It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

No ISIS Link to Munich Mall Attack

page: 7
15
<< 4  5  6    8 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 09:32 AM
link   

originally posted by: UnBreakable


Anyway, I was responding to a reply where the person's religion was questioned, and supplied a source where if a parent is Muslim, their offspring is considered Muslim.


This is only partially correct, according to the link you provided:


If either, or both, of your children has reached puberty and chosen to convert to any other religion, he is no longer considered a Muslim


I believe the age of 18 would be considered an adult and past puberty. So, this guy would NOT be considered Muslim if he rejected it or converted to another religion. You therefore cannot say for certain that he is Muslim.




posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 10:01 AM
link   

edit on 7jY by UnBreakable because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 10:07 AM
link   

originally posted by: kaylaluv

originally posted by: UnBreakable


Anyway, I was responding to a reply where the person's religion was questioned, and supplied a source where if a parent is Muslim, their offspring is considered Muslim.


This is only partially correct, according to the link you provided:


If either, or both, of your children has reached puberty and chosen to convert to any other religion, he is no longer considered a Muslim


I believe the age of 18 would be considered an adult and past puberty. So, this guy would NOT be considered Muslim if he rejected it or converted to another religion. You therefore cannot say for certain that he is Muslim.


No where did I say for certain he was Muslim.

And who in their right mind converts from Muslim to another religion when the penalty is death?


“Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.” — Bukhari 9.84.57 ‘baddala deenahu, faqtuhulu’



My hopes were soon shattered. A few days later, the Grand Mufti, issued another statement. This time he was speaking in Arabic in Cairo and what he said was completely different : “What I actually said was that Islam prohibits a Muslim from changing his religion and it’s a crime that must be punished.”

sheikyermami.com...



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 10:14 AM
link   

originally posted by: UnBreakable


So then, he was Muslim.



The majority of Muslim scholars (Hanafis, Shaafi‘is and Hanbalis) maintained that the key factor in this regard is that either parent is Muslim, be it the mother or father; the children are then Muslim

www.islamweb.net...


Ummm, I believe this was your post....

And people convert away from Islam all the time. Many of them are younger people.

wikiislam.net...



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 10:35 AM
link   

originally posted by: kaylaluv

originally posted by: UnBreakable


So then, he was Muslim.



The majority of Muslim scholars (Hanafis, Shaafi‘is and Hanbalis) maintained that the key factor in this regard is that either parent is Muslim, be it the mother or father; the children are then Muslim

www.islamweb.net...


Ummm, I believe this was your post....

And people convert away from Islam all the time. Many of them are younger people.

wikiislam.net...



Yes, according to the source, he was declared he is a Muslim by birthright. I didn't write the religious protocol, I just stated what was said according to their idiology.

And are those people from your Wiki source still alive?



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 10:46 AM
link   
a reply to: UnBreakable

"He was Muslim; I never said he was Muslim; according to Islam, he is declared a Muslim"... make up your mind, please.


And are those people from your Wiki source still alive?


Who knows, but the fact is, they have been and are converting.



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 11:08 AM
link   
 


off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Jul, 24 2016 @ 07:58 PM
link   
A few more snippets from various articles in 'Spiegel online'

According to the police he went on a trip to Winnenden and took pictures of locations were the other shooting happened. He also seems to have written some sort of manifesto.

They think that he got his gun via the darknet, it seems to have been a weapon originally used for theater and such, that has been 'reactivated', whatever that means in detail.

Apparently he also liked to play 'Counterstrike', were he used 'Ali' as a nickname, but also 'Amokläufer' (term used for someone who runs amok) and 'Hass' (Hate). According to reports he also expressed his hatred for Turkey and Turkish people as well as ISIS in that Counterstrike-Clan (or wahtever they call themselfes these days). Some other kids that knew him both from gaming and school said that he had no real friends and was often bullied because of his voice/speech and also because he seemