Clinton team avoided ER to conceal details of her medical treatment

originally posted by: BrickNWall
I ask this question with 100% respect for both candidates:

Is it possible she has HIV/AIDs?

Would it be so hard to believe given Bill's known escapades with various women?

Just a thought my wife and I discussed earlier.

ETA: Does HIV/AIDS cause seizures and weaken the immune system for illnesses, such as pneumonia, to thrive in?

I don't think AIDS causes seizures, but given how many medications people who have it take, I imagine it could be a side effect of something. That said, I find it highly unlikely she has AIDS, first of all because we've gotten pretty good at treating it, and second of all because I don't think Bill/Hillary have that type of relationship, third because you would also be implying Bill has AIDS and he has given no indication of that.

originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: xstealth
a reply to: Gryphon66

In your professional medical opinion? You do realize that not every case of dehydration is identical? Or not?

She had a fever, she was sitting heavily clothed in the sun, she hasn't been resting following doctor's orders, her skin in multiple photographs looked drawn and thin, pale etc. etc.

You don't want the obvious facts to be true because it doesn't fit your theory. You're doing "science" in reverse.

You are also doing science in reverse.

While it can present similar to hypovolemia (basically bleeding out), dehydration is basically identical in all humans.

Dehydration

Patients who lose enough extracellular fluid (ECF) volume develop skin tenting (loss of skin elasticity), flat neck veins, and orthostatic or frank tachycardia and dizziness or fainting when standing up due to orthostatic hypotension, are often said to be dehydrated or dry. This is incorrect since these findings are not signs of dehydration and indicate ECF depletion, or hypovolemia for short.[8] The hallmarks of dehydration include thirst and neurological changes such as headaches, general discomfort, loss of appetite, decreased urine volume (unless polyuria is the cause of dehydration), confusion, unexplained tiredness, purple fingernails and even seizures. The symptoms of dehydration become increasingly severe with greater total body water loss. In people over age 50, the body’s thirst sensation diminishes and continues diminishing with age. Many senior citizens suffer symptoms of dehydration...

Basically no one gets so dehydrated that they faint out of nowhere with NO other signs or symptoms occurring. Clearly her security can't keep her hydrated on the assumption that she was suffering from dehydration (which they then changed to pneumonia...ummm, OK....). AND if she doesn't have the ability to keep herself hydrated, what makes you think she has the ability to run a country?

How do you know she had a fever? Did you take her temp? Or do you just believe everything you hear?

What exactly are the "obvious facts" that you speak of? The fact that almost every public slip up can correlate to Parkinson's?

What does it matter if Dr. Noel in the vids is on Trump's side? Based on what he said, he'd be a blithering idiot to side with Clinton and her lies!

I couldn't care for ANY political candidate and it is quite clear to me that Clinton is suffering from a major medical issue other than pneumonia or heat stroke/ exhaustion.

Again, I think Trump is just as much of an idiot as Clinton. But this medical issue is very hard to ignore. I have yet to see Trump have such medical episodes which would make one question his ability to make "good" decisions as POTUS. Now his intellect...I'm not so sure I could speak so well about...

originally posted by: Gazrok

what happens if she has an event in 18 months and isn't? Imagine the cover up then and the difficulties in removing her from office.

President Kaine....ugh....

This is something voters should FOCUS on. If the Clinton camp keeps up these medical lies, they are essentially electing Kaine for POTUS a the end of the day. She will NOT survive the Presidency if elected. However, she may just be rolled out for public appearances and the shadow government keeps the show going. I think any clear minded person can see democracy died long ago and the POTUS is nothing more than a puppet figurehead at this moment in time.

Indeed a president, Roosevelt, suffered from a debilitating ailment while in office. However his ailment was not linked to his neurological/cognitive health. Clinton's clearly is. The freezing and staring off into space cannot happen while dealing with stressful, global issues. A POTUS should be healthy...she is not healthy.

Personally I hope she comes clean. More so for the people of the US to be fully aware that she just simply is not physically fit for office.

