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Is this history the real history of the illuminati???

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d3v

posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 10:48 AM
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HERE

I'm wondering if this is true.

I personally think it is illuminati circulated propganda and that the Illuminati has been in existance since Sumer.

Does anyone know???




posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 11:01 AM
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If it was illuminati circulated propaganda, it certainly would've been common knowledge to more than 0.000001% of the world's population.

If it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, and looks like a duck, its probably a duck.


d3v

posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 11:07 AM
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ok so if the illuminati have only been around since the late 1700,s, who controlled us throghot hostory#?

same group but differant name?



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 11:30 AM
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Originally posted by d3v

I personally think it is illuminati circulated propganda and that the Illuminati has been in existance since Sumer.

Does anyone know???


i agree, the illuminati as a concept has been around since the foundation of Sumer.
the illuminati as organization infects then prospers different and various organizations thru the ages...stealth & mobility are important.

in future years the quiet growth of www.burning man . com
(heres a enlightening article: )
www.worthynews.com...
might be seen as a form of / proxy for the Bohemian Grove. Group
portion of NWO-ILLUMINATI

?anyone know?---> nope, we can just conjecture, and conduct our lives accordingly...

peace ^^

[edit on 22-1-2005 by St Udio]



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 11:54 AM
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The concept or concepts like that have been around for a long time inherited by one group after another but with varying amounts of influence and power and various versions of a larger agenda. As technology has brought the world closer together, the various secret societies have been able to operate in a more consistent and widespread fashion. There appears to be a particular consistency in the approach and evolution of the illuminati/NWO/whatever-you-call-them since the late 1700s. I think that is why a lot of people take that as a starting point.

I am sure they will claim to be the true holders of some ancient tradition and I think it is good to look at earlier and ancient roots of all this. But ultimately, I don't dwell on whether they trace themselves back to Sumer. They are gangsters. The key thing for me is who and what they control now, what are their near and long term agendas and what we can do about it.

The website in question just seems to be one person's attempt to get a handle on it.



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 01:20 PM
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Originally posted by d3v
HERE

I'm wondering if this is true.


No.

For more accurate histories of the Illuminati, see freemasonry.bcy.ca...

and

www.newadvent.org...

The first link is to a Masonic site, the second to a Catholic encyclopedia. Since these two articles were written by people with opposing viewpoints, yet they agree on the basics, they should be considered generally unbiased.


[edit on 22-1-2005 by Masonic Light]


d3v

posted on Jan, 27 2005 @ 12:33 AM
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ok so it still states the Illuminati was formed in the late 1700's...

Who then, controlled the world before them???

Same group just differant name????????



posted on Jan, 27 2005 @ 01:57 AM
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has anyone read angels and demons by dan brown?

i know it is fiction and all, but how near to the truth is it about the illuminati being started off by galileo and the like?



posted on Jan, 27 2005 @ 02:00 AM
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If nothing else should be obvious to a mason, its that there are more than 33 degrees of light to be received.



posted on Jan, 27 2005 @ 08:39 AM
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Originally posted by d3v
ok so if the illuminati have only been around since the late 1700,s, who controlled us throghot hostory#?

What control?



posted on Jan, 27 2005 @ 12:50 PM
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Originally posted by EvilSpallacus
has anyone read angels and demons by dan brown?

i know it is fiction and all, but how near to the truth is it about the illuminati being started off by galileo and the like?


Dan Brown made some very interesting connections, but from what I have been told by my relatives, who are decendants of Bavaria and are in the same bloodline as GW Bush (which makes me part of the bloodline because my Grandfather(Pritzl) who is from Bavaria and his ancestors are also from Bavaria are all related to the Bush family) that theory of Brown's is incorrect.

If you need proof of my bloodline goto www.pritzl.net... and scroll to the bottom where it gives you a link that shows Anton Pritzl was the Great-Great Grandfather of GW Bush, which is my 4th Great grandfather I believe. I dont know the whole history, but my Grandfather has informed me about a lot of things I dont feel I should mention here in detail because, for one people wouldnt believe it (which isnt a big deal really, because I didnt believe it at first myself) second it would take hours upon hours, and also he asked me not to share too much information with anyone out of the family because he swore to his Father he would keep it a secret. The reason he shared this info with me is because he knew how much of a HUGE interest I have for this certain subject.

I will just say this, all the hype about Weishaupt creating this organization is all false, not completly, but the basis of what they are trying to say is false. Adam didnt create the first organization that was like "The Illuminati", the Illuminati is a modern version of the acient Satanic cult that is now called The Illuminati, and many other names.

