POLITICS: Utah State Lawmaker Defends Polygamy

Offended when a colleague passed out anti-polygamy literature in the Utah State Senate, Carlene Walker countered by passing out literature of her own. The literature that the Republican State Senator passed out defended the practice as natural and not necessarily harmful.



Can you really defend it? Its a very touchy issue in Utah. A micro-brewer tempted the wrath of the Church of LDS and conservative lawmakers when it started marketing Polygamy Porter with catchy phrases like "Why have one?" and "Take one home to the wives". These groups were in an uproar about it. The article says that there more than 30,000 polygamists in the West, but I'm not sure how they came up with that figure. i mean its not a standard census question?

Don't even get me started on the Mormons...

This goes to prove leopards can't change their spots. After promising to end polygamy as a condition for becoming a State of the United States in the late 1800s, Utah continues to harbor polygamists and even in neighboring states mormon groups continue to practice polygamy and keep women in practically slave-like conditions.

I don't really see men having a problem with polygamy. Do you?

Getting serious the guy who is defending polygamy is either out of his minds or have found a way to keep his wives live togther and not drive him nuts.

Either way he is insane.

Surf

Originally posted by surfup
I don't really see men having a problem with polygamy. Do you?

Getting serious the guy who is defending polygamy is either out of his minds or have found a way to keep his wives live togther and not drive him nuts.

Either way he is insane.

Surf

It was a woman who was defending polygamy and polygamy is a traditional practice among followers of the Church of Latter Day Saints (Mormons) who make up the vast majority of Utah's population.

Originally posted by djohnsto77
It was a woman who was defending polygamy and polygamy is a traditional practice among followers of the Church of Latter Day Saints (Mormons) who make up the vast majority of Utah's population.

I was joking buddy.

I quite really understand that Carlene is a name used for mostly women and that the pronoun "she" is used only in relation to... well i don't know... women.

Surf

Originally posted by surfup
I don't really see men having a problem with polygamy. Do you?

More than one mother-in-law

Originally posted by Pisky
More than one mother-in-law

That would truly be one hell of a problem. People with one mother in law, try to kill themselves when theirs is visiting, i wonder what happens when more than one visits at the same time.

Good thing that would never happen to me.

Here is a disgusting thought: Is there any evidence of the two being married to the same guy. I know...just wondering, sorry.

Surf

Speaking as someone who has lived in Utah, and is not a mormon for the record. Not all polygamists keep their wives in slavery like conditions, marry teenage girls, practice incest, abuse their families or the welfare system. There are several groups of polygamists in Utah where the wives are highly educated professionals and respected in their communities. All of this being said I don't agree with polygamy in any way. Besides that in the bible it specifically says No man Can serve two masters.

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As long as it is not taking advantage of vulnerable people I really have no problem with polygamy. If you can create a good environment for raising children and that is reasonably agreeable to all the adults more power to them.

All people deciding to get married should be of an adult age and not make the decision under duress.

Why do we have to have a tyrrany of the majority?
One size fits all?
People and circumstances are unique, our acceptance of that should be reflected with openmindedness.
.

Polygamy has a negative economic impact on my country. We have a community in BC called Bountiful, and they are abusing the taxation and social assistance systems. A man can only have one spouse by law, and the rest can all claim the benefits of single-parent status. Up here, you could have a family with 6 wives, with only the husband working. 5 of them could claim welfare as single parents, so they get more money. I don't know the ins and outs of your social programs, so I don't know if this applies to the US as well.

Polygamy makes perfect sense for basic survival. In modern times there is not a need for this beyond the life style selected both those who practice it. However if a great catastrophe were to occur you would see this encouraged to increase the population at an accelerated rate.

Polygamy, I think it's a personal choice, let them have it. That doesn't mean I approve things as rape and incest, because in such cases the victims have had no personal choice.

Maybe if the laws were changed to deal with the issue of polygamy, instead of just outlawing it (at least in Canada) and then turning a blind eye because it is a religion. If they want to live that lifestyle, fine, but all the wives should be classified as married, giving them equal treatment under the law.

One other problem that needs to be addressed, at least in Canada, is that children under 16 can get married with the written consent of there parents (I don't remember the lower limit off the top of my head, but I'd guess 14). I don't think this exception was written so that 60 year-old men could marry 15 year-old girls, just because it's a religious belief. That's still child abuse, as far as I'm concerned.

the problem with giving polygamy any kind of legal standing is that you can't give a male anything and then deny it to women in our legal system. So, well, can you imagine the financial power of one women with five men pulling in paychecks, and only a few kids....

so, who would legally be responisble for those few kids, all of the five husbands, or just the paternal parent.

seems like it would be costly to have dna testing every time there's a divorce.

sounds like the perfect plan in an overpopulated society, with limited resources and a weakening middle class. Outside of the fact that the kids would have no idea who their real father is....but that is happening now, isn't it?

[edit on 23-1-2005 by dawnstar]

The ONLY reason monogamy became the acceptable norm was because it takes power away from governmental and religous institutions. Families practicing polygamy historically become a tribe, and a tribe eventually develops alot of power in a given community, both economically and socially. Think about it, why else would they care how many wives you had? Because of how many kids you would have, and how many kids they would have and subsequently, how much clout you would have in the political strata. It has nothing to do with morality, it has to do with the balance of power in the system. You have been conditioned to believe that monogamy is the 'proper' marital situation. I truly wonder sometimes how much of our moral beliefs are garnered from this fear of people power?

Oh my dawnstar, talk about seeing the other side of something.

I guess it never occurred to me that a woman might want more than one husband. Do they all have to provide diamonds? To me, that would be the only possible benefit of multiple husbands. I can see why men might want extra wives, but good god, one husband was too much for me, let alone five!

I see your point about economic power, but in BC this is already happening. A man with 6 wives has 5 pulling welfare as single parents (single parent + 1 kid = $1050, 5 x 1050 = $5250 a month). That's some good coin, and it's my tax dollars.

Oh, I can see some benefits to more than one husband -- one or two to bring in big paychecks, one to do yardwork, one to keep up the house (paint, repairs) etc. That part sounds pretty good to me.

jm

dang fingers go faster than the brain sometimes .....

[edit on 23-1-2005 by justme1640]

Is that what husbands are supposed to do? Why didn't you tell me that 10 years ago? Wow, mine didn't do any of those things. Hmmmm, must re-evaluate.....

Originally posted by justme1640
Oh, I can see some benefits to more than one husband -- one or two to bring in big paychecks, one to do yardwork, one to keep up the house (paint, repairs) etc.

That part sounds pretty good to me.

You kidding me? When was the last time a normal husband did all that?

Having more than one gives you more one people to clean after.

Surf

Djohnsto77 says:

“It was a woman who was defending polygamy and polygamy is a traditional practice among followers of the Church of Latter Day Saints (Mormons) who make up the vast majority of Utah's population.”

Well, Djohnsto77, there goes your Temple Recommend!

The Mormons are the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. If you’re going to attack someone, at least use the correct name.

And polygamy is not a practice among the LDS church. In 1890. as a part of the Great Acommodation, President Wilford Woodruff announced that the Church would no longer practice plural marriages, that all the men must divorce all their wives but one, and that maintaining or entering into plural marriage was grounds for ex post facto excommunication from the Church.

Although there were and still are groups like the Warren Jeffs’ FLDS (Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints) rthey are not part of the Church. I hve been to both Colorado City AZ and Hilldale, Utah and seen these folks; they are running welfare scams and (probably) kidnaping and statutory rape, but they are not members of the LDS Church.