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We Stopped Beleiving In Witches, When's The Bibles Turn?

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posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 03:21 PM
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Originally posted by wang
I see hoenstly what you are trying to get at, and i agree with you 100 percent. But its not as easy as u make it out to be, the sad thing is that christianity and islam are both growing.....
Now i wont slag on anyone religion, but religion is out of date. The christian church use to teach people that the sky was like a dome, and the stars were hanging off the roof, this is the only way they could explain the sky, and as we now know that is a ridiculous teaching. Christianity has always played on the "how can u be sure?" arguement, always playing on peoples ignorance. In todays modern world with science explaining the universe and the world, christianity is now playing on what we dont know again, anything we cant explain is the work of god. Yes its a very frustrating point trying to persuade a fanatic christian that maybe just maybe their god acturly didnt do anything. Anywho the only way i can see religion dieing out is when a theory of mine comes in to place.
Now any person with a logical and fair mind can see the merit of my theory.
I think that religion should be absolutely illegal to anyway under 18, and only scientfic theories should be teached to them, and if they ask how the world was created, they are told what we do know through science and if they ask somethign that cant be explain they get the simply reply of "we dont know how or why" then when the reach the age of 18, which is considerd in most places the age when a child becomes a adult, they are given every religious text they want. The bible, koran, torah, kabbala, the satanic bible, hindu texts, buddism texts, etc etc. Then at this age where there mind are not impressionable and they can make a decision for themselves on what they believe, not what is pushed into their brains at a young age. So if all of these religions really are so enlighten, and so "right" then this person who has no initial contact with any belief of any sort can decide for themselves what to believe.
If this could be applied to every newborn on this planet from today, i gurantee that all organised religions will become little cults. The one god figure that has been worshiped for so long will become like the paegen gods. This is the day that humanity will take its next step in evolution and that all citizens on this planet will open their minds to new things they never thought was concievable, and they world will see a new age of knowledge. This will become the humanity golden age.
Yet with people like GW in charge of the most powerful country in the world....doesnt look like the golden age is comming anytime to soon.....even though it is my one wish to break the chains on humanity from religion, just wish it would be in my life time.



So, what you are essentially saying is teach the kid to be an aethiest in their youth when they are impressionable, and then say oh yeah there may be other truths out there when they are an adult... wow, way to make religion unbiased. WORST IDEA EVER! The only fair way to do any of it, is to either teach them all the concepts of every religion including aethism, without bias, or to not teach them anything, and that includes Science.

To whom ever said Jesus is a fairy-tail like King Arthur, maybe you should do a little more research. It turns out that there were over 100 first hand accounts of him being alive, and his miracles, in the form of Gospels. Also, doesn't it say something to you that both Judaism, and Islam believe the guy existed? There is no doubt that he existed, you are just taking the easy way out by putting blinders on and saying if i can't see it, it must not be true. Oh yeah, and btw... no one is fully certain yet that King Arthur never existed! Granted it's very unlikely, but still, tiny itsy bitsy chance he may have existed, of course the legends would be Excalibur and such, but beyond that, this isn't about him. Jesus did exist. The question now becomes why should you NOT believe in either the Christian, Muslim, or Judiasm God?




posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 03:34 PM
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Do not teach the child to be an athiest, Do not teach the child anything, let them come to you and ask you questions and let them choose what THEY want to beleive, not what YOU want them to beleive.

Prove to me that jesus existed. Gospels...
...written by people who beleived he existed. First hand accounts, first hand accounts 2000 years ago. Have you ever played that whispering game? Exactly. Maybe jesus was actually named Jeff, and he wasnt a messiah he was a massuse, oh and you better beleive he performed miracles. he could get the knot out of any muscle.

Religion is about selfishness, not nessicarily individual selfishness, but overall. Mankind thinking he is some special little creation and when its all over, we get to sit at the feet of an all powerful god, and he loves us and blah blah blah.

