Putin Accuses Obama Of ‘Fake War’ Against ISIS

a reply to: hounddoghowlie

Toyota pickup trucks with heavy machine guns and canons welded on, were a staple in the South Yemen in the 1980s. I know this because of the border clashes with Oman. They are easy to make and maintain, and such vehicles are quite common.

The question of arming ISIS is quite easy. Most of their kit is stolen. The Iraqis left quite alot when they ran away. To note that the nice fancy ex-Iraqi (US supplied) kit is now less common because it's probably difficult to maintain by your average civilian mechanic, and they are too obvious for US/NATO drone strikes. Besides, they are also useless for holding, brutalising and terrorising the towns and cities they have captured. You can use 7.62mm, axes, iron bars and rape as your weapons of choice.

As Russian small arms are so prolific in the Middle East, it is no surprise what is used. AK47s and RPGs are the staple of ISIS and abundant in their availability. Many of these weapons can trace their origins to the factories in Russia, but that does not mean Russia is complicit in their supply.

originally posted by: korath
It all comes down to the oil. If the ME didn't have any, none of this stuff would be happening and nobody would give a rats ass about what goes on over there.

Funny how the truth never gets attention (stars) but the redundant back and forth blame and defend of who and what has all the attention and focus.

It's about oil.

A world wide resource, traded and paid with a specific currency exchange, the globe throughout.

The west wants to cut off Russian's limbs, in a systematic and precise way. The oil will deal a devastating blow.

If people on a conspiracy website can see this, Putin and Russian powers definitely see this strategic move by the west/Saudi Arabia.

Long before we did. And thus, they have been prepping for such a counter strategy, which will no doubt result in all out war.

As said resource is a leg Russia uses to stand on, as a global competitor. Cut it off, and expect hell to break loose.

I think this goes hand in hand with Putin warning people of an unavoidable war. It's not hard to see if you by pass the propaganda, lies and distractions, also the constant factor of a boogeyman that has always been an illusion to western public.

For instance, the example used a million times.... isis is the modern day boogeyman for the western society.
Yet they COULD EASILY BE wiped off the map and there would be less terror attacks, less anti Muslim bogus, racial tension and proxy wars.

Yet it's not in western interest to do so, and so the SHOW goes on. Both sides of this illusion are bad, the western and Russia/eastern powers.

The finger pointing is redundant. Yet it won't stop, hence the term sheep. People will never snap out of the illusion of division.

We are in an age, with technological advancements, medical, and all the resources we need to sustain unity and harmony of west/east-for humanity, yet their individual interests and perceptions get in the way and create distance and division ...

Stop feeding into it. Don't have a strong opinion or perception, we all are the consumers of said resource, which make it as valuable as it is.

Oil is nothing without consumers the globe over. Because it's the humans exchanging energy for currency, and trading currency for natural resources that is ruled and controlled by normal humans who are control both resources and thus the humans who depend on them.

a reply to: hounddoghowlie

Thats why they call it a fake war. The war on isis is really the war on assad...

"Saddam must go"

"Qaddafi must go."

"Assad Must Go".

Like i said earlier, some here will never admit to it even though its plain in their face.

originally posted by: paraphi
Um, Russia have killed 28,000 terrorists. Methinks Russia is falling in to the trap of over-estimating, just like Vietnam. I wonder how many real terrorists have actually been killed, and how many innocent civilians have been killed.

Russia's modus operandi is not refined. Protected by the control of the press, Russia have been flattening villages, towns and cities. Dumb bombs, cluster munitions, white phosphorous, brute force and secrecy are ensuring Russian actions are unquestioned. Look to Grozny as an example of Russian methods. Look at reports coming out of Aleppo where civilians and humanitarian workers are being targeted.

Russian efforts are questionable at best.

You make some really good points.

Obama's "fake war" is really just safeguards, failsafe's and a heck of a lot of red tape that serves nothing but to slow the American war machine down and that isn't necessarily a bad thing. The US military can only do what it's allowed to do...

