Indian fighter purchase - RFPs to Dassault, SAAB, MiG, F-16

The Cobra really has no real combat use, these days its rare to even get within visual rage of an enemy fighter let alone be close enough to him do that he can perform a Cobra and be successful. Now days your getting shot at form 50+ miles away, so you better dodge about 6 missile if you want to perform you cobra.

Originally posted by chinawhite

stealth spy does what

*hits head with hammer*

chinawhite i have to congratulate you ... for miserably failing to try to provoke me into a flame war with another one of your disgusting and sickening flame bait.

Grow up friend.

And, if anyone wants to discuss anything about the cobra, etc i kindly request them to use the appropriate thread for the same.

Anyway coming back to the topic....i've heard that the Mirage 2000 - 5 might be the IAF's choice and India's existing Mig-29's may be upgraded to the new Mig-29 standard. So the prospect of F-16's is bleak

Originally posted by Stealth Spy

Originally posted by chinawhite

stealth spy does what

*hits head with hammer*

chinawhite i have to congratulate you ... for miserably failing to try to provoke me into a flame war with another one of your disgusting and sickening flame bait.

Grow up friend.

And, if anyone wants to discuss anything about the cobra, etc i kindly request them to use the appropriate thread for the same.

Anyway coming back to the topic....i've heard that the Mirage 2000 - 5 might be the IAF's choice and India's existing Mig-29's may be upgraded to the new Mig-29 standard. So the prospect of F-16's is bleak

thats so funny hearing that from you. you clearly dont know anything about a cobra...

Originally posted by Stealth Spy

Originally posted by chinawhite

stealth spy does what

*hits head with hammer*

chinawhite i have to congratulate you ... for miserably failing to try to provoke me into a flame war with another one of your disgusting and sickening flame bait.

Grow up friend.

And, if anyone wants to discuss anything about the cobra, etc i kindly request them to use the appropriate thread for the same.

Anyway coming back to the topic....i've heard that the Mirage 2000 - 5 might be the IAF's choice and India's existing Mig-29's may be upgraded to the new Mig-29 standard. So the prospect of F-16's is bleak

yeah some inside sources were telling me that the hot favourite is mirage 2000 because of the maintainance costs and ease of technology that can be attained for upgrades later on.

oh also if the f-16's are not accepted by IAF does it mean the US will not support India for UNSC seat? everything is connected like a spider web here ....

oh and chinawhite man dont turn this into a flame war. Dont make comments aimed at him, the thread was good so far .


[edit on 20-6-2005 by siddarthpanditv]

• WASHINGTON: The US has offered to sell to India F-16 fighter aircraft and its advanced versions besides entering into a co-production agreement for the warplanes, US Assistant Secretary of State Christina Rocca said here on Tuesday. The offer of co-production ‘‘is a big step’’ and shows that USA’s relations with India are becoming ‘‘ever closer’’, Rocca told the house international relations subcommittee for Asia and the Pacific.

link

also in the same article >> US clears sale of latest Patriot anti-missile system to India

The US wants to dispel the notion that it is an unreliable partner concerning defence deals. According to sources, “The US agrees that at the political level there is a signal that it is willing to address this issue.”

New Delhi has acknowledged that the US remains the source of some big technologies, therefore, the two countries are moving towards taking defence ties beyond the realm of joint military exercises.

“India provides a very good platform for outsourcing some component manufacture or joint production” the sources said. :up

The United States embassy officials told FE that the US administration was upbeat and open about developing tie-up with India on sales and transfer of technology in strategic arms field and disclosed for the first time that since January 2002, the United States arms and systems sales to India had touched almost a $1 biLLIon.

“So far 1,320 licences for arms hardware worth $300 million and 156 agreements worth more than $688 million had been authorised,” the officials said. “With the state department going fully electronic by year end, we expect arms sales licence clearance to be shorter than present 14 to 15 calender days,” they added.

full article...........

Its confirmed...the Mig-29 version includes the latest TVC too .... >> www.themoscowtimes.com...

timesofindia.indiatimes.com...


MIG 35 offered.

Boeing in talks with Indian Air Force to supply F-18s

Boeing Co. said on Friday it had begun preliminary talks with India on selling and co-producing F-18 Super Hornet fighter planes, a month after New Delhi and Washington signed a far-reaching defence pact.

