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If You Are An American And You Support Foreign Influence Over Our Elections

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posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 12:09 AM
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a reply to: Phage

I'll agree with that. Hopefully that changes soon.

With that being said I hope this election hasn't gotten so many new people that the business model hasn't changed. I am worried that America has successfully become polarized beyond repair once again, ironic seeing as both polarizations feed the same agenda.




posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 12:59 AM
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a reply to: theantediluvian

On this subject I tend to agree with Obama.



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 01:04 AM
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a reply to: Vector99

So you're calling for Donald Trump to release his tax returns then?



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 01:06 AM
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originally posted by: theantediluvian
a reply to: Vector99

So you're calling for Donald Trump to release his tax returns then?

Would be nice, especially with that little oops Phage brought up in another thread.



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 01:57 AM
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a reply to: CriticalStinker

I will say that Trump has rattled cages that needed rattling.
Trump for President. Not for me.



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 02:48 AM
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a reply to: theantediluvian

I disagree. We saw lots of Bernie supporters turn their backs on the Dems over the DNC collusion.

if someone would kindly leak the republicans stuff maybe enough people would have the lightbulb came on that all these people are scum.

We saw it to some degree during the republican primary. And if it keeps up we may yet get to see both parties collapse.

But keep deflecting from your brand of kool-aid, it's cute.



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 04:07 AM
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a reply to: theantediluvian

Arent you a globalist who scoffs at honor and integrity when it is asked of you by those who disagree with you on random issues?

And you harp on now about your countrymen?

You have no country.

After all your continued efforts to undermine our national identity and unity in favor of a globalist dream world void of borders or national sovereignty?

as you say, yawn.

You are not a common man. Feel special and alone.


edit on 10 7 2016 by tadaman because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 07:44 AM
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originally posted by: theantediluvian
a reply to: shooterbrody

That is not how the Russians gained access to the DNC emails which is what you claimed. You're conflating two different things. One of the groups that hacked the DNC (Cozy Bear) also compromised non-secure systems of the Joint Chief of Staff and the White House. Their typical MO for initial access is mass targetted spearphising. Do you know how spearphishing works? If so you'll know that the computer that is infected is the one of the end user viewing the email who clicks the link.

There's absolutely no evidence that one had anything to do with the others.


You resort to attacks when the facts do not bear out your BS position on russia. Though I noticed you did not dispute the failures of the current administration. Take your bush era neocon evil empire retoric and go away.


I don't dispute the failures of the current administration though I don't engage in frivolous partisan exaggeration either. I'm not actually a supporter of Clinton either which is where your own thinking is fundamentally flawed. I don't care about Clinton. She could get arrested the day after being sworn in for all I care.

I am more than anything, anti-Trump. I'm not "resorting" to anything. You've yet to discredit anything I've said about Russia at all. Not one single thing but yet you say "when the facts do not bear out your BS position on russia."

Please, disabuse me of my mistaken beliefs concerning the very real and very obvious efforts by Russia to influence the outcome of the US Presidential election.

I didn't even get into the influence they're having over Donald Trump — a man so lacking in even a desire to understand foreign policy that he just repeats what is whispered in his ears.

If you're interested, here are some of the threads I've posted on the topic of Russia, Trump and WikiLeaks recently:

Who Is Carter Page And How Did He Come To Work For Trump's Campaign?
Dissecting The WikiLeaks Russian Connection - Part One
Did WikiLeaks Exclude Syria To Russia Bank Transfer Emails From Syria Files?


Now you want to switch from hillarys complete lack of responsibility with respect to her handling of classified info to the DNC email problem? Sure I will bite. There is no proof the russians hacked the DNC. There is speculation, but no proof. There is as much speculation that it was an INSIDE leak as it was the russians. So don't act like it is a solved case. If you have PROOF it was the russian govt please by all means provide the proof.

As far as russia as an enemy of the usa...that ship sailed long ago. The idiocy that was the cold war is over. Why you and others in the msm want to bring it back is beyond me. The russians have their own interests. I feel we should leave them to russia. They appear to be the only country at this time interested in defeating ISIS and putin the dictator has no issues with destroying them with all measures available. Had our own government not made and aided the arab spring mess syria would not be the craphole it is right now.