Politics and War or politicians and military are two distinctly different things, yet in between them exists all manner of things influenced by them both. Take alphabet agencies for instance, they neither actively engage in politics(support candidates) nor do they officially declare war (on nations) yet they are clearly operating in the realms of both words. Politics and war.

Now to me it seems obvious the likes of the CIA are actively engaged what you might call warfare in multiple countries, heck continents. But the CIA's role in the world isn't as clearly defined as say the US military or an MP, neither is the role of a human being for that matter. Point being, the mentality of "We know where ISIS is, why are they not dead?" isn't exactly a bright one.

This Obama's "fake war" mentality is also a huge slap in the face of the air forces of multiple nations such as the RAF and USAF who are out there doing a juggling act with life, politics and war. The fine line that was the conclusion of Iraq and Afghanistan and the civilian death toll is being upheld. It's muddy waters between those two words, politics and war. But Russian military has the will to carpet bomb Syria and claim 28,000 dead terrorists, the official civilian deaths in Iraq was about 150,000 and that was with "smart" bombs and "specialist" training so I highly doubt the US military will be engaging Syria any time soon. I also think Russia should revise it's death toll and open up to scrutiny while it's at it. I can't fathom how you can kill with real discrimination by such methods... A lot of that death toll will be counted by moving dots on an infra-red screen from thousands of feet. I always thought the ability of recognition like that was in the hands of US military, another tool that measures probable risk to casualties and is used in real-time to stop or give the go-ahead on bombing runs on suspected ISIS combatants.

Nah just blame Obama. Vlad you are doing great, keep it up

originally posted by: reldra
a reply to: Nikola014

The amount of drone strikes we have made was shocking. But, go ahead, believe Russia.

Shockingly ineffective?

a reply to: bobs_uruncle

It depends who's drone strike it is, people seem to love blaming the US federal government but fall short on words when talking about US soldiers or air force.

A long time ago, when military was about honour and code, rather than big business, we ended our targets. We didn't dance around or play games of profit, we simply killed the f'ing terrorists

The US existed in times of chivalry? Get away

We Brits called a lot of your actions terrorism in the early days because quite frankly they were seen as unsporting at the time. Business, politics and war have intermingled for a long time and just like officialdom robbed the Native American of his land, human rights and the Geneva convention is robbing you of seeing another country lain to waste (more than it is).

But hey drink that cool refreshing drink and remember, you know the truth about big brother and he ain't out there beating up bullies

a reply to: reldra

It's odd that Russia is believed first.

Why?

We have proof that our entire political system is corrupt and manipulative thanks to Wikileaks and the DNC. Why the hell would I trust our Government or anything our media tells us?

a reply to: neo96

yea, it reminds me of this scene from Generation Kill after they captured the airfield.


"oh its an Iraqi tank column, call in an airstrike!" , oh wait, its just the lights from a distant town, at least we bombed the Earth.

Putin is standing up to Obama and no longer amused by his childish games.

Putin is Da'Man!

originally posted by: RAY1990
a reply to: bobs_uruncle

It depends who's drone strike it is, people seem to love blaming the US federal government but fall short on words when talking about US soldiers or air force.

A long time ago, when military was about honour and code, rather than big business, we ended our targets. We didn't dance around or play games of profit, we simply killed the f'ing terrorists

The US existed in times of chivalry? Get away

We Brits called a lot of your actions terrorism in the early days because quite frankly they were seen as unsporting at the time. Business, politics and war have intermingled for a long time and just like officialdom robbed the Native American of his land, human rights and the Geneva convention is robbing you of seeing another country lain to waste (more than it is).

But hey drink that cool refreshing drink and remember, you know the truth about big brother and he ain't out there beating up bullies

I worked for the South African military, mainly bases and borders in weapon systems research and development, but a couple of very nice offensive weapons as well. I did have a few hot and hairy times on borders and in campaigns where things went sideways. In proximity to my operational areas, and I spent 1 to 4 days a week on bases, borders and keypoint installations, no innocent died.