Again, I don't think Trump is a better option. Quite honestly, i don't think modern politics is qualified to fix the issues of the 21st Century. I feel politics and thus government is fundamentally broken and fixing it should be the goal of every citizen on earth.

a reply to: Sparkymedic

We did have this happen at least once that we know of. The president you are looking for is Wilson. He suffered a debilitating stroke and his presidency was run by his secretary and his wife for the last two years with him basically being an impaired puppet who was more or less wheeled out for appearances as little as possible to keep up the charade.

If it's before the election, the DNC will tap Biden as the candidate, likely still keeping Kaine as VP.

Basically no one gets so dehydrated that they faint out of nowhere with NO other signs or symptoms occurring.

Heat exhaustion can cause it though. I know as I saw it happen to both my daughter and my wife on different occasions. (and it nearly happened to me once). In this case though, you're brought "back" as you hit the ground.

She just utterly collapsed...not fainted. And given the weather conditions, it's an unlikely conclusion. It was around 80 degrees and partly cloudy.

a reply to: Gazrok

Yeah, but her spell looked different than a heat exhaustion fainting unless she was so dehydrated that she suffered from total body cramps at the same time.

I've done both the heat exhaustion thing and the athletic level cramps thing. My experiences with both don't match what I saw.

It is possible that she has a condition that can be triggered by heat and lack of hydration. I know about that too, but again, you are now getting into the type of thing that her campaign would not want to discuss.

originally posted by: Sparkymedic
This is something voters should FOCUS on. If the Clinton camp keeps up these medical lies, they are essentially electing Kaine for POTUS a the end of the day. She will NOT survive the Presidency if elected.

Remember when they said McCain wouldn't live long enough to serve his term? He's still going strong.

a reply to: Aazadan

McCain also wasn't doing stuff like this during his campaign either. Their speculation was based solely on advanced age and male life expectancy and a previous diagnosis and treatment of melanoma.

a reply to: Sparkymedic

Interestingly nowhere in your Wikipedia source does it state that all occasions or conditions of dehydration are "basically the same." In fact, your source directly states OTHERWISE:

Some authors have reported three types of dehydration based on serum sodium levels: hypotonic or hyponatremic (referring to this as primarily a loss of electrolytes, sodium in particular), hypertonic or hypernatremic (referring to this as primarily a loss of water), and isotonic or isonatremic (referring to this as equal loss of water and electrolytes). Indeed, in humans, it has been commonly thought that the most commonly seen type of dehydration (by far) is isotonic (isonatraemic) dehydration.

And further, not only are there differing types of dehydration (according to your article) there are also differing levels of severity ...

For severe cases of dehydration where fainting, unconsciousness, or other severely inhibiting symptom is present (the patient is incapable of standing or thinking clearly), emergency attention is required.

You can claim I'm doing science backward ... but at least I'm not cherry-picking a source in a misleading fashion.

a reply to: Sparkymedic

As to your other silliness ...

She got dehydrated because she didn't listen to her doctor, she didn't rest, and she sat in the sun for an extended period and overheated.

No, I don't know she had a fever, and you don't know she didn't. She was treated with antibiotics for pneumonia which suggests either a bacteriological infection (fever) or a preventative measure.

However, fever does accelerate dehydration, which fits with what we saw, and what Clinton's doctor said.

The only comments verifying Parkinson's are from Infowars and a couple of "doctors" acting as right-wing shills. The deal on the "seizures and freezes" are misrepresented, and in some cases, have been tampered with.

No, there is no evidence that Hillary Clinton has Parkinson’s disease- ScienceBlog

Parkinson’s disease is indeed a serious, progressive, degenerative neurologic disease. Perhaps the best indication that Clinton almost certainly does not have Parkinson’s disease is how carefully Noel and the peddlers of this particular conspiracy theory had to cherry pick video of Clinton to find brief snippets that they could point to as Parkinson’s-associated tremors, “brain freeze,” and levodopa-induced dyskinesia. As Steve Novella, a board-certified neurologist, pointed out when I was on The Skeptics’ Guide to the Universe three weeks ago, the exaggerated startle response pointed to by Noel is not a Parkinsonian freeze, nor was it dystonia or a seizure. As Novella points out, Parkinson’s is an “across the room” diagnosis that is easy for a trained neurologist to recognize, particularly if it is advanced, which, remember, is what Noel is claiming.

a reply to: Gryphon66

Indeed, SOME medical authors have reported that there are three TYPES of dehydration. This does not indicate they present differently than the signs and symptoms which are listed. Dehydration of all types presents the same, although there may be different causes (types of dehydration) behind them. And indeed in severe cases syncope can occur. Which in that case I would be appalled that they would let her go 90 min later and NOT take her to a hospital, but instead to her daughters home if she was experiencing a severe case of dehydration.