We have enough problems to deal with here in the usa. I feel we need to fix our problems here before we try more nation building. We are in no more danger now from the russians (chinese, north koreans, or iranians for that matter) than we were during the cold war. I feel this sudden issue that "russia is the devil" is more bs from an administration that has failed on just about every front, and is desperately looking for a way to hang on to power.

I served. I do not mean to disparage your patriotism. If that is how I have come across I apologize. I appreciate your concern about foreign influence on our elections. The issue just needs to be looked at in full and not as a "campaign" issue.



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 09:14 AM
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a reply to: theantediluvian

Is it policy to sign off on the sale of plutonium mines to foreign interest who donate to your foundation? that's what she did. Wanna speculate about someone else? Fine. But there's aplenty of evidence going against Clinton. Let's not even mention the 225mil foundation donations from foreign interested that weren't vetted... by the same AG so up in arms about Trump not having his paperwork in order.... who also contributes to Hillary's campaign.



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 11:17 AM
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originally posted by: neveroddoreven99
a reply to: theantediluvian

Is it policy to sign off on the sale of plutonium mines to foreign interest who donate to your foundation? that's what she did. Wanna speculate about someone else? Fine. But there's aplenty of evidence going against Clinton. Let's not even mention the 225mil foundation donations from foreign interested that weren't vetted... by the same AG so up in arms about Trump not having his paperwork in order.... who also contributes to Hillary's campaign.



Not plutonium. It was actually uranium and I've already addressed the Uranium One - Rosatom deal in this thread. In fact, I did so right on the first page:


The bulk of that money came to the foundation (like 96-97%) in 2005 after Bill Clinton — a private citizen — accompanied a Canadian businessmen, chairman of a Canadian company (UrAsia), to Kazakhstan while the company sought mineral rights to Kazakhstan's uranium fields.

If anything, this was against the interests of Russia. In fact, the later arrests of the Kazatomprom executives responsible for the sale was blamed on Russian influence.

The man who Bill Clinton accompanied, Frank Giustra, left the company and divested himelf of all holdings in the 2007 merger with Uranium One which resulted in a new company, taking the name Uranium One but still based in Canada.

It wasn't until what? 2009? When the Russians looked to obtain a controlling share of Uranium One?

The US produces less than 2% of the world's uranium. The fields under the control of Uranium One account for an estimated 20% of the known US proved uranium reserve.

Hillary Clinton was 1 out of 9 votes. The President is the only one who could have overruled the vote and he didn't. Most importantly, the NRC regulates any and all export of uranium from the United States.

Would I have voted to allow the merger? I don't think I would have but I wasn't an administration trying to have a "reset with Russia" either.

However, what you said is just mindless drivel born of obvious ignorance and lauded by similiarly disengaged cultish Trump followers.


Details matter. You want to bring up NY? I'm happy to oblige.

Do you know who Alan Hevesi is? He was the NYC City Comptroller and later NY State Comptroller. He and Elliott Broidy ended up pleading guilty in a pay-to-play scheme in which he took from Broidy to give Broidy's firm access to the New York State Common Retirement Fund.

At the same time, Donald Trump was making conspicuously large donations to Hevesi and receiving favorable decisions from Hevesi that according to Trump in Trump: How To Get Rich, saved him nearly $100 million.

Guess what Elliot Broidy is up to these days?

He's a vice chair for the Trump Victory Fund.

Of course that's all rather unrelated to the fact that Russia is overtly trying to influence the outcome of our election isn't it?



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 01:33 PM
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a reply to: shooterbrody

I believe that if you read the thread I authored on the topic, you might have a different opinion about the Russians being the source of the DNC "leaks." It's possible that CrowdStrike fabricated all the evidence but it seems unlikely and if they didn't frabricate it, multiple independent security firms have corroborated their assessment.

If you look at it from my perspective, believing what I do about the incident than I think you'd have to agree that the most plausible reason for the events that transpired were to influence the outcome of the election.

If you believe both of those things as I do, it's very difficult not to see Russia as a threat.