There have been a number of unsportsmanlike events concerning the US, but Brits do it to, so do the Israelis, I knew some not-to-swift south African military as well that can be thrown into the mix. US soldiers are generally great, I've known a few rangers and seals for years as well as cdn airforce, SA MI/CI and a few creepy mi5/mi6 guys. The problem isn't the soldiers. It's the management and these useless politicians setting impossible goals and retarded mission objectives. Of course none of them have ever been in the field, they just stick their thumb in the air, their head up the ass of their handler and use their anus like a mouth to fart out instructions.

The US military has become a lot of good men and women being used to promote corporate and international banking interests. It's really quite sad, but if you look at history, it's always been this way regardless of whose military is used. You're right, they are not beating up the bullies, they have become the right arm of the bullies.

Cheers - Dave

a reply to: bobs_uruncle

Cheers for the personal reply and I meant no offence, I did jump the gun a little bit.

I've never been in the military though through all of my dealings with military personnel I know they pride themselves in logic and efficiency, add a little honour and loyalty and you have the last people on the planet who's game is to screw over Joe Bloggs.

I always find it ironic that the US military gets so much slack when the pudding shows they are they are the most reigned in, by the book military the world has probably ever seen. But as you said sportsmanship is lacking and a damn lot of it is due to politicians thinking they know war, thinking they can make policemen of soldiers.

Let soldiers be soldiers, let politicians be politicians and for God's sake let the media be truthful.

Off topic...

A friend of mine was trying to explain about SA border control, still not quite sure what he meant but he implied that basically they have a Swiss approach to blocking entry. A bit vague but it left me with the impression that if things went south SA is one of the last places you'd wish to invade. He might have been full of it...

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: hounddoghowlie

the U.S. equipment that isis has was captured when the iraqi's turned tail and ran from them.

Thanks we know the official story. That materiel wasn't abandoned, it was delivered.

Just like this caravan of trucks crossing the Iraq border into Syria...

Edit: They're all white so US Air knows who not to bomb.

How do you know that the footage is from Iraq/Syria? Also note the claim that the helicopter is a "US Apache"? Do you also believe that too? That is NO AH-64 Apache! The footage is poor but the shape shows a Hind (Mi-24/25).

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: hounddoghowlie

also where are the isis flags.

Its not a parade for the camera, its a convoy of armedwhite pickups heading Syria.

that looks to be a MI-24, to big to be a apache.

Are you suggesting the Russians are behind ISIS?

Lol

No it means that the footage is not what you think it to be. You automatically accepted that the footage was showing ISIS assets. The question is why? Did you also just accept the video title? "United States Apache attack helicopter following behind ISIS convoy into Syria from Iraq" So now you know that the footage doesn't show a US Apache but a Mi-24 Hind then what does that suggest?

Have you ever considered that the footage showed for example an Iraqi Army or Iraqi Milita convoy being protected by an Iraqi Hind? How about footage from Libya or Sudan?

originally posted by: Tardacus
i seem to remember that the U.S didn`t start bombing oil facilities until after russia did,so i have to wonder what the U.S. was bombing for those 2 years before the russians joined in. an oil facility is a huge target easy to spot,easy to hit,same goes for conveys of oil trucks heading to the turkish border, easy to spot,easy to hit,so the U.S. can`t use the excuse that "we didn`t see them"

The US were targeting ISIS oil refineries in Iraq and Syria before the Russians. This was Operation Tidal Wave II. The US policy was to keep civilian casualties low and not to create an environmental disaster. Even when the US changed the policy and started targeting the middlemen before those tankers were destroyed the area was leaflet bombed, warning strafed and low passes conducted.

en.wikipedia.org...

