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How to respectfully call out BS?

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posted on Aug, 21 2016 @ 10:18 PM
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I respect ATS trying to clean up the personal attacks. We should all have a reasonable and respectfully questioning attitude and help hold our colleagues to the highest levels of credibility. Does the truth deserve any less?

Unfortunately I have engaged in a few ATS squabbles. The old how to respectfully call out BS. I have a hard time dealing with three debate topics. Flat Earth, man never being in space, and Mandela Effect in regards to physical timeline / universe jumping.

Is it better not to engage in debate out of respect to those who hold a belief in what I perceive as a hoax or pseudoscience?

Or is it better to test presented items by a baptism of fire. Does the truth deserve anything less?

edit on 21-8-2016 by neutronflux because: Added men in space.




posted on Aug, 21 2016 @ 10:20 PM
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a reply to: neutronflux

I have seen alot of threads about anti-Mandela. Can I start posting threads about anti-anti-mandela as I dont like both types?



posted on Aug, 21 2016 @ 10:24 PM
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a reply to: neutronflux

I suck at this too. Most of my nonverbal antics don't work in text, so I end up sounding more serious than I intend.

I wouldn't tell you to stop trying though. Just say what you mean & mean what you say. Some people will misunderstand you either way, but at least you'll get your position out there.



posted on Aug, 21 2016 @ 10:25 PM
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Those 2 topics will get me a post ban before it's all said and done. If you heard someone preaching that unicorns caused gravity would you not be obligated to ensure they didn't spread that vitriol?

Obligated might be the wrong word and a little self justifying but I think calling a spade a spade is in order.



posted on Aug, 21 2016 @ 10:26 PM
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a reply to: neutronflux

Well, as long as you don't drag it out in an attempt to fundamentally change someones thoughts with pages of coercion, I would see no problem at all with presenting your opinions to the contrary in any thread and any topic. And no name calling and stuff obviously, but thats a given anyways.

But like if you just find yourself repeating the same conversation back and forth in a loop, its probably best to move on from that specific dialogue and see what else is on peoples minds, like a different perspective.

I actually felt I had a mandela effect the other night actually going to Davis island, but all the sings when I got there said Davis Islands. I was assured it was always that way, and I just chalked it up to me never going out there enough.



posted on Aug, 21 2016 @ 10:41 PM
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a reply to: AmericanRealist

The other side too, long posts in a thread to push conflicting ideas back one or two pages. That's when a person obviously wants to push a narrative and had no intention of debate.



posted on Aug, 21 2016 @ 10:52 PM
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a reply to: neutronflux

true, but its important to simply catch it early, and stop responding at that point. if one must continue, attempt to approach from a different path and perspective. Just try and keep it fresh and healthy.

I have literally seen a half dozen pages built up by a handful of members just repeating each other in alternating words going back and forth in some topics. It becomes redundant and boring. Usually if I decide to continue in such a topic, I try to approach or divert to a different perspective at least. Most of the time I just move on though.



posted on Aug, 22 2016 @ 01:39 AM
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Well if you can't learn to nicely disagree here, you won't learn it anywhere
between the political posts, the religious posts, the conspiracy theory stuff, you name it, there's something for everyone to attack, and something for everyone to defend. And you're right, you can't smile and calmly type something and have people interpret that as nice. So be careful of word choice (which is hard) and look at it as a learning experience, because if you can politely disagree here, you can do it anywhere. I try to be nice all the time, but I work with people allllll day, so when I run out of patience, it's completely gone. So I know I could work on that personal flaw



posted on Aug, 22 2016 @ 02:51 AM
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originally posted by: In4ormant
Those 2 topics will get me a post ban before it's all said and done. If you heard someone preaching that unicorns caused gravity would you not be obligated to ensure they didn't spread that vitriol?

Obligated might be the wrong word and a little self justifying but I think calling a spade a spade is in order.