So just because a book says he existed means he did? It is a book, just because it uses names and places of real, doesn't mean it is fact. Who knows, in 10,000 years someone might find "snow white: and the seven dwarves" and interpret it as a goddess and the dwarves are dieties.

Worship this Goddess of thine Midgets!!


[edit on 22-1-2005 by _BLiND_]



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 03:45 PM
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Originally posted by _BLiND_
Do not teach the child to be an athiest, Do not teach the child anything, let them come to you and ask you questions and let them choose what THEY want to beleive, not what YOU want them to beleive.

Prove to me that jesus existed. Gospels...
...written by people who beleive he existed. Religion is about selfishness, not nessicarily individual selfishness, but overall. Mankind thinking he is some special little creation and when its all over, we get to sit at the feet of an all powerful god, and he loves us and blah blah blah.

So just because a book says he existed means he did? It is a book, just because it uses names and places of real, doesn't mean it is fact. Who knows, in 10,000 years someone might find "snow white: and hte seven dwarves" and interpret it as a goddess and the dwarves are dieties.


[edit on 22-1-2005 by _BLiND_]


So, do you not believe Julius Ceaser existed? Do you not believe George Washington existed? There is just as much evidence for their existance and Jesus when it really comes down to it. These weren't people who believed he existed, these were people who had first-hand accounts with him. Do you get that? First-hand accounts means they spoke to him, they saw him, they didn't believe he existed. I dont believe you existed, and i'm not sure if this can be considered a first hand account.

I am also sure that there are more books written about Jesus, and more paintings of Jesus than there are of George Washington and Julius Ceaser combined.



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 03:51 PM
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Julius Ceasar is documented history, the bible is not historical fact although many people would want it to be.

The only shred of proof was the .....Sorry I forget what the burial cloth was called, but that is the only actual proof, and if I am right it was proven to be alot younger then 2000 yrs.

And paintings? Of who? A WHITE JESUS. In all seriousness. Jesus would not be caucasion. So I guess there must be a couple of them right? ......

I could paint a purple goblin, a couple million times, does that make him real?

[Edit: Re-arranged]

[edit on 22-1-2005 by _BLiND_]



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 03:59 PM
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i know those aren't accurate portraits, im providing you with examples of why your thinking is flawed. Again, we will never get over this one point, but here it goes, over 100 first hand accounts of Jesus written down and submitted.

Jesus not existing is arrogance, he did exist, that shouldn't be the arguement. It's called the Shroud of Turin, and there is a lot more controversy over it than you think. They took corners from part of the shroud that had been restored, and that is why it was dated incorrectly.



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 04:08 PM
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Actually I knew it was called the Shroud of Turin, I just didn't want to look TOO much like an idiot, if I was wrong.

They took peices of the corners? ... I didn't know there was blood on the corners. They took samples of bloody cloth as wel, atleast I thought. Why in the hell would you restore such a religious artifact?

How is my thinking flawed? You beleive in Christ, Therefore you have the flawed thoughts. You beleive in an ancient super hero..... Sorry to snap back, but you should not insult someone else for beleiving that there never was a Jesus. (even though it was a minor "zing")

If jesus existed, you would think there would be 1 unified religion. I mean your talking about jesus here, the son of the all-mighty. If he was the son of the all-mighty, then how come his predictions were wrong? Did he not say that the world was going to end in HIS generation...I dont know about predictions and how accurate they have to be...but going on 2000 yrs. He's a little off.



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 04:11 PM
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You know, if you were talking about any other religion, you would be considered a bigot. You would be considered intolerant. But since it is Christianity it is just showing how much smarter you are.



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 04:12 PM
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Originally posted by Ryanp5555
i know those aren't accurate portraits, im providing you with examples of why your thinking is flawed. Again, we will never get over this one point, but here it goes, over 100 first hand accounts of Jesus written down and submitted.



Over 100 first hand accounts, translated how many times.....?



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 04:14 PM
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Me considered a bigot? How am I being prejudice? I dont see it. Maybe I am stupid...but I dont see it...




PS ~ Why not lick envelopes after eating chocolate?
WILL I DIE?! just kidden.



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 04:17 PM
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You won't die, but your envelopes where you seal them look pretty nasty


I just find it so ironic that many people are so up in arms if anyone says anything that is remotely "intolerant" about religion, race, IQ, you name it. Although Christianity seem fair game.



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 04:22 PM
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Originally posted by _BLiND_
Actually I knew it was called the Shroud of Turin, I just didn't want to look TOO much like an idiot, if I was wrong.

They took peices of the corners? ... I didn't know there was blood on the corners. They took samples of bloody cloth as wel, atleast I thought. Why in the hell would you restore such a religious artifact?

How is my thinking flawed? You beleive in Christ, Therefore you have the flawed thoughts. You beleive in an ancient super hero..... Sorry to snap back, but you should not insult someone else for beleiving that there never was a Jesus. (even though it was a minor "zing")

If jesus existed, you would think there would be 1 unified religion. I mean your talking about jesus here, the son of the all-mighty. If he was the son of the all-mighty, then how come his predictions were wrong? Did he not say that the world was going to end in HIS generation...I dont know about predictions and how accurate they have to be...but going on 2000 yrs. He's a little off.


okay, let me repeat what i said before, Islam, Christianity, and Judaism ALL believe he existed. Islam believes he is the Messiah sent to us as promised, just he isn't God but more of a messenger from heaven, and he will come down and defeat the devil as well. Right there you have around 4.5 billion of the 6 billion people in the world believing that Jesus existed, and 3.9 billion believing that Jesus was the Messiah. Those are some pretty large volumes of numbers. And what does translation of those 100 first hand accounts have to do with anything? There still were first hand accounts of him existing. I'm not insulting you because of your beliefs in terms of religion, I'm insulting you because you are lacking the basic concept that this guy did exist, whether it was how i believe he existed or not, he still existed. And that is why i brought up George Washington and Julius Ceaser, it would be like saying those guys didn't exist either, when we all know they did, and that would just be someone trying to take the easy road of it all.



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 04:29 PM
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...... And where did you get these numbers of the global population and there religious beleifs?

I'm sorry but You cannot compare Jesus to Julius. One is FACT the other is a form of mass beleif therefore it turns into fact, So back in the day when everyone thought the world was flat, did that make it flat? No.

I'll beleive you when you dig up some birth certificates.


RYAN - Maybe you are lacking the mental capacity to realize that this man never existed and your faith if a faith built upon lies and stories? No offence, but honestly.

[edit on 22-1-2005 by _BLiND_]



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 04:36 PM
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I am surprised you are disputing he existed. Many dispute he is the son of God incarnate. That isn't surprising. To doubt that he ever was, just doesn't make sense.

Don't forget the Jews also believe he was a real person, just not the messiah



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 04:37 PM
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I must agree that religions are only fantasy. It exist for one ting; control.
It is the same with words like 'shame' and 'honor' and others that have no other purpose than to control other people.

Christian belive; The pope and roman rulers created this religion together. Jesu did NOT create this religion. It was the popes consils that made it between the years 350 and 500 the way we have it today. Remove these and you'll find haw christianity was at first.

Judes; tribal myths from Saudi-Arabia mixed with misunderstood technology from alien visitors, and some thousand years of forgetfulness as noone know the origin of much of the tales... And Jesu were one; he followed a philosophy that had existed for about 500 years when he lived. One of the Qumran sects. Wich means, once one remove the popes councils from christianity one is left with judic traditions 2500 years old.

Islam; mix of judic, christian and arabic tribe religions mixed and shaken until an insane mix appear. Their funder was a madman, or so they say. The arabs say that children and madmen tell the truth. Dismissed.

Hindu; misunderstood technology and myths mixed in and later forgotten much.