"We have begun initial discussions with the IAF in terms of exploratory relationship building and to provide them with some initial information on the capabilities of the Super Hornet," Chris Chadwick, Boeing vice president for the F/A-18 programs, told Reuters. "Their response has been very positive."

He added the price per aircraft would depend on the configuration sought in the planned request for proposal by the IAF. The cost would also be determined by the kind of technology and weapons platform the U.S. government would allow Boeing to export to India, Chadwick said.

"We would be working at setting up a co-production facility for this aircraft in India," he added.

full article ........


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Boeing will not offer the F-15 Eagle for India's forthcoming fighter needs but would like to offer the latest Block 2 version of the F/A-18E/F Super Hornet, the company said.

The Block 2 includes advanced systems such as the APG-79 Active Electronically Scanned Array, Advanced Targeting FLIR and Multi-Functional Information Distribution System.

Co-production with India is likely.

full article at : www.flightinternational.com...

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WASHINGTON - The prospect of selling fighter jets to the world's largest democracy is generating mounting interest at Boeing's military headquarters in St. Louis.

Executives are just back from a trip to India late last week, during which they spoke to political and military leaders about the possible sale of the St. Louis-built F/A-18 Super Hornet. In India, Chris Chadwick, Boeing's vice president for Hornet programs, told Indian reporters, "As the world watches closely while the story of India unfolds, we at Boeing see the next 60 years of aerospace in India as dynamic, entrepreneurial and globally dynamic."

India is in the market for 126 aircraft, said Boeing spokeswoman Pat Frost, who accompanied Chadwick and others on the trip. Advertisement "That's a lot of airplanes. It's a great opportunity," Frost said Tuesday. The Boeing group spoke to Air Force and government officials who're trying to put together a formal request for proposals. That request is expected to be ready between mid-fall and December, Frost said.

"We know they're interested in co-production and technology transfer," Frost said. "We're willing to entertain all these different options."

A sale to India would be Boeing's first international deal for the Super Hornet, though the F/A-18 Super Hornet has been sold overseas. Right now, the U.S. Navy is the Super Hornet's sole customer.

The Boeing talks took place just a few days after India and the United States agreed to strengthen cooperation on nuclear, defense and security issues. "With all the agreements going on between the U.S. government and India, India's obviously becoming a very important economic player," Frost said.

"They've got a reasonable chance in India," said Richard Aboulafia, aerospace analyst at the Teal Group Corp. in Fairfax, Va. "The big advantage they have is the U.S. Navy's stamp of approval, and this is going to be a consistently upgraded aircraft."

full article .......

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quote]While the IAF has no qualms in admitting that the Super Hornet is possibly the most advanced fighter currently in full-rate production, most officials in the force insist that the Hornet has always been a platform designed for carrier-borne maritime missions. Almost all Hornets in possession of the US forces at present are with the aircraft carrier groups.

The Boeing team will try its best to dispel this popular opinion that the Horent is a Naval platform. Friday’s presentation will most likely have Boeing informing the IAF — as Lt Gen Jeffrey Kohler of the Defense Security Cooperation Agency had done earlier this year — that the Super Hornet can be upgraded and tweaked for conventional multi-role operations.

Interestingly, it’s the Indian Navy which will first get a taste of the Hornet this September during a joint exercises with the US at the Arabian Sea.


url

New exercises are something to look forward to as well

And here's a carrot for India to go in for the Super Hornet :

Since US media reports indicate Bush administration’s clearance for possible transfer of sensitive radar technology like Raytheon AN/APG-79 AESA radar of the Super Hornet to India, diplomatic bargaining to secure the AN/APG-81 AESA radar may well bear fruit.

www.indiadefence.com...

Russia to field latest N-capable MiG-35 in India

Russia is to field its latest nuclear capable MiG-35 fighter against US F-16 and French Mirage 2000 in the tender to be floated for the acquisition of 125 aircraft for the Indian Air Force to replace its ageing MiG-21 fleet, a top Russian official said.