Either way, they redacted it as the "cause" of whatever it was that Clinton experienced and jumped over to pneumonia as the excuse of her wobbly legs and quick dispersal from the event. Which is a decent cover to the unsuspecting public. Soooo...we both might as well drop the dehydration bit all together as it is no longer a point of contention.

No cherry picking was done. I simply presented what the signs and symptoms of dehydration are...which is all that anyone could observe. You clearly took it to mean something else. I hope this clears things up for you.

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Sparkymedic

As to your other silliness ...

She got dehydrated because she didn't listen to her doctor, she didn't rest, and she sat in the sun for an extended period and overheated.

No, I don't know she had a fever, and you don't know she didn't. She was treated with antibiotics for pneumonia which suggests either a bacteriological infection (fever) or a preventative measure.

However, fever does accelerate dehydration, which fits with what we saw, and what Clinton's doctor said.

The only comments verifying Parkinson's are from Infowars and a couple of "doctors" acting as right-wing shills. The deal on the "seizures and freezes" are misrepresented, and in some cases, have been tampered with.

No, there is no evidence that Hillary Clinton has Parkinson’s disease- ScienceBlog

Parkinson’s disease is indeed a serious, progressive, degenerative neurologic disease. Perhaps the best indication that Clinton almost certainly does not have Parkinson’s disease is how carefully Noel and the peddlers of this particular conspiracy theory had to cherry pick video of Clinton to find brief snippets that they could point to as Parkinson’s-associated tremors, “brain freeze,” and levodopa-induced dyskinesia. As Steve Novella, a board-certified neurologist, pointed out when I was on The Skeptics’ Guide to the Universe three weeks ago, the exaggerated startle response pointed to by Noel is not a Parkinsonian freeze, nor was it dystonia or a seizure. As Novella points out, Parkinson’s is an “across the room” diagnosis that is easy for a trained neurologist to recognize, particularly if it is advanced, which, remember, is what Noel is claiming.

You, I assume are NOT a doctor. I admit I am NOT a doctor, but a medically trained professional. I have not and will never make a diagnosis. We'll leave this at that.

I'll happily admit I do NOT know what is going on with her. Is there a chance she has PD? Sure! Is there a chance she doesn't have PD? Sure! Did your Blog reference rip apart every aspect of that Dr's video? No! Why not? I dunno...maybe they support Clinton as much as Dr. Noel supports Trump...

Basically no one knows whats going on with her, BUT we all know something is up...PD, pneumonia...dry throat...who knows...but she ain't healthy.

As much as I am speculating on PD, you are speculating just as much on your theories, which are reinforced by her supporters and the mainstream media, who are essentially out to put down Trump and anyone else (I'm not rooting for him or anyone else)...however your speculation fails to account for the MANY public snafus of hers which she has experienced before the 9/11 event. These snafus and moments of embarrassment to me appear as behaviors which are far outside the normal behavior of a healthy person.

Plus this is a conspiracy theory website...where speculation is basically rampant. So lets take all of this with a grain of salt.

Look, I'm not for or against her being POTUS. I have no hat in this game. I am simply pointing out what is becoming quite obvious to someone who has experience in the medical field, and I am sharing my opinion of that. To me, Clinton has serious medical issues which are being covered up by her campaign.

