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Trump goes left, new childcare subsidies

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posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:01 PM
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I think the need for this type of subsidy is just a symptom of larger structural economic problems. It is become nearly impossible for low and middle income families to raise a family on one income so women have to work. Personally, I don't think this is healthy for society overall.

I support encouraging companies to offer attractive benefits, but I don't think they should be government mandated.




posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:04 PM
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a reply to: LSU0408


I've got my own kids and family to care for.


That's another part of the real issue. You feel as though you truly need everything you can get to survive, and maybe you do. That is not the way things were back before entitlements went out of control. Back then we didn't have all the luxuries we have today, and we had a different attitude towards what we needed versus what we wanted. We also gave more, even when it meant giving up some of those wants. It was just considered the right thing to do.

Today we are caught in a vicious spiral. We have combined needs and wants to the point that we need TV, we need evenings out, we need the latest cell phone, we need high-speed Internet. And to get them, we need more money. To get more money we need more things so we can network, make good impressions, etc. All of those things (except the TV, which was black-and-white with two and a half channels) are things that didn't exist for families back then. If we got to eat out, it was a treat, not something we felt we 'deserved.' If we had TV, it was a luxury.

I'm not saying these things are bad, just that they are not what life is all about. Personally, I think they are an attempt to fill a void inside us left by our expanding isolation from others. We are more in touch with others today through communication, but less involved with others than ever before. Sometimes just sitting around a bonfire drinking a beer and shooting the bull about life in general is better than sending a text or email.

And sometimes just turning off the damn computer devices and playing a board game or reading a book is a good thing too.

TheRedneck



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:06 PM
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a reply to: DBCowboy

Yeah, I'm not fond of this. I'd rather we find a way to prosper such that families only need one income again.



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:09 PM
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a reply to: DBCowboy

You don't want single parents to sit at home and leach off the sytem, don't want them to abort their babies, don't want them to neglect their babies. What would you have them do to better themselves? Take their kids to work with them every day? Or do you think they're fine where they are now?



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:11 PM
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originally posted by: intrepid
a reply to: LSU0408

As society has changed, the economy stalled, etc and you are trying to equate the nuclear family of yesterday to today's situations? Good luck with THAT baloney.



One thing is certain, it's much better than telling you that you were responsible for everyone else as soon as you were born.



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:11 PM
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originally posted by: neveroddoreven99
a reply to: DBCowboy

You don't want single parents to sit at home and leach off the sytem, don't want them to abort their babies, don't want them to neglect their babies. What would you have them do to better themselves? Take their kids to work with them every day? Or do you think they're fine where they are now?



How about not have put themselves into that position in the first place?

This is the trouble with today's instant gratification mentality. Even with the safest sex, you can still get pregnant.

Not to mention, most of today's entitlements do not come with any stipulations that someone "better themselves" ... whenever that is tried, it is called cruel and slavery, so the programs amount to simple handouts.



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:13 PM
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originally posted by: LSU0408

originally posted by: intrepid
a reply to: LSU0408

What makes you think that they want to be single mothers? Dudes leave. Even MARRIED dudes leave. Not the woman's fault.



Where, exactly does this become my problem?


Ever see what those babies that grow up without parents or security become?

Living in the USA is a team sport...And the rest of the world gets more competitive each year...We all benefit from strong players..That means reasonable chance at food, love and security or a normal childhood whenever possible....that also means we don't economically punish moms for being moms or families for being families.

I admit it's a long-term good...but looking at strong emerging countries, they take care of their moms. Third world nations? not so much.



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:16 PM
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originally posted by: ketsuko


How about not have put themselves into that position in the first place?



And how do we do that? Forced sterilization? Chastity belts? Who gets to decide this? The government?



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:16 PM
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originally posted by: neveroddoreven99
a reply to: DBCowboy

You don't want single parents to sit at home and leach off the sytem, don't want them to abort their babies, don't want them to neglect their babies. What would you have them do to better themselves? Take their kids to work with them every day? Or do you think they're fine where they are now?



I don't care what they do. Why should I have to pay for continued and ever-growing social programs?



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:17 PM
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originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: LSU0408


I've got my own kids and family to care for.


