It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

After the Munich shootings

page: 1
10
<<   2  3 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 08:52 AM
link   
So, first a short description of the official version as it is now told to us:
All the reported shootings from all over Munich, for hours, were all just "exploding ballooons", "banging doors", firweorks or similiar, according to Hermann(Bavarian Interiour Minister).

The attackers with the long rifles were cops without any marks, according to the officials now. But, were cops with long rifles in seconds at the spot? Since when do german, unmarked undercover cops carry long rifles? And if yes, how could they be so fast, an exercise ongoing at that day? But i couldn´t find anything yet about an exercise that day in Munich.

I heard the officials celebrate themselves yesterday, on TV. That this was a good possibility to show how good "our" security officials work together. If we act as we would believe the official story(very hard, after the officials caught lying about the dead body/backpack of the or one of the attackers), what is good with unmarked cops in jeans and t-shirts making the people think that there are other attackers with long rifles on the run?

What is good if cops met him in the beginning, had a shootout with him, but he could flee unharmed? What is good when a whole "security" army closes down a whole city(bceaue of ONE attacker, as we are told), when the city servers break down, when the mobile network breaks down, when people are feared because they were told not the truth?

Why did they lie about the dead body? The police saw the attacker shooting himself at around 20.30, that´s the official story since yesterday, suddenly. And really nobody questions the timeline of the official reports about the dead body. Everything happened after they saw the attacker shooting himself(as we are told), flying in of the GSG9 and COBRA(Austria), declaring special case scenario.

The police reported for hours, after 20.30, that they don´t have caught an attacker yet, then later they reported that a dead body was FOUND, but nobody knows if it is the or one of the attackers. Explosives were feared, stored in the red backpack. How, if they didn´t even know that this was one of the or the attacker, as they tell us? Then a robot was ordered, 3hrs20mins later... Who watched the dead body and the feared explosives for 3hrs20mins? Is that the way to handle such situations for "security" officials???

How could they find his car when they even couldn´t identify the dead body as an attacker? How could they find it while the robot was still investigating the body/backpack, and nobody could approach the body/backpack, as we are told? Official reports stated for hours that examination is needed to identify the dead body as an possible attacker, but before the examination of him is finished they could identify and find his car???

How could the alleged lone wolf escape, run one kilometer unseen while an army of "security" officials is hunting him? His way was, according to the official story, from McDonalds into the mall, from the mall to the parkdeck to have a nice talk with a bavarian "native"(to become not rude xD), then he just jogged a kilometer unseen? With 300 shots left in his backpack, only to shoot himself when the cops address him?
tbc




posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 09:02 AM
link   
This is the second or third attacke now where the initial narrative has changed after a gunman has been killed.

I appreciate that things will be unclear initially. Eyewitness accounts vary and the authorities need to consider everything that is being told to them.

But, for a few hours from the initial shots until the lone gunman was confirmed dead, the authorities were still claiming they were looking for "Three" gunmen. Why is this, if they now claim those persons with rifles were unmarked Police officers? Surely they would have known this and would have taken this into consideration when briefing the media?



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 09:08 AM
link   
a reply to: DerBeobachter

Well, YOU'RE in Germany.

Surely you can tell what and how your government is massaging information to fit its preferred narrative. I would no more trust pronouncements from the German government than I would dispatches from North Korea. They are spinning everything to their advantage and to persuade the public to a particular viewpoint.

Nothing new there. Or as they say in the US, "Nothing to see here, move along".



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 09:09 AM
link   
a reply to: DerBeobachter

I think you summed it up pretty well.

It's most likely going to lead to more surveillance and a crackdown on TOR for starters. That's the way it seems to be playing out.

Now, was he a patsy or was he a genuine nutter and things are just getting manipulated after the fact to cool tempers or even push more of a police state agenda?

I'd bet Merkel, the former Stasi officer will jump at the chance to enforce more invasive policing.



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 09:11 AM
link   
I can understand the unwillingness to believe the narrative being peddled by the authorities. We are facing similar circumstances in America right now.

The problem as I see it, is you must either believe all the witnesses, or you must believe the politicians. We cannot believe the people we want to in order to confirm our own "worst fears".

One witness heard the gunman shout "Alan's Snackbar" before shooting - and that witness is discredited because "it was only one person".

Another witness heard firing inside the mall and ran outside to find bodies from a possible second shooter - she is not instantly discredited even though she is a single witness to the event.

What we have is far worse than Islamic terrorism and far worse that neo-Nazi terrorism. A dual citizen (2nd generation German I assume) Iranian-German, self radicalized AGAINST immigrants and became a far right extremist. If you believe the current narrative. How will that play a part in the political climate of Europe going forward?

Some people are just sick. Mentally and emotionally they are the equal of rabid dogs. They will only do harm to society and all we as bystanders can do is put them down, pick up the pieces, and mourn our losses.

I cannot say I know ths 100%, but from what I saw and heard, the shooter did not do this for Islam, for race, for politics, or for Anders Breivik. He shot innocent people for a very simple reason: he was a very small fish in a very large pond and he didn't know any other way to change that.
edit on 24-7-2016 by 200Plus because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 09:12 AM
link   
Video of the shooting in front of McDonalds.

twitter.com...


The filmer is across the street and randomly zooms in on the shooter before anything has happened yet, then before the shooting starts you can already see 3 people run out of the McD's towards the shooter and then he starts shooting(or already has)and they run away from him. Noone seems to get hit even though they are right in front of him.

(copy from my post in another thread)



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 09:29 AM
link   
a reply to: DearDiary

At this point, i feel the theory of manipulation on a worldwide scale by our collective leaders is at hand, carried out with bodyless massacres, no blood spatter, inconsistent testimony and false flags planted firmly at each crime scence since 911. The "shooters" are characteristically named, fit to meet the desired "profile" and succumb to self inflicted lead poisoning at the scene, or terminated by means of suicide by cop.

We are being lied to.
We are being terroristified to the point we are no longer shocked.
The BS alarm rings 24/7.

We are not a stupid people, though sometimes we play them on TV...



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 09:44 AM
link   
continue...
But let´s take a look what else happened at this time. The german army, the Bundeswehr was ready to be used on german ground. The problem is, nobody, except the "security" officials, politicians, the hardliners, falcons, security-fanatics, wants the german army operating on german streets. Even our constitution forbids that! But the Bundeswehr was ready for action, it needed just one call... The next evidence. That the "rulers" do whatever they want, with the excuse anti-terror(in germany rampage, it´s only terror when it´s muslim, "IS"), for allegedly creating "security". Even crimes, related to our constitution!

The hardliners and the old "security" junky farts in power now again ask officially for it. We need the Bundeswehr inside. They try this since decades, and failed. But they try it again and again. When will the time come and they will be maybe successful, because of "creating security"?

There is a live press conference of the bavarian police right now. The guy really said that the attacker didn´t target a special kind of people... Noooo, never, he just shot what looked for him like turks... But that was again exploding balloons, mass hallucinations i guess.

And they are saying right now what the mass medias "opinion" is, what the people have to think and believe. Again, it was computer games, he played Counter Strike... the internet, gun and ammo allegedly bought in the darknet(which is full of cops and secret services) and he "hacked facebook(made a false account, to lure "no special kind of people" to the McDonalds)...

Hmm, now another "secutity" official said that they don´t know where the ammo came from... They have to learn their script first, i guess! So ,here we go again, BigBrother-Nanny State rising, the rewards for the "security" officilas coming in, the first screamers are demanding in the mass media, as every time. Let´s "fight" terrorism and rampaging:

Volker Kauder(useless german politician):
"Schluss mit den Ego-Shooter-Spielen" - "Finish that ego shooter gaming"
www.welt.de...

Bavarian Interiour Minister Hermmann demands the Bundeswehr for Anti-Terror-service
www.spiegel.de...

And that is just the "funny" and useless beginning. Now they will go again more for the internet, with more surveillance, more censoring. Anyone taking bets? It is asked, as after every attack, for more money and power for police and secret services, the "security" officials. They will get it, bets?

They even talk about gun control now, as if this here is Texas, where every redneck can buy an A-15 at the gas station. And who needs to buy a weapon legally when it is easier and less expensive to buy one illegally? What should this laws be good for? The guns are there and easy to get, laws don´t make them dissapear!
I bet the "security" officials are lacing the next "anti-terror" package of laws right now. It will be called like this, even if they don´t want to call the Munich rampage terrorism. But nothing those, who profit from every attack, do, has to be logical or to make sense. It´s all about using everything to create a repressive surveillance police state, obvisiously. These "falcon-rats" came out of their holes while the first victims were shown, to use those victims for their needs. Disgusting!

