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Einstein Proven Wrong, Yet Again

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posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 12:24 PM
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I was toying with the idea whether to dedicate a thread to this topic, since if you try to show how Einstein was wrong, thru your own research, people always try to refute it. So what better way than to pick a mainstream experiment to achieve the same result?

Now lets us take the example of an experiment performed at NIST Labs ( www.nist.gov... ):
2 Atomic/ or optical Clocks were placed, vertically separated by a distance of 33 cm. The higher clock was reading a faster time and it was concluded that Einstein was right, since according to his GR, time speeds up as we rise above the surface of the earth.
But let us take a close look at what is actually happening.
Now you are observing 2 atomic/ optical clocks on a lab floor. The higher one shows a
higher digital readout.
Atomic optical clocks are nothing but decade counters, to count
down the source local oscillator freq. So the higher atomic clock can only show
a higher digital readout when its local oscillator freq increases. Here the source oscillator is the Caesium atom/ or oscillating aluminium ion.
Source local oscillator freq can only go up, if time dilates. Since, if you stretch the time vector, you can superimpose more no. of cycles on it.
Now there is no place to stick your reference frames and lorentz transformations, btw.

Conclusion:
Time dilates as you rise above the surface of the Earth, Which is exactly opposite to that postulated by Einstein’s General Relativity.

I do expect skeptics to come along and beat about the bush. Nonetheless all responses are welcome.



(post by SpongeBeard removed for a manners violation)

posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 12:31 PM
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First you said this:


originally posted by: Nochzwei
The higher clock was reading a faster time and it was concluded that Einstein was right, since according to his GR, time speeds up as we rise above the surface of the earth.


Then you said this:



Conclusion:
Time dilates as you rise above the surface of the Earth, Which is exactly opposite to that postulated by Einstein’s General Relativity.


Which is it?



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 12:31 PM
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Whether Einstein was wrong or right on this occasion.. he was still one of the most brilliant minds throughout the whole of human history.


It makes me laugh when people give it all the "na na na na na na I'm smarter than Einstein.." er.. no your not..
edit on 6/9/16 by Misterlondon because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 12:32 PM
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a reply to: Nochzwei

A post that contradicts itself?

Yeah, you sure showed Einstein wrong.

LOL!



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 12:33 PM
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a reply to: SpongeBeard

Manners please.

you know the drill.

Don't attack the poster. Go after his facts.



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 12:42 PM
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I'm not a very "sciency" person, although I do love everything about science. Without the background science education I wish I had, lots of stuff is beyond my complete understanding.
That said, Einstein lived about a century ago.
It's always good to see progress, and stuff getting clarity. And new stuff being discovered all the time.
Was Einstein wrong? Maybe. Isn't that how it works? Theories get thought of, and then through the decades, or centuries, the proper details get figured out.....

** I don't know enough to be a skeptic 😕



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 12:43 PM
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a reply to: Nochzwei

The higher clock is moving faster through spacetime.. It's at a further radius from the center of the earth so it's moving a greater distance in the same time as the clock below it. When you travel faster relative to something else your time is going slower than the relative object.

that is only one aspect of what is going on.. If it was all there was you would be right in questioning Eienstein he would be clearly wrong..

The other is the effect of GRAVITY on Space/time.. You know how when you get close to a black hole time almost stops? Well the higher clock is further away from the gravity of Earth and has less slowing of time based on warped spaec time than the lower clock.

the two effects combined give a net speeding of time for the higher clock relative to the lower clock..

I hope that was clear enough.
edit on 6-9-2016 by Reverbs because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 12:46 PM
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a reply to: Nochzwei

See the problem I am having is, even if it's called a clock, it just measures decay. Therefore you can't make an absolute statement starting with "time does this and that" just "atoms decay this and that"

Sorry

Off topic
And Einstein was wrong, but so was Freud and many others. In my opinion still great, wise men. That's just progress, evolution of science.



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 12:47 PM
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a reply to: Nochzwei

I think you are looking at the equations backwards.

If we consider the space around a black hole, we know that, according to Einstein, time will react normally far enough out in space that it is not affected by a black hole's gravity. At the event horizon, time will stop. Stopped time means zero oscillations because oscillations are time-based. Thus, we should observe slower oscillation frequency as gravitational force increases. That is what we observe.

If you want to look at the time vector, a unit time vector will have relative magnitude as given by 1/sqrt(c^2-v^2). Te number of oscillations of an atom are per unit time. If the unit time increases in length, the number of oscillations will appear to be less compared to a shorter time vector. You appear to be wanting to maintain wavelength relative to the observer's time vector instead of the atom's time vector. It doesn't work that way.

Einstein was right as far as our technology can determine, just as Newton was right as far as the technology of that time could determine. Sorry.

TheRedneck



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 01:09 PM
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a reply to: Nochzwei

One of my best friends is a Physicist at NIST.

I sent him the article and am waiting for his response. I will chime in with it when it arrives.



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 01:16 PM
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a reply to: Nochzwei
Why do you get the idea this article proofs einstein wrong?
It clearly supports his theory.



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 01:27 PM
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a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Mate you have problems with the english language, looks like



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 01:29 PM
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originally posted by: Misterlondon
Whether Einstein was wrong or right on this occasion.. he was still one of the most brilliant minds throughout the whole of human history.


It makes me laugh when people give it all the "na na na na na na I'm smarter than Einstein.." er.. no your not..
hey mate you are beating about the bush



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 01:30 PM
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originally posted by: TerryDon79
a reply to: Nochzwei

A post that contradicts itself?

How so?



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 01:32 PM
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originally posted by: Nochzwei
Mate you have problems with the english language, looks like


Do I? Or do you not even see how you are contradicting yourself with those two statements.


The higher clock was reading a faster time and it was concluded that Einstein was right, since according to his GR, time speeds up as we rise above the surface of the earth.


An example of time dilation where Einstein is right.


Time dilates as you rise above the surface of the Earth, Which is exactly opposite to that postulated by Einstein’s General Relativity.


The exact same scenario yet now Einstein is wrong.


If Einstein were wrong your smart phone would not even work properly among a whole host of other devices.



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 01:32 PM
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originally posted by: Nochzwei

originally posted by: TerryDon79
a reply to: Nochzwei

A post that contradicts itself?

How so?


It's pointless me explaining it to you because you'll just make some daft comment about not knowing something or other.



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 01:33 PM
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a reply to: Reverbs

both scenarios dilate time, not the other way around. no at black hole time does not stop, it ticks incredibly quickly



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 01:34 PM
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originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: Nochzwei

See the problem I am having is, even if it's called a clock, it just measures decay. Therefore you can't make an absolute statement starting with "time does this and that" just "atoms decay this and that"

Sorry

Off topic
And Einstein was wrong, but so was Freud and many others. In my opinion still great, wise men. That's just progress, evolution of science.
no decay going on there mate



posted on Sep, 6 2016 @ 01:36 PM
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originally posted by: Nochzwei
a reply to: Reverbs

both scenarios dilate time, not the other way around. no at black hole time does not stop, it ticks incredibly quickly


speed and gravity both dilate time..

the top clock has more speed, the bottom clock has more gravity..

gravity is an inverse square to the distance..

as in the effect of gravity on time changes more in relation to height above earth than the rotational speed change on time passing..

pretty simple really



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