I apologize for my own belligerence. I tend to get carried away. I also agree that this isn't simply a campaign issue by any means. I think that our politicians and our business leaders need to get a whole hell of a lot more serious about asymmetric cyberwarfare because a lot of damage can be done by a relatively small number of individuals with a very modest investment. While we've demonstrated with things like Stuxnet (which is a whole different level) that we have substantial offensive capabilities, we're obviously weak on defense and that's not helped by politicians who put servers in basements or use public email services. It's not even just classified material that we should be concerned about. Even personal communications can be used against our interests if they fall into the wrong hands — for instance, anything that could be used to blackmail a politician, government official, military leader, etc.



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 02:13 PM
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Foreigners have been partly in control of the U.S. for decades. That's because they are investors in Wall Street, which really runs the country.



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 04:43 PM
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originally posted by: theantediluvian
a reply to: Vector99

So you're calling for Donald Trump to release his tax returns then?


SO having the IRS audit your taxes and releasing them before they are completed is hiding something? Trumps a businessman and any business man will not interfere in a IRS audit for fear of them screwing something up.

Politicians do their taxes a different way and do them as if they will be running for president soem day. They make sure theres not too much earned or too little given to charity. Even their taxes are manufactured and controlled.



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 04:47 PM
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a reply to: yuppa




SO having the IRS audit your taxes and releasing them before they are completed is hiding something?

1) The letter from Trump's attorneys did not say that his taxes are being audited. He said they are being audited.

2) Trump said in 2014 that he would release his tax returns if Obama released his birth certificate.

3) Earlier this year he said he would release his tax returns on more than one occasion, with no mention of an "audit."




edit on 10/7/2016 by Phage because: (no reason given)

edit on 10/7/2016 by Phage because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 04:49 PM
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originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: yuppa




SO having the IRS audit your taxes and releasing them before they are completed is hiding something?

1) The letter from Trump's attorneys did not say that his taxes are being audited.
2) Trump said in 2014 that he would release his tax returns if Obama released his birth certificate.
3) Earlier this year he said he would release his tax returns on more than one occasion, with no mention of an "audit."



Politicians do their taxes a different way
What?





Ahh i see you didnt hear clearly when trump said he would release his taxes. he said he would release them EARLY if clinton revealed the e mails that are missing. He said Otherwise his attornys recommended he hold off on releasing them till after the Audit is done.



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 04:54 PM
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a reply to: yuppa

Ahh i see you didnt hear clearly when trump said he would release his taxes. he said he would release them EARLY if clinton revealed the e mails that are missing.


"Will you release any of your tax returns for the public to scrutinize?" NBC’s Chuck Todd asked Trump in January 2016.

"Well, we're working on that now. I have very big returns, as you know, and I have everything all approved and very beautiful and we'll be working that over in the next period of time, Chuck. Absolutely," Trump replied.

A few weeks later, Trump told the Today Show in February 2016 that he’ll release his tax returns "probably over the next few months."

www.politifact.com...
 



He said Otherwise his attornys recommended he hold off on releasing them till after the Audit is done.
I know what he said. He says a lot of crap. The letter from his attorneys does not say there is an audit.
 




They make sure theres not too much earned or too little given to charity. Even their taxes are manufactured and controlled.
Is that why Trump says he will release his 2015 tax return as soon as it is complete and filed?



edit on 10/7/2016 by Phage because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 04:55 PM
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a reply to: theantediluvian

They do, they really do! There taking these emails as the gospel truth even when they could be faked. Why, because it suits there political narrative.

These are the real Americans, the patriots! wow



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 05:05 PM
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a reply to: Phage

Id rather have him than CLinton though. I dont care bout his taxes. Anytime one bring sup money it screams jealousy.

If there was a good third party canidate id vote for them.



posted on Oct, 7 2016 @ 05:25 PM
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a reply to: yuppa



I dont care bout his taxes.
Well, you could have said that instead of trying to defend his not releasing them.



posted on Oct, 8 2016 @ 07:28 AM
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a reply to: theantediluvian

I think most americans are concerned with security, though we may propose different solutions. Good to know we have common interests.



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