The Illuminati is very real, and what lies behind them is nothing but a cult of evil and it makes me sick to think Im related to some of these #ers, excuse my language but I get really heated when it comes to this subject.

Dont be mislead by the whole Weishaupt thing, he was just a patsy, if you will. Not a patsy all together, but generally speaking, thats what he was. The Bavarian Illuminati was created to control Europe, and then eventually control what would become the United States.

We are all being mislead, even in our own conspiracy theories that we think are correct. Most of the conspiracy has been thrown out into the open by this great organization, that controls just about everything that effects your daily life. Why would they do this? Because the real "lie" was exposed long long ago, but the masses couldnt get their hands on the info due to lack of communication and other factors. After the lie was exposed, this organization (Im not going to call them The Illuminati, because "they" work under various names) created a spin to what had been exposed, because they feared the real truth would open many eyes and they would be destroyed, but not if they spun it around enough.

The real knowledge is out there, but it will do us no good. "They" are so far into their plot that the only way we can destroy them is by destroying the Federal Reserve, The EU AND a Civil War on American soil must take place as well.

Understand this, America is what this WHOLE thing is about as of right now. Almost all the rest of the world is under "their" control, yes even China and Russia.

To give you small bit of insight, "they" have been in control since the brink of civilization, dating clear back to the Sumerians and Akkadians (The Akkadians were the first form an "Illuminati" type organization ran by the force of evil or Satan what ever you choose they are both the same. The Akkadians stole or "copied" the Sumerian way of living and have been using it against us since then, to complete their goal of a one world totalitarian state)

There is SOOOO much detail to what I have learned that I cannot even begin to explain it. As you can tell, I go off on different tangents everywhere in this post because there is soooooo much to it. SO MUCH its unbelievable really.

I will just say this. This whole thing, the whole NWO, Illuminati, totalitatian take over is all an act of what we know as "Satan." Thats right folks, Satan is very real. Satan waged this war against God from the beginning ( Hence the Akkadians) Dont be fooled, and dont be mislead. This whole thing is one giant Holy War. What Satan is trying to accomplish with this plan is nothing good. "He" wants The Rapture to take place so the Christians leave Earth, so "he" can rule the Earth after a 2000 (or longer, hopefully) year reign of Christ. So "he" can take the thrown of The United Nations and become a One World Dictator. But it wont happen yet, not for another couple decades, but after all the horrific events in the near future take place the gears will start turning faster than you can ever imagine. Your only way out of this one world dictatorship is through Christ.

Oh and let the flaming begin. I can already feel and hear what people are going to say in responce to this post. Lets here it!


Oh and if you have any questions, I might be able to answer them, just send me a U2U. I cant believe I finally cracked after all this time on these forums....



posted on Jan, 27 2005 @ 12:52 PM
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Originally posted by d3v
Who then, controlled the world before them???



Only God controls the world.

The real historical Illuminati did not "control the world". They weren't even able to establish a democratic government in Bavaria, which was their purpose for existing. They were infiltrated by the government's secret police and disbanded.



posted on Jan, 27 2005 @ 02:08 PM
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ok so if the illuminati have only been around since the late 1700,s, who controlled us throghot hostory#?


False. The Illuminati have existed since the 16th century. The lodges first appeared in Spain under the name of the "Alumbrados" (direct translation of Illuminati) and in France under the name "Illuminés". The Illuminés d'Avignon, in the 17th century were the most largerly know and most referred to in history books, aside from the Bavarian Illuminati. Many philosophers, writers and scientists were part of these lodges, although it is not proven if and how the Illuminati were influencing or controlling governments. The only reason why the Bavarian Illuminati are so much known is because their existence was not only uncovered but they were disbanded by the Bavarian.




Origins

Since Illuminati literally means 'enlightened ones' in Latin, it is natural that several unrelated historical groups have identified themselves as Illuminati. Often, this was due to claims of possessing gnostic texts or other arcane information not generally available.