That's another part of the real issue. You feel as though you truly need everything you can get to survive, and maybe you do. That is not the way things were back before entitlements went out of control. Back then we didn't have all the luxuries we have today, and we had a different attitude towards what we needed versus what we wanted. We also gave more, even when it meant giving up some of those wants. It was just considered the right thing to do.

Today we are caught in a vicious spiral. We have combined needs and wants to the point that we need TV, we need evenings out, we need the latest cell phone, we need high-speed Internet. And to get them, we need more money. To get more money we need more things so we can network, make good impressions, etc. All of those things (except the TV, which was black-and-white with two and a half channels) are things that didn't exist for families back then. If we got to eat out, it was a treat, not something we felt we 'deserved.' If we had TV, it was a luxury.

I'm not saying these things are bad, just that they are not what life is all about. Personally, I think they are an attempt to fill a void inside us left by our expanding isolation from others. We are more in touch with others today through communication, but less involved with others than ever before. Sometimes just sitting around a bonfire drinking a beer and shooting the bull about life in general is better than sending a text or email.

And sometimes just turning off the damn computer devices and playing a board game or reading a book is a good thing too.

TheRedneck


I agree 100%. We spend many of nights putting jigsaw puzzles together. When I was a kid in the 80's, I was never inside unless the weather was bad or it was too cold to stay outside. Then I was tying strings across my room so my Ninja Turtles could zipline down them and smack other toys I had. We were just over the threshold of being a middle class family and that was enough.



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:19 PM
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a reply to: LSU0408

Three of the most powerful words I have ever heard: "it is enough."


Food for thought right there....

TheRedneck



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:20 PM
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originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: neveroddoreven99
a reply to: DBCowboy

You don't want single parents to sit at home and leach off the sytem, don't want them to abort their babies, don't want them to neglect their babies. What would you have them do to better themselves? Take their kids to work with them every day? Or do you think they're fine where they are now?



How about not have put themselves into that position in the first place?

This is the trouble with today's instant gratification mentality. Even with the safest sex, you can still get pregnant.

Not to mention, most of today's entitlements do not come with any stipulations that someone "better themselves" ... whenever that is tried, it is called cruel and slavery, so the programs amount to simple handouts.


Those of us who can think more than two moves on the chess board are constantly having to pay for the "mistakes" of others. I hate to sound callous, but as someone else said, I have my own family to support and worry about.

I don't mind charity, but government continuing to take my hard earned money at gun point has to stop.
edit on 14-9-2016 by Edumakated because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:22 PM
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a reply to: Edumakated

So.. abortions are okay, if the person can't handle the responsibility. I agree.



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:23 PM
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originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: LSU0408

originally posted by: intrepid
a reply to: LSU0408

What makes you think that they want to be single mothers? Dudes leave. Even MARRIED dudes leave. Not the woman's fault.



Where, exactly does this become my problem?


Ever see what those babies that grow up without parents or security become?

Living in the USA is a team sport...And the rest of the world gets more competitive each year...We all benefit from strong players..That means reasonable chance at food, love and security or a normal childhood whenever possible....that also means we don't economically punish moms for being moms or families for being families.

I admit it's a long-term good...but looking at strong emerging countries, they take care of their moms. Third world nations? not so much.


That's what family and friends are for... I remember, as a 6 year old child, a family that my parents would cook for, often. They lived about a mile away in a wooden shack made of plywood walls and was only one room. The dad got a job in the meantime and they ended up moving into a real house. That was the last I ever saw or heard from them. That's the way it was back then though. It's a lot easier to help someone when you're not being forced to do so.



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:24 PM
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originally posted by: kaylaluv

originally posted by: ketsuko


How about not have put themselves into that position in the first place?



And how do we do that? Forced sterilization? Chastity belts? Who gets to decide this? The government?


Self respect and self responsibility is a start.



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:27 PM
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a reply to: LSU0408

Sounds great. How do you make someone else have those two traits?



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:30 PM
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a reply to: kaylaluv

By making it easier than to not have them.

TheRedneck



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:30 PM
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originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: LSU0408

Sounds great. How do you make someone else have those two traits?


Teach them about consequences.



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:32 PM
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a reply to: TheRedneck

And how do we make it easier? And who makes it easier? The government? Us?



posted on Sep, 14 2016 @ 04:32 PM
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a reply to: LSU0408

So let children starve. That'll teach 'em.




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