Indeed myself and others could be wrong about the PD...to be honest I hope I am. I hope she's healthy. I wish no sickness on anyone...but she ABSOLUTELY is not presenting as a healthy individual and the pneumonia excuse does not add up!

a reply to: Sparkymedic

No, dehydration of all types does not present the same ... that's not what your source says ... and if you'd gotten any further than Wikipedia in your search ... like say Mayo Clinic - Diseases and Conditions - Dehydration you would have found that there are at least two levels of dehydration noted with different symptomologies:

Mild to moderate dehydration is likely to cause:
Dry, sticky mouth
Sleepiness or tiredness — children are likely to be less active than usual
Thirst
Decreased urine output No wet diapers for three hours for infants
Few or no tears when crying
Dry skin Headache Constipation
Dizziness or lightheadedness

Severe dehydration, a medical emergency, can cause:
Extreme thirst
Extreme fussiness or sleepiness in infants and children; irritability and confusion in adults
Very dry mouth, skin and mucous membranes
Little or no urination — any urine that is produced will be darker than normal
Sunken eyes
Shriveled and dry skin that lacks elasticity and doesn't "bounce back" when pinched into a fold
In infants, sunken fontanels — the soft spots on the top of a baby's head
Low blood pressure
Rapid heartbeat
Rapid breathing
No tears when crying
Fever
In the most serious cases, delirium or unconsciousness

You can attempt to discredit the Mayo Clinic as a source if you'd like.

Of course you cherry picked the Wiki article. You quoted what you thought proved your claim that all dehydration is the same (it isn't) and further that all symptoms are the same (they aren't).

You didn't clear anything up because you're not doing anything here except quote mining to support your rather evident pre-existing belief that Hillary Clinton and her campaign are lying, regardless of your claims that you're non-partisan, etc. etc.

You've tipped your hand more than once.

a reply to: Sparkymedic

Right. You're a medic. It's right there in your ATS handle.

I am not "speculating on my theories" at all. I provided links which debunk every nonsensical garbage assertion made from Infowars and Youtube about Clinton having Parkinson's.

Oh, you're going to go with "snafus" now. Well, when you list some out rather than merely gesturing to them wildly, I'll be glad to address them in turn.

Sure, ATS is about conspiracies, but what has historically set us apart from the multitude of garbage sites on the internet (*cough* Infowars *cough*) is that we do our best to find as much FACTUAL information as possible and we cite our sources.

We "Deny Ignorance." We don't do that by justifying anything anybody may say that fits our preconceived notions and beliefs.

Pneumonia and a lack of rest (exhaustion), coupled with overheating by sitting fully clothed in the sun for an hour or so in heavy clothing and probably a k-vest certainly does explain every single thing we saw on Sunday ... her pale complexion, the drawn thin look of her face, a lack of puffiness, etc. She got dizzy and stumbled getting into the van.

She went to Chelsea's where she either sat and cooled off for a while with electrolyte replacing drinks, or maybe, there was a concierge doctor who attached her to a saline drip for a couple of hours.

When she walked out, she looked fresh and hale again. As folks do when they've just received fluids after being dehydrated.

I really don't care about anything except the facts. I'll be glad to look at those with you if you wish, but really, I'm not interested in much more unravelling of partisan rhetoric.

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Sparkymedic

No, dehydration of all types does not present the same ... that's not what your source says ... and if you'd gotten any further than Wikipedia in your search ... like say Mayo Clinic - Diseases and Conditions - Dehydration you would have found that there are at least two levels of dehydration noted with different symptomologies:

Mild to moderate dehydration is likely to cause:
Dry, sticky mouth
Sleepiness or tiredness — children are likely to be less active than usual
Thirst
Decreased urine output No wet diapers for three hours for infants
Few or no tears when crying
Dry skin Headache Constipation
Dizziness or lightheadedness

Severe dehydration, a medical emergency, can cause:
Extreme thirst
Extreme fussiness or sleepiness in infants and children; irritability and confusion in adults
Very dry mouth, skin and mucous membranes
Little or no urination — any urine that is produced will be darker than normal
Sunken eyes
Shriveled and dry skin that lacks elasticity and doesn't "bounce back" when pinched into a fold
In infants, sunken fontanels — the soft spots on the top of a baby's head
Low blood pressure
Rapid heartbeat
Rapid breathing
No tears when crying
Fever
In the most serious cases, delirium or unconsciousness

You can attempt to discredit the Mayo Clinic as a source if you'd like.