The designation illuminati was also in use from the 15th century, assumed by enthusiasts of another type, who claimed that the illuminating light came, not by being communicated from an authoritative but secret source, but from within, the result of exalted consciousness, or "enlightenment".
[edit]

Alumbrados of Spain

To the former class belong the alumbrados of Spain. The historian Marcelino Menéndez Pelayo found the name as early as 1492 (in the form aluminados, 1498). but traced them to a Gnostic origin, and thought their views were promoted in Spain through influences from Italy. One of their earliest leaders, born in Salamanca, a labourer's daughter known as La Beata de Piedrahita, came under the notice of the Inquisition in 1511, as claiming to hold colloquies with Jesus and the Virgin Mary; some high patronage saved her from a rigorous denunciation. (Menéndez Pelayo, Los Heterodoxos Espanioles, 1881, vol. v.). Ignatius Loyola, while studying at Salamanca in 1527, was brought before an ecclesiastical commission on a charge of sympathy with the alumbrados, but escaped with an admonition. Others were not so fortunate. In 1529 a congregation of naïve adherents at Toledo was subjected to whippings and imprisonment. Greater rigors followed, and for about a century the alumbrados sent many victims to the Inquisition, especially at Cordoba.
[edit]

Illuminés of France

The movement (under the name of Illuminés) seems to have reached France from Seville in 1623, and attained some following in Picardy when joined (1634) by Pierce Guerin, curé of Saint-Georges de Roye, whose followers, known as Gurinets, were suppressed in 1635.

A century later, another, more obscure body of Illuminés came to light in the south of France in 1722, and appears to have lingered till 1794, having affinities with those known contemporaneously in Britain as 'French Prophets', an offshoot of the Camisards.


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Rosicrucians

A different class were the Rosicrucians, who claimed to originate in 1422, but rose into notice in 1537; a secret society, that claimed to combine with the mysteries of alchemy the possession of esoteric principles of religion. Their positions are embodied in three anonymous treatises of 1614, mentioned in Richard and Giraud, Dictionnaire universel des sciences ecclésiastiques. Paris 1825. Rosicrucians also claimed heritage from the Knights Templar and Priory of Sion.
[edit]

Martinists

Later, the title Illuminati was applied to the French Martinists which had been founded in 1754 by Martinez Pasqualis, and to their imitators the Russian Martinists, headed about 1790 by Professor Schwartz of Moscow; both were occultist cabalists and allegorists, absorbing eclectic ideas from Jakob Boehme and Emanuel Swedenborg.
[edit]

The Bavarian Illuminati
[edit]

History

A short-lived movement of republican freethinkers, the most radical offshoot of the Enlightenment, to whose adherents the name Illuminati was given, (but who called themselves "Perfectibilists"), was founded on May 1, 1776 by the ex-Jesuit Adam Weishaupt (d. 1830), professor of canon law, and Baron Adolph von Knigge, in Ingolstadt, Bavaria (now Germany). The group has also been called the Illuminati Order, the Order of the Illuminati, and the Bavarian Illuminati.

In the conservative state of Bavaria, where the progressive and enlightened elector Maximilian III Joseph von Wittelsbach was succeeded (1777) by his conservative heir Karl Theodor, and which was dominated by the Roman Catholic Church and the aristocracy, such an organization did not last long before it was suppressed by the powers that be. In 1784, the Bavarian government banned all secret societies including the Illuminati and the Freemasons. The structure of the Illuminati soon collapsed, but while it was in existence many influential intellectuals and progressive politicians counted themselves as members.

Its members, drawn primarily from Masons and former Masons, pledged obedience to their superiors, and were divided into three main classes: the first, known as the Nursery, encompassed the ascending degrees or offices of Preparation, Novice, Minerval and Illuminatus Minor; the second, known as the Masonry, consisting of the ascending degrees of Illuminatus Major and Illuminatus dirigens, the latter also sometimes called Scotch Knight; the third, designated the Mysteries, was subdivided into the degrees of the Lesser Mysteries (Presbyter and Regent) and those of the Greater Mysteries (Magus and Rex). Relations with masonic lodges were established at Munich and Freising in 1780.

The order had its branches in most countries of the European continent, but its total numbers never seem to have exceeded two thousand. The scheme had its attraction for literary men, such as Goethe and Herder, and even for the reigning dukes of Gotha and Weimar. Internal rupture preceded its downfall, which was effected by an edict of the Bavarian government in 1785.



en.wikipedia.org...

By the way, Masonic Light, I finally caught you with your pants down! By saying that God controls this world, you fail to provide any proofs of your claims, so they are as much invalid as saying that the world is controlled by a handful of elitist conspirators who are pulling the strings behind government's backs. Well actually, since history has proven that most of the time -at least since the time where means of production were privatized through the economical processes- states, nations and communities have been submitted to the tyranny of the few, the latter theory seems much more realistic than God controlling politics and the economy.
You use to be at least intelligent in your posts, please do not fall into magical explanations.



posted on Jan, 27 2005 @ 02:33 PM
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Originally posted by Echtelion

By the way, Masonic Light, I finally caught you with your pants down! By saying that God controls this world, you fail to provide any proofs of your claims...You use to be at least intelligent in your posts, please do not fall into magical explanations.