+++Oh, news! Makes everything even more fishy. Now it is said that the father saw his son, the attacker in the McDonalds video, and instantly called the police to tell them who the attacker is. But the officials didn´t know nothing about the attacker... As the journalist asked the official at the Press conference about which video was meant and at which time the father called the police, the official began to stutter a bit, said it was the McDonalds video and, for sure, couldn´t say when the father informed the police... +++

And again i have to ask: Who makes profits from such events? I am not saying that those who profit create every event to reach their goals, but that they use everything, like by creating a fear-hype via mass media, spinning things into the right directions, maybe by lying about the real events, for whatever reasons. Remember the dead body! Did they lie because they killed him somehow, and first had to create a scenario that makes it look as if the attacker killed himself? Why not just saying that the police shot him then? Or did they maybe lie to extend the whole event, to make it an live exercise for the 2400 cops and special forces that created more fear and confusion without achieving anything?

It is as it ever was, since 9/11. After every attack of any kind: It doesn´t matter if terror, if rampage/mass shootings or what it is called - "Security"/Surveillance/Nanny/Police/1984ish State rising.

I couldn´t believe when i heard what the the bavarian prime minister Seehofer(wannabe politician with only local bavarian powers) said after the event:
There is no freedom without security...
"Wir müssen alles dafür tun, um unsere Sicherheit zu verteidigen. Ohne Sicherheit gibt es keine Freiheit."
"We have to do anything possible to defend our security. Without security there is no freedom". And he said that the police forces acted "professional"...creating fear and panic, as we are told, because unmarked they were mistaked with attackers.

I bet the Emergency Medical Service acted professional, as they ever do in germany, but the 2400! police forces, including special forces, even from Austria? A whole city was closed down because of one attacker, and 2400 police forces couldn´t achieve anything than to "find" the or one of the attackers dead. And hold people in suspense for hours.

And now we even know that the father instantly called the police after he saw his son in the McDonalds video. OK, we don´t know when exactly that was, but i guess that was before around 23hrs and later in that night. The stuttering of the questioned official at the press conference spoke volumes...

I would like to give Seehofer an answer with a quote:
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
edit on 24 7 2016 by DerBeobachter because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 09:53 AM
link   
I personally don't believe the Dallas and Baton Rouge incidents are all that sinister, to be honest. I think several members of ats are jumping on one bit of information while completely ignoring other bits and spinning their entire "the narrative has changed!" claim from there. Or, sadly, are outright manufacturing the change. Their need for validation is what sees them go from thread to thread, peddling their own personal narrative, hoping somebody will give them stars and tell them they're right.

Munich, though. Munich is an odd one. If police made contact with this jackass as early on as they claim they did, and then he killed himself, the behavior beyond that makes me raise an eyebrow. I understand that it was a lot of confusion early on and they have to continue to act on the possibility that there were multiple shooters. But it seems as though they shut down the entire city, practically, and triggered a massive response across the nation and indeed multiple nations, because they couldn't get their act together. In retrospect it's almost like the soviets during World War Two: throw a massive amount of manpower at the problem and hope it works. The back-slapping after the fact is what really throws me off. Even taking a dispassionate look at the response, it seems a little bit like the proverbial headless chicken kind of response. And to be proud of it and talk about how great it was?

It almost seems like they just rolled with it and decided to see if they could get some good training out of the situation.



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 09:53 AM
link   

originally posted by: DearDiary
Video of the shooting in front of McDonalds.

twitter.com...


The filmer is across the street and randomly zooms in on the shooter before anything has happened yet, then before the shooting starts you can already see 3 people run out of the McD's towards the shooter and then he starts shooting(or already has)and they run away from him. Noone seems to get hit even though they are right in front of him.

(copy from my post in another thread)




It is said that he shot three times in the McDonalds, so the filmer started to film.
And i collected around 10 or 15 videos of that event, i could see that one guy, running away from the McDonalds, was one of the victims, shot in the back.



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 09:54 AM
link   
a reply to: DearDiary

How do you know he randomly zoomed in before anything happened? Maybe the guy was shouting crazy things or just making a scene which caught thr camermans attention so he started recording.

Cant see anyone get shot, but it looks like one of the young men running away is in another photo laying on the floor hacing been shot in the back....



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 09:57 AM
link   
a reply to: DerBeobachter

This may be a good time to gather all the facts and try to create a time-line of the events.

