can go up to women and sexual assault them because he is a "star".

What don't you understand about that.

Trump never said it was sexual assault, btw.

He said they let him do it.

What don't you understand about that.

a reply to: burgerbuddy

how many rapists
do you suppose
are outright like "yep, heckin raped that girl! super sexual assault right here" ?
some do, obviously, but the vast majority say things like "she didn't stop me" or "look how she dressed she secretly wanted it" or "after she stopped struggling she totally got into it"
this is called rape culture
what don't you understand about that.

a reply to: tribal



Star wasn't enough! You are exactly right. I love my jazz, and most nowadays don't really understand how much jazz helped the civil rights movement. I am not a long on typing text so others can check out my link below regarding the influence of jazz on society in the 60s. Mainly, wanted to give you extra kudos on your posts above. The hypocrisy in this day and age knows no boundaries!
Jazz and the Civil Rights Movement

who cares what she thinks? she doesn't matter and never will.

a reply to: continuousThunder

It might be an issue if it wasn't ELECTION TIME and Hillary the Psychopath wasn't running against the only Non Establishment Opponent in 'i forget how long'.

Trump Will Win! Why? Because The People are Fing Tired of the Crap that's Why.

originally posted by: continuousThunder
a reply to: burgerbuddy

how many rapists
do you suppose
are outright like "yep, heckin raped that girl! super sexual assault right here" ?
some do, obviously, but the vast majority say things like "she didn't stop me" or "look how she dressed she secretly wanted it" or "after she stopped struggling she totally got into it"
this is called rape culture
what don't you understand about that.

Rape culture is a myth in the western world.

And your scenario is kinda demented.

originally posted by: kruphix

originally posted by: shooterbrody
a reply to: kruphix

bull crap
rap music is all about criminal offenses and objectifying women

keep making that arguement tho the logic is flawless and you are sure to get the feminists to agree with you

show the hypocracy for all the world to see

see who stays home on ekection day

And slasher movies are all about killing people...does that make the writers of those movies murderers?

Or what about Country music...alcoholism and domestic abuse.

They are themes in a genre, not a documentary about the artists who write them.

What kind of country music are you listening too?! lol!!

Alcoholism and domestic abuse?

Domestic abuse like this? WARNING! May contain trigger words!



His Titties and Beer song is great.

Drinking is a given in country music along with pick up trucks, trains and momma.



Rap sucks.

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: kruphix
a reply to: FlyingFox

She didn't say she was shaken by the single word.

She was shaken at Trump casually talking about sexually assaulting women.

Transcript

And I can’t believe that I’m saying that a candidate for president of the United States has bragged about sexually assaulting women. And I have to tell you that I can’t stop thinking about this. It has shaken me to my core in a way that I couldn’t have predicted.

LOL...so if I say the line "What's up my N-word", versus saying "You're a N-word" it's all good because one means me just calling someone my friend in a different term and one is derogatory?

SPIN SPIN SPIN....my head is spinning from all the SPIN!

It's all about the Democratic Double Standard. What is good for Democrats is good for everyone and whats bad for everone is ONLY bad for Democrats.