If by claiming that God controls the world makes me unintelligent, I am happy to rest in my ignorance.

"Except the Lord build the house, they labor in vain who build it."



posted on Jan, 27 2005 @ 03:14 PM
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Originally posted by Illuminous

Originally posted by EvilSpallacus
has anyone read angels and demons by dan brown?

i know it is fiction and all, but how near to the truth is it about the illuminati being started off by galileo and the like?




If you need proof of my bloodline goto www.pritzl.net... and scroll to the bottom where it gives you a link that shows Anton Pritzl was the Great-Great Grandfather of GW Bush, which is my 4th Great grandfather I believe. I dont know the whole history, but my Grandfather has informed me about a lot of things I dont feel I should mention here in detail because, for one people wouldnt believe it (which isnt a big deal really, because I didnt believe it at first myself) second it would take hours upon hours, and also he asked me not to share too much information with anyone out of the family because he swore to his Father he would keep it a secret. The reason he shared this info with me is because he knew how much of a HUGE interest I have for this certain subject.



I ahve some suspicions as to the things you are alluding to but will hold my breath and ask whether you will expand on what your grandfather told you. Knowledge shared is knowledge given and gained, knowledge held in secrecy is knowledge left to wither and die. Please share, I beg of you.



posted on Jan, 27 2005 @ 04:05 PM
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Don't take it like that, Masonic. Even as a Christian, I do not believe God is in direct control of the world... as He has let humans free to control their lives and destinies, but humans are inspired by the Lord -God made flesh- to do good and to build a better world with more justice (especially social justice), and it is only through this path that they aspire to the Kingdom and eternal life. But this world... this world is largely in the hands of a bunch of crooks, as it has been for thousands of years, and I have strong doubt that these crooks are both inspired by the Kingdom of Heaven and aspire to it. People like them are guided by earthly, material possessions, and yet enslaved by the illusion of property, so therefore they will go to the great void (the Abyss) exactly as do the lies that they are worshipping.

Believing in God does'nt make you unintelligent. It's believing that God is behing people such as George Bush that is downright stupid. But I'm sure you agree on that, though...



posted on Jan, 27 2005 @ 05:01 PM
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Originally posted by Echtelion
Believing in God does'nt make you unintelligent. It's believing that God is behing people such as George Bush that is downright stupid. But I'm sure you agree on that, though...


I would have to even disagree with that. Since you are a Christian, you are probably aware of Paul's Epistle to the Romans, wherein Chapter 9 he explains that that even the evils of Pharoah were appointed by God, and God made him to be wicked by hardening his heart for a purpose. This is why Christians historically have supported the notion of the "divine right of kings", out of the doctrine that no one does anything outside of God's will, and therefore all leaders, even evil ones, are appointed by God to some purpose. Whether or not this doctrine is actually correct is a different question altogether, but the fact that the doctrine is Christian is undeniable.

But to address your original assertion concerning leaders and crooks, I certainly agree that leaders are often crooked. But the thing that to me seems most important is that most crooked leaders are elected and supported by the masses. Your example of George Bush is a perfect one. George Bush doesn't control the world, but 53 million American voters apparently want him to....and I'm sure he'd like that, himself.

I don't waste everyone's time here in developing a long argument in favor of what it would take to remedy the evils in the world of government, but it seems that the debate here is pointing to it, so I will at least briefly give my thoughts on the subject. My viewpoint is strictly Platonic, and those interested in seeing the argument fully worked out are directed to Plato's "Republic".

According to Plato, the fundamental flaw in political government, especially in democracies, is not a crooked government and a good population. Rather, the citizenship is likely to be just as crooked as its government, and such crookedness often comes from ignorance instead of the actual desire to do evil. For example, according to a recent poll, over half of all Americans still believe that the war in Iraq has something to do with 9/11, a perfect example of public ignorance.

And surely, if a population is ignorant of the basic facts, they are in no position to decide who should rule. If they do not know what's going on around them, they cannot make an intelligent decision.

In the "Republic", Plato begins by seeking an understanding of what Justice actually means, and while trying the solve the problem, he founds an imaginary state which will be perfectly good. During the course of the argument, he discovers that corrupt leaders are a symptom of the corruption of the soul, and explores how to remedy this. According to Plato's argument, there is only one real remedy, and any government who does not adopt his platform cannot be good.