"We will offer our MiG-35 multirole fighters with thrust vectoring control along with transfer of technology for indigenous production in India," Director General and Chief Designer of Russian Aircraft Corporation (RAC) 'MiG' Alexei Fedorov said after display of its capabilities by "MiG-29OVT" at the air show in Zhukovsky.

Fedorov said it has been decided to market the MiG-29OVT with thrust vectoring control (TVC) under the MiG-35 brand.

"It has incorporated all the features of MiG-29M/M2 fighters developed on the basis of MiG-29 frontline fighter and today we can offer top-of-the-line multirole combat aircraft with in-flight refuelling," Fedorov said.

According to MiG Deputy Chief Designer Andrei Karasyov MiG-35 is capable of delivering all present and future weapons, since it has universal open architecture.

"Today new MiG fighter has the super -manoeuvrability similar to Sukhoi 30MKI," he underscored.

full article at .. www.hindustantimes.com...

Originally posted by WestPoint23
I always though it was to fire the missiles. In my head Red button=Missiles being fired.

No, no, no. That's the Mig 31 Firefox you're thinking of!

I'd suggest the Saab Gripen would actually be better suited to the PAF's operational requirements as they share the "highway as emergency combat strip" operatinal doctrine of the Swedes, while the Viggen would have been the best bet for India 20 years ago. A true multi-role aircraft designed to defeat MiGs. Of course scale of economy means the Swedes don't build things cheap and the Yanks can.

From an outside perspective, the F/A18E/F is possibly a better bet than F16, given that Super Hornet's design cycle is younger than Fighting Falcon's and is scheduled (as far as I know) to go longer than Fighting Falcon.

I suppose one plus to owning Fighting Falcon is that it's easy to provide an aggressor squadron that almost perfectly imitates your enemy!

Given that Canberras and Hunters are not built to mix it up with Falcons and nobody really builds dedicated bombers anymore (obvious exception: B2), F/A 18 would seem to me to be a better choice over F16. Especially when you consider that the LCA is supposed to enter service and would slot straight into the natural position of the F16, leaving the bigger Hornet to get really dirty moving the rubble sidways.

Russia formally offers the Su-35 as a MRCA contender?

www.hindu.com...

Another interesting points to note here is that the article warrants the Su-35 with a 'larger wing' than the Su30 series along with the known replacements in the radar, avionics, guns and engine .
Is this larger wing area a result extended LERX-like shoulders due to the removal of canards, thus keeping effective wing area more or less the same and reducing RCS?
maneuverability lost due to removal of canards would I presume be made up by
the overpowered TVC engine the Su-35 has.

Much as I love the new Super Flankers, there's no way that India will accept them for the MRCA competition. They've already got Su-30's to fill the role, and the MRCA is intended to provide a lighter counterpart for them. Hence why I suspect Gripen, Rafale, and MiG-35 are all well-fitted to the competition. I complain that the F/A-18 E/F Super Bugs are too big to fill the role well, but that means that the Su-35 is simply massive for the job.

While the promise of possessing the next-gen technologies in the Su-35 is no doubt appealing, I highly doubt that the Super Flanker will go anywhere near winning this competition.

Shame to say it, though.

Christ almighty !!!
Its been three-four years.. and they still haven't decided..


Just take the goddamn F-18's !!
And buy a few Mig-29's to keep the Russians happy.

So many threads on this so didn't want to start a new one... but then had trouble deciding which old one I should update!!

Anyways, shocking news..And no reason why.

Seems that the MoD statement contradicts the IAF position.What happened? Too expensive (but the Typhoon is more expensive)? Slush funds? Under-the-table activities?
I liked that a/c.

reply to post by Daedalus3


Yeah Daedalus, Rafale is a nice looking AC indeed.(Its French so that might explain it )

Still it is sad that the Rafale didnt made it through.

So the remaining contenders are:

F-16 Block 60I.
F/A-18 super unit.
EF-2000.
Gripen NG.
MiG-35.

My bet is now on either the Super Fulcrum or the Super Falcon. Gripen might have a chance but its unlikely.

The other two do not stand a chance.

reply to post by Daedalus3


The Indian Air Force denied that ANY of the fighters are out of the competition. They said that technical evaluations just ended, and flight tests start next month, but no one has been ruled out.