Believe What You Want To Believe

There comes a point where you feel you have exhausted your capabilities to encourage others to think critically about the world around them. It's not about getting them to discard their own beliefs and adopt yours; rather, it's about encouraging them to analyse their current belief system and learn to broaden the scope of the way they think.

To be more open-minded and reflective. To be able to analyse an idea without making a moral pledge to suppress its discussion or blindly accept it as being truthful or correct.

It is common on ATS to find passionate discussions on various issues. Members will spend a lot of their free time attempting to convince others that the other person's views are flawed or inaccurate, and that their own views should be adopted.

They will state facts, raise logical and reasonable arguments and make persuasive analogies. But what does it take to really change somebody's mind?

A great deal, much more fortitude than the average person possesses. We all like to think our worldview is correct, free from the taint that plagues other people, whom have been brainwashed or moulded into upholding their current belief system.

No, we are right and others are wrong. Let's spend our time trying to convince the others that they are wrong and we are right. Push them to see the light of day. Make them understand that their views are corrupted and not trustworthy.

What is it that compels us to convince others they are wrong and we are right? The ego? Pride? Vanity? Maybe it's a deep-seated realisation that we do not have true faith in the authenticity of our own worldview, and we need to reaffirm that others do not as well.

Well, whatever it is you can count me out. I have lost the motivation to take part in the game any longer. If you simply use ATS as a vehicle to confirm your own preconceived notions and want an audience for acknowledgement, knock yourself out. You can bask in your own narrow-mindedness and rigid belief system for as long as you like.

There will come a time when we are all exposed to the truth in all its glory, and we will reluctantly admit just how wrong we were. Until that day comes, divided we remain.

a reply to: Dark Ghost


Wisdom is impossible to convey once a mind walls itself in with cognitive dissidence via its own self-perceived superiority. Add direct and dedicated efforts of government and largely controlled sciences and industry and you have the perfect storm against forward thinking by puny individuals that attempt to show what the whole system is corrupt. --How can YOU be right when everything else and everyone else thinks differently?

a reply to: Dark Ghost

It all depends on how much one is willing to swallow pride, we all have perception but we cannot show others what we see. We can only describe it to them.

I could study advanced architecture for 15 years and then I'd be an authority on telling people how a building is built but 25 years later nearly everything I thought I knew could be highly outdated. Knowledge is a beautiful thing but it's highly subject to change.

In the grand scheme of things we know nothing and knew nothing, we should be more willing to give and receive knowledge lest our pride and ego get in the way.

a reply to: Dark Ghost

Many times in an argument I will suddenly go silent.

My opponent often thinks that's because he won the argument. In truth I simply let him keep on believing whatever he/she wants to believe. I'll use my time and arguments with a more logical opponent.

Another thing that is lacking is manners. Einstein used to argue with Bohr yet the two were friends. They could express their views, push new ideas, yet smoke a pipe during that time and laugh and stuff.

Nowadays everyone is a cross between a missionary and a Dalek.

a reply to: swanne

Nowadays everyone is a cross between a missionary and a Dalek.

Then interaction becomes pointless

I have an issue articulating what I mean at times but I totally agree with you. Especially on the internet it's considered a personal attack if someone disagrees with you or god forbid you disagree with someone else then out come all the ad hominem attacks.

a reply to: RAY1990

That's kind of why I was motivated to create the Stall.

I am sure there are still people like you and me out there. Not many, sure, but quite a few indeed.

I've said for years now, I can count the number of times I've actually witnessed anyone change their mind on the internet on one hand. I've never had any desire to persuade anyone to change their thinking to my own to begin with, but it seems many people want to "win."

My feeling is that I ultimately know very little, if anything, in the grand scheme of things. All I have are beliefs, and perceptions of what we like to call knowledge but that still fall prey to varying degrees to some measure of subjectivity and bias, no matter how objective we try to be.

I respect everyone's beliefs, whether I agree with them or not, wish everyone well, and seek only the same consideration in return.

Peace.

a reply to: Dark Ghost

I actually know I am wrong.

I know this because I have changed and shifted my beliefs about all sorts of issues over the years and I have no doubt that I will continue to do so. The thing is that I don't have to know what is right because I don't make any effort to control or have power over others.

Basically, we are all wrong so it really doesn't matter as long as we don't force our crap on to others (like running for President and forcing everyone to have Obamacare for example).

Be where you are at and try to find some happiness in this world.

The problem is that there are so many people popping up with "I am a whistle-blower and I work at such a place, we do this and we do that" but never provide any valid proof, and just disappear. However believable their story is, I will keep an open mind... However some peoples beliefs on this forum are so strong, that they will not believe anything else. A bit like religious beliefs really

a reply to: Dark Ghost

Good post, and good follow up posts too, I fully agree with much of the sentiments expressed, the ego does get in the way, that's why it's best to recognize it for what it is. It's not just on this forum but in life in general in the day to day interactions between people.
If someones belief system is in our opinion messed up though, I think it is right we question it, though on the one hand I wouldn't bother because I know you will hardly be thanked! But what I'm wary of is when that belief system possibly extends to group think, and because you don't want any part of it, then you will be burned at the stake kind of scenario. Now that's when belief systems get scary...

I think it's important to question and debate others beliefs and even more so our own from time to time.
Especially here, the ATS motto is deny ignorance after all.