In the war over "unicorns cause gravity" vs. "gravity causes unicorns" it is hard to know where to stand.

So, I sit in a chair, at least, I'm fairly sure that is the case.

None the less, sometimes I just have to respond when 'someone is wrong on the Internet'. Political correctness be damned!



edit on 22/8/2016 by chr0naut because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 22 2016 @ 03:27 AM
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a reply to: neutronflux

You have a right and some would argue, an obligation to say what you think and or believe. Look at the price people like David Ike pay for saying what they think.

If others do not have the skill or the wherewithal or whatever, to be able to disagree and articulate an alternative view, without resorting to negative assertions and assumptions then that is there's and the Mods problem.

I have had a few of my posts removed because I not been able to resist the temptation to give a bit back every now and then to some of those kinds of persons.

Mind you, I also got canned a few times because the Mods dont understand the lexicon and verbal style of people from outside the US but then I suppose that's a tall order for anyone.

Then there is always the shills of course who use abuse, cast dispersion and make derogatory remarks and the like, simply as a tactic. Trouble is, some seem to get away with it.

Read an article once in which the point was made that the ultimate goal of a shill is to be become a mod. It made me wonder about one or two of them on here.



posted on Aug, 22 2016 @ 03:37 AM
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a reply to: Azureblue

I also get the feeling people work in concert, or a person may use multiple accounts to look like they have a majority on their side.

Used it once in a reply in a thread. I wish ATS would adopt and modify plagiarism software. Only to keep accessible statistics on what accounts use abnormally similar syntax and phrasing. Maybe a top ten list for each account of similar personalities in posting? If anything, might root out paid trolls?



posted on Aug, 22 2016 @ 05:45 AM
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a reply to: neutronflux



I have a hard time dealing with three debate topics. Flat Earth, man never being in space, and Mandela Effect


People who believe in these ideas are usually 100% intractable and won't be conceding an inch of ground no matter what. In my opinion, there's zero point in even having the conversation because it never moves anywhere. On the other hand, those who argue against those topics are likewise never gonna budge an inch. They won't nod when the 'other side' makes a reasonable point and they won't acknowledge how *some* proponents have arrived at their world-view by using their brains.

To a degree, the 100-page threads amount to a group of stubborn-heads saying "Yes it is" and "No it isn't" in various ways...forever. I've been there as a skeptic and argued against ME, FE and Moon hoaxes. Chemtrails too. I realised one day that it didn't affect me one iota if someone, somewhere wants to believe the world is flat, we exist in changing time-lines or that stars can't be seen in space.

It's fair to let the believer side have their conversations without trying to correct their every post. Then again, it's fair to join in because it's a message board and that's why we're all here. It's all cool as long as people try their best to be friendly and respectful



posted on Aug, 22 2016 @ 06:21 AM
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True we've had quite a few ME and FE threads popping up lately and i've posted a few comments but after that its pointless when its calling people out for a simple view etc.

It's good to let the OP have say on said subject (no harm done), but sometimes it's on "death ears" even when people/posters are giving valid info or logical point's of view, then we have trolling that makes a thread mute on all points of view.



posted on Aug, 22 2016 @ 06:26 AM
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originally posted by: DarkvsLight29
True we've had quite a few ME and FE threads popping up lately and i've posted a few comments but after that its pointless when its calling people out for a simple view etc.

It's good to let the OP have say on said subject (no harm done), but sometimes it's on "death ears" even when people/posters are giving valid info or logical point's of view, then we have trolling that makes a thread mute on all points of view.


To your question,, Does the truth deserve any less?

Then no it doesn't deserve less, no matter what the OP or posts say, truth is truth and undeniable.

Sorry double post.
edit on 22-8-2016 by DarkvsLight29 because: double post.



posted on Aug, 22 2016 @ 07:14 AM
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a reply to: Kandinsky

This.

Keep in mind that everything here on ATS is simply pixels on a screen. For the most part, these pixels are not going to interfere with your daily life.

There is absolutely no reason for anyone to do name calling of any kind. There is absolutely no reason for anyone to be insulting at any time. There is no reason for anyone to be rude on here.

If you're trying to have a discussion with someone on a topic, and they resort to those things: alert us. Don't respond to it, and realize you've reached a point in your discussion that should end right there. If the only thing a fellow member can respond to you with is an insult or something very rude, then it should be obvious that any reasonable discussion has ended. Don't stoop to their level, and remember: no one has a gun to your head forcing you to click on the "Reply" button.

The only place where we do allow that type of behavior is the Political Mud Pit, and we only allow Politics in that forum.

So if someone makes a thread about how they have switched from another universe because they remember Hawaii being further north than what maps show, just keep in mind going into that discussion, there is a good chance that you're not going to change their minds, or get them to agree to anything else.

I spent a lot of time on here back in 2012 arguing with people about the End Of The World predictions and Planet X's arrival. In most cases, I was not able to convince those people that they were wrong, or misinformed. I always kept my posts as polite as possible, never using insults or calling someone a name. If I got very frustrated with them, I'd move to another topic, or would log off and get some air.
If they were the ones to start the name calling, I was done with them. I'd report their posts and move on, or would at least stop responding to them in that thread.



posted on Aug, 22 2016 @ 07:29 AM
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a reply to: eriktheawful

Once upon a time, I chased a member through several pages of a Lost Civilisation thread and neither of us would stop without having the last disagreeable word. It went on for days; on and on and on. I was right and he was wrong and it gnawed at me that he refused to see it!

That was the last time I let 'words on a screen' dictate my posting behaviour. Sure, I'll still disagree/agree with people, but only within reason.

Guess what happened with *that* thread? A year or so later and the data in the OP was resolved and explained. We'd both been wrong so all that narcy hubris about 'being right' was a shame on me either way lol


It's another point worth remembering. Just because the *other guy/gal* is wrong doesn't guarantee that we're right.

Modesty and manners, right? Great double-act.




posted on Aug, 22 2016 @ 07:49 AM
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a reply to: Kandinsky

I had someone on here that I debated Planet X with a LOT back in 2012.

I actually started to feel like I was trolling them at one point.

However, they actually came out, in public here and said that they respected me, and actually enjoyed debating the topic with me, because I was the most polite, could actually get them to stop and look over their stuff again, and even though they still disagreed with me, they said I had taught them a lot about astronomy that they'd never knew before.

I was very flattered, and my opinion of them went up ten fold!

Of course Nibiru never showed up and we're still here.......so I was right, hehehehehe.

Unfortunately I've not seen them post in years. I miss debating with them.




posted on Aug, 22 2016 @ 07:54 AM
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originally posted by: eriktheawful
Of course Nibiru never showed up...


Stop spreading disinfo, it's hiding behind some lens flares right now.



posted on Aug, 22 2016 @ 08:33 AM
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I'm having trouble getting past this title:



How to respectfully call out BS?




A line in another poster's sentence stands out to me, out of context, but somehow apropos



a little self justifying



For some time, I worked for a company that designed sewage treatment plants. One line from the boss always stood out to me, "It may be # to you, but it's bread and butter to me."

There's a moral in there somewhere....and also an unexpected twist from an irritating computer censuring of the word I really used, which adds a pun to what erictheawful says here: "Keep in mind that everything here on ATS is simply pixels on a screen"...Yes, but those weren't my pixels.


Therefore, I think I will imagine that I am with Chr0naut:



So, I sit in a chair, at least, I'm fairly sure that is the case.



This thread really messed with my head. Thanks, I needed that.


Fishy


edit on 22-8-2016 by ClownFish because: Another typo...should have been my Avatar name



posted on Aug, 22 2016 @ 08:35 AM
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In my experience it is not worth time nor effort to correct some dumbass's notions. You'll only make enemies.



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