Of course you cherry picked the Wiki article. You quoted what you thought proved your claim that all dehydration is the same (it isn't) and further that all symptoms are the same (they aren't).

You didn't clear anything up because you're not doing anything here except quote mining to support your rather evident pre-existing belief that Hillary Clinton and her campaign are lying, regardless of your claims that you're non-partisan, etc. etc.

You've tipped your hand more than once.

FOR THE LOVE OF......please drop this theme!

THREE TYPES of dehydration

then there are DIFFERENT STAGES OF DEHYDRATION, which you just listed and they CLEARLY have different symptoms...the TYPES do NOT directly CORRELATE to the STAGES, but all people present with the SAME SYMPTOMS if they are each experiencing the same STAGE of dehydration, REGARDLESS of one of the three causes!!!

I will no longer entertain this topic with you until you choose to learn more about it on your own.

Talk about cherry picking.....

a reply to: Gryphon66

Meh...whatever...I have my life to go back to. Enjoy your...whatever you call this on here.

a reply to: Aazadan

But McCain wasn't acting all weird. Was he? I mean, the dudes weird...but not obviously odd public behavior weird. he's old and does look like he'd drop dead any second...I would probably too at that age...but he wasn't having odd public episodes which had odd explanations on MSM.

a reply to: Sparkymedic

Right. Your abilities as a "medic" allow you to dispute the Mayo Clinic.

I demonstrated clearly that you cherry-picked the Wikipedia article to make the ridiculous claim that all dehydration is the same, I then demosntrated from a reputable source that your claim that all symtomology is the same is fallacious, etc.

And now you want try to incorporate that there are different types of dehydration (causal) and different degrees of dehydration with different symptoms (which are not all present in all victims of dehydration) ... which exactly CONTRADICTS what we all just saw you claim above.

I submit that you're no longer going to "entertain" this because you've been shown to be either grossly mistaken or intentionally misleading.

Taa taa. Say hello to everyone at the "medic business" for us.

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Sparkymedic

Right. Your abilities as a "medic" allow you to dispute the Mayo Clinic.

I demonstrated clearly that you cherry-picked the Wikipedia article to make the ridiculous claim that all dehydration is the same, I then demosntrated from a reputable source that your claim that all symtomology is the same is fallacious, etc.

And now you want try to incorporate that there are different types of dehydration (causal) and different degrees of dehydration with different symptoms (which are not all present in all victims of dehydration) ... which exactly CONTRADICTS what we all just saw you claim above.

I submit that you're no longer going to "entertain" this because you've been shown to be either grossly mistaken or intentionally misleading.

Taa taa. Say hello to everyone at the "medic business" for us.

Nah, I just don't want to converse with someone who wants to argue about something that isn't worth arguing about. I know what I said...take it or leave it.

You clearly aren't reading what you're posting. I'm not here to teach you what you don't know or understand. Nor am I saying this to attack your character or make you look dumb. You aren't dumb. but you clearly have SOMETHING to get across/ prove here. Sorry about being short in my previous posts.

This dehydration talk is getting me thirsty...ahhh...beer...

I'm sure you have better things to do also other than argue about the medical definitions of dehydration, in regards to a political moron (all politicians are morons) who means nothing to me in this universe...or at least I hope you do.

originally posted by: Gryphon66

Jasser has lately become the right’s go-to guy when it comes to providing cover for policies or positions that many Muslim Americans contend are discriminatory. When controversy over the so-called Ground Zero mosque erupted, Jasser, a frequent guest on Fox News, accused the builders of trying to ‘diminish what happened’ on September 11, 2001. He has supported statewide bans on Shariah law in American courts and has helped bolster conservative warnings that American Muslims seek to replace the Constitution with a harsh interpretation of Islamic law. Many American Muslim groups, meanwhile, view Jasser as a reliable apologist for Republicans and anti-Muslim figures—one with little grassroots support in the American Muslim community.”

Wikipedia - Zuhdi Jasser

You post that like it's a bad thing.

Are you "just sayin" or does he go against your stereotype of muslims?

He is right, it's all BS.