Witches and druids of today is much changed from ancient times. In those days they belived in one god, the Sungod, and one goddess, the Moon goddess. In those days the names were description of the gods and thus what apears to be different names and thus different gods to us were actually the same One god. Magyar, Summeria and Egypt did worship one and the same god... look after the sun symbol above the heads of the drawnings of pharaoes and statues, it show they worshipped the same One sungod. It was still just a nature-religion, no different than worshipping a tree or an animal.

There is one thing in common. None of them tell the truth. It is not in their interest to tell the truth. Priests will never do that. Priests exist to keep you in line and follow the accepted belife in your area.
Priests who do follow the truth and not the former belife will be considered a fallen, an evil or otherwise harassed or killed. Because if the truth ever get a foothold on people they will leave the religion, making the men in power powerless. Self-interest....



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 04:39 PM
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I said that my numbers were a little off as i was using one that was out-dated, these numbers are from 2002. Birth certificates can easily be manufactured, but that really isn't the point, i dont know why i brought that up. And I can comprehend someone not existing, if they DIDNT exist, but you see he DID, so your right, i can't comprehend someone existing and not existing at the same time.


Christianity: 2 billion

Islam: 1.3 billion

Hinduism: 900 million

Secular/Nonreligious/Agnostic/Atheist: 850 million

Buddhism: 360 million

Chinese traditional religion: 225 million

primal-indigenous: 150 million

African Traditional & Diasporic: 95 million

Sikhism: 23 million

Juche: 19 million

Spiritism: 14 million

Judaism: 14 million

Baha'i: 6 million

Jainism: 4 million

Shinto: 4 million

Cao Dai: 3 million

Tenrikyo: 2.4 million

Neo-Paganism: 1 million

Unitarian-Universalism: 800 thousand

Rastafarianism: 700 thousand

Scientology: 600 thousand

Zoroastrianism: 150 thousand








EDIT... www.adherents.com...
EDIT... When i edited it the first time it deleted my post.
[edit on 22-1-2005 by Ryanp5555]

[edit on 22-1-2005 by Ryanp5555]



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 04:39 PM
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I dont know how this ended up being about Jesus, I was orginally just stating the fact, that the bible/ all religion is just a really really out of date scientific theory on what, when, why, and how.

Couldn't figure it out. Must have been a god.
Poor logic.

Ghaele
The church is just a very old business. Scare tactics abound.

[edit on 22-1-2005 by _BLiND_]



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 04:55 PM
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just letting you know that when i wrote my last responce i forgot to cite the source, then i cited it and the rest of my post got deleted. So i had to go back and retype the rest of my post again....



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 05:33 PM
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Originally posted by llpoolej

We are certainly not above the ten commandments(for anyone, they are a good set of life rules! No matter what you believe) OBVIOUSLY we do not know right from wrong. Ever watch the news?? Murders, war, cruelty and abuse are rampant.

Could you imagine if all followed the goldern rule?? Do unto others as you would have done to you? There is the solution to war and every other evil right there!

We are not that advanced. We have not grown above religion. I think most religions do have a set of codes very similar to the 10 commandments and the golden rule
Guess what would happen If everyone stopped using condoms, no more illness, no murders, wars etc blahblahblah,


population bottleneck, resource shortage, we would crowd ourselved to death, try opening your mind for a change



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 05:36 PM
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Hmmm, witches do exist though, as LadyV has stated. But yes, the whole black cat and pointy hat is a myth, but witches did and do exist. The first doctor/pharmacist/shrink were witches. Today we use fancy names like vioxx or zenurithium or whatever for the stuff, but they had foxglove, certain berries, so forth. The spell casting, well, "black" magic was a myth, at least not witchcraft, that would be the satanists.



posted on Jan, 22 2005 @ 05:52 PM
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Yeah witches did exist, but like we agree its not the hallowe'en commercialzed version.

But my reference to witches was to the salem witch hunt, where they had no idea what was going on so they just blamed it on witchcraft. It is nothing to do with witchcraft itself, just the idea of putting some obscene reasoning to something that they didn't understand.



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