Plato shows that the ideal state consists of three classes, viz., Guardians, Auxiliaries, and Craftsmen. The Craftsmen are cobblers, farmers, builders, etc., who do nothing but the work that they are by nature designed to do. The Auxiliaries are both the army and the police force. They are trained from infancy in poetry and music for the soul, philosophy for the mind, and rigid physical training for the development of the spirit. They are continuously tested and tempted in their youth with what Plato calls "magic", meaning pleasure and fear, to see if they will be true to their training, or if they are weak enough to succumb to temptation. If they succumb, they must become Craftsmen; but if it is in their nature to persevere through virtue, they become Auxiliaries.

Finally, the greatest and most virtuous of the Auxiliaries may become Guardians, the old and wise class who rules. Through a lifetime of virtue, courage, and moderation, they have proven that their decisions will always be based upon Justice, and therefore fit to rule. These are what Plato descibes as the "Philosopher Kings", who will rule entirely for the benefit of the Republic, instead of themselves. The Guardians and Auxiliaries are forbidden to amass property or even to touch gold; Plato informs us that to even touch gold would contaminate the innate gold that lines their souls, which are pure. These rulers, who have been trained, conditioned, and tested since infancy to be rulers, can be the only Good Rulers there are; all other rulers, according to Plato's argument, are of their very nature corrupt.

And, just as interestingly, Plato lays out a very interesting argument that most corrupt leaders of all are those who seek political office in democracies. This is because, according to Plato, democracy offers power to those who bewitch the public into supporting them, while a truly good and virtuous man would disdain such things. Therefore, the Good must be compelled to rule over their moral inferiors, the process of which was briefly explained above.

Many have criticized Plato for his anti-democratic viewpoints. The Guardians are, after all, dictators. But these are so-called "beneficent dictators", who understand that their citizens are children. Therefore, the Guardian does not see his relationship to citizen as dictator - subject, but as parent- child. He rules over them for their own good. Otherwise, they'd be doing silly, childish stuff like invading other countries in a search for make-believe weapons of mass destruction.



posted on Jan, 27 2005 @ 08:37 PM
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So a good dictator wouldn't do "silly, childish stuff like invading other countries in a search for make-believe weapons of mass destruction"?

It just shows people shouldn't vote for a leader, they should vote whether the army should get a budget or not. I mean, didn't they buy guns the previous year?

Masonic Light, when you say the word PROFANE it sounds like your talking about your parent/child relationship.



posted on Jan, 27 2005 @ 09:00 PM
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Im actually going to have to agree with Masonic light on this one. God Is In Control of the world, no matter what man chooses for himself, God will make it to his ends.

Pro 16:9 A man's heart deviseth his way: but the LORD directeth his steps. (free will and determination)

also job 34, and psalms 2 are good.

as far as the divine right of kings, its funny that the theory ended when bibles started to get printed in english (or the reformation and enlightenment periods, either or)



posted on Jan, 27 2005 @ 09:15 PM
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Masonic, I'd really enjoy to pursue a debate with you on the legitimacy of the actual US government and how tens of millions of votes have been lost into a fraudulent eVoting system (there are many good threads about that on ATS, if you mind reading them, and I also suggest a look at the blackboxvoting website), but since the thread started by d3v was about the real history of the Illuminati, I don't wanna keep on departing from the original topic any further. As far as you have read and paid attention to what I wrote in my posts, there is no reason for any debate. Just wanted to clarify my views, that's all.

I've been fed through all of my college and university years with Plato's horribly idealistic, inhuman philosophy and moreover with its fascistic Republic utopia, so thank you, honestly, for your time introducing me on Plato's Republic, but I don't really need it. To be short, my critical views of Plato are largely inspired by Nietszche's and Marx's respective critics of Plato's philosophy. I know that freemasonry is largely influenced into its values, dogmas and views on society by Plato's Republic, and this influence can easily be seen into "Morals and Dogma" by Albert Pike, and this may be the reason why our education system here has so much given emphasis on Plato rather than other prolific philosophers that have brought immense contributions to morals and political ethics such as Aristote, Epicurus, Zarathustra, Marx or Prudhon, as many high-raking Masons are involved into high positions within the government so the rest of the population, especially in the case of education, have to endure their views on how the public should be properly educated on a moral level. Plato's ideology is an ideology of conformism and oligarchy, not of liberation and living in society in respect to other's weaknesses or differences.

peace.




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