Now, however, everything seems to be fair game except those points where the oil reaches the surface and the makeshift refineries, which are run by civilians. The U.S. is still keen to avoid an environmental disaster; it is also carefully avoiding civilian casualties, which means the refineries—really just boilers run by locals—are off-limits. In recent weeks, the coalition has started hitting oil truck loading platforms at fields. It’s also targeting oil and gas separation plants for the first time, having destroyed 13 plants so far this month. Heavy machinery that might be used to repair facilities is also being hit. On November 4, strikes destroyed multiple cranes, rigs, excavators, pipefitters, and a front-end loader in Syria. The one crucial change to these rules of engagement is that middlemen are now potential targets. Before Operation Tidal Wave II, middlemen were safe, but on November 16 U.S. warplanes destroyed 116 queued tanker trucks in ISIS territory. The Pentagon is confident that these truckers are not true believers or ISIS fanboys. That’s why warning leaflets were dropped along the route about an hour before strikes were launched.

energyfuse.org...

www.nytimes.com...

originally posted by: reldra
a reply to: awareness10

It's odd that Russia is believed first. If course we have been attacking ISIS. Their strongholds being bombed resulted in smaller and more far flung attacks. '

I believe it has been described over and over how it is not impossible to steal a truck and ship it.

It is VERY odd. But not unexpected if you truly consider how Obama is a proven deceiver of the American people all across the board. Every single promise broken or made with no intention of ever keeping, being caught red handed with Fast and furious, and a sordid laundry list of lies and cheats as to surprise even his most staunch supporters.

All of those things would be expected to have an outcome where an old enemy like Russia would be believed first, but it takes a personal withdrawal from being in constant denial that our own country's leader could actually do all of those things to us first.

a reply to: awareness10

Because 'Russia' didn't create Isis. John McCain comes to mind... and so do a few others...

And neither did John McCain so why bring his name up?

a reply to: awareness10

Putin is standing up to Obama and no longer amused by his childish games. Putin is Da'Man!

Except the one's he plays at home with his own people...

Lying to them

Taking over private companies for the government

Killing, and/or killing those who oppose him

Invading and annexing parts of sovereign countries on a lie

Yep he's Da'Man alright.

Let's not forget the killing of innocent civilians and considering them collateral damage in Syria as though their lives don't matter...you really need to learn what being Da'Man really entails.

SYRIA: ‘CIVILIAN OBJECTS WERE NOT DAMAGED’: RUSSIA’S STATEMENTS ON ITS ATTACKS IN SYRIA UNMASKED

www.amnesty.org...

a reply to: tommyjo

How do you know that the footage is from Iraq/Syria? Also note the claim that the helicopter is a "US Apache"? Do you also believe that too? That is NO AH-64 Apache! The footage is poor but the shape shows a Hind (Mi-24/25).

The title says that not me.

originally posted by: tommyjo

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: hounddoghowlie

also where are the isis flags.

Its not a parade for the camera, its a convoy of armedwhite pickups heading Syria.

that looks to be a MI-24, to big to be a apache.

Are you suggesting the Russians are behind ISIS?

Lol

No it means that the footage is not what you think it to be. You automatically accepted that the footage was showing ISIS assets. The question is why? Did you also just accept the video title? "United States Apache attack helicopter following behind ISIS convoy into Syria from Iraq" So now you know that the footage doesn't show a US Apache but a Mi-24 Hind then what does that suggest?

Have you ever considered that the footage showed for example an Iraqi Army or Iraqi Milita convoy being protected by an Iraqi Hind? How about footage from Libya or Sudan?

Anything but US AID for Syrian insurgents... I get your need to discredit it. After all US isn't arming insurgents to defeat Syrian Army are they?

(repeat after me: "They are fighting ISIS")

Texas company truck spotted in Syria in hands of ISIS

a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

Every single promise broken or made with no intention of ever keeping, being caught red handed with Fast and furious, and a sordid laundry list of lies and cheats as to surprise even his most staunch supporters.

Pretty sure you can find more than that on Putin himself...

Chechnya comes to mind...he killed civilians to create his power base.

He also killed the journalist who reported on the Russian involvement, and then killed the FSB agent that warned her that her life was indeed in danger.

Ukraine comes to mind where he lied about the reason he annexed Crimea...

Taking private companies from civilians for the good of the government...

Taking over the media from private companies for the good of the government...

Imprisoning or killing those who don't agree with his rule...

Yep Russia should be believed before any US president because they have always been truthful and have never been caught doing anything that could be considered bad for their people.