For example, I heard that the police thought that they could be at least 3 attackers, but I didn't hear or see any reference to rifles, only to hearing gun shots.

PS: that information may be on that long thread that was being updated while everything was happening, but I didn't follow that thread, as I was working at that time.



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 09:59 AM
link   

originally posted by: ArMaP
a reply to: DerBeobachter

This may be a good time to gather all the facts and try to create a time-line of the events.

For example, I heard that the police thought that they could be at least 3 attackers, but I didn't hear or see any reference to rifles, only to hearing gun shots.

PS: that information may be on that long thread that was being updated while everything was happening, but I didn't follow that thread, as I was working at that time.


I left a little timelime in the other thread - Police operation underway at Munich mall - but i just used the first mass media timeline i found and "highlighted" the weird things.
edit on 24 7 2016 by DerBeobachter because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 10:03 AM
link   

originally posted by: TonyS
a reply to: DerBeobachter

Well, YOU'RE in Germany.

Surely you can tell what and how your government is massaging information to fit its preferred narrative. I would no more trust pronouncements from the German government than I would dispatches from North Korea. They are spinning everything to their advantage and to persuade the public to a particular viewpoint.

Nothing new there. Or as they say in the US, "Nothing to see here, move along".

I believe what you describe is the rule of thumb of every nation. Not just Germany.



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 10:03 AM
link   

originally posted by: Cobaltic1978
This is the second or third attacke now where the initial narrative has changed after a gunman has been killed.

I appreciate that things will be unclear initially. Eyewitness accounts vary and the authorities need to consider everything that is being told to them.

But, for a few hours from the initial shots until the lone gunman was confirmed dead, the authorities were still claiming they were looking for "Three" gunmen. Why is this, if they now claim those persons with rifles were unmarked Police officers? Surely they would have known this and would have taken this into consideration when briefing the media?



One of the reasonable questions that has to be asked!



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 10:08 AM
link   
I used to be one that believed the official story all the way. Until the last few years in the US . Just too much strange "stuff" (if you know me , you know the word substituted) going on. Why does the OS change so much ? Even days or weeks after the event ? Is it more facts have come to the forefront ? Confusing information ? Or something deeper. Unfortunately those questions may never be answered.



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 10:15 AM
link   
a reply to: Gothmog

That's true, but I find the German Government does the worst job of hiding the fact.



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 10:26 AM
link   
Oh, i forgot one thing, the Richard Gutjahr story!
Richard Gutjahr is a german journalist that coincidentally was live at the Nice attacks and live at the Munich shootings. To make tinfoil hats go completely crazy, he is married to a Mossad agent, as some sources claim:

German journalist Richard Gutjahr, 42, who filmed the scene unfold, said: 'I stood on the balcony, right on the Promenade des Anglais, and saw how people celebrated there, and how suddenly a truck drove through the crowd,' he told AFP on Friday.

www.dailymail.co.uk... tml

Local reporter Richard Gutjahr described the scene at the shopping center as something "out of a bad movie," with the shopping center completely surrounded by police, a helicopter overhead, and police carrying semi-automatic rifles. Gutjahr was not able to confirm reports of deaths or injuries.

www.motherjones.com...

Richard Gutjahr who filmed the Nice France Bastille Day Staged attack is married to Mossad agent and Knesset member Einat Wilf. To quote Mossad agent Richard Gutjahr this video is like something "out of a bad movie".

Don´t know much about the source, never used it, it´s reddit



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 10:30 AM
link   

originally posted by: DerBeobachter
Local reporter Richard Gutjahr described the scene at the shopping center as something "out of a bad movie," with the shopping center completely surrounded by police, a helicopter overhead, and police carrying semi-automatic rifles. Gutjahr was not able to confirm reports of deaths or injuries.

"Local" doesn't mean he was there.



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 10:35 AM
link   

originally posted by: ArMaP

originally posted by: DerBeobachter
Local reporter Richard Gutjahr described the scene at the shopping center as something "out of a bad movie," with the shopping center completely surrounded by police, a helicopter overhead, and police carrying semi-automatic rifles. Gutjahr was not able to confirm reports of deaths or injuries.

"Local" doesn't mean he was there.


Here is a german video of an official german mass media agency(BR/Bayrischer Rundfunk), where the reporter said that his colleague Richard Gutjahr was also eyewitness in Nice as in Munich.



new topics

top topics



 
10
<<   2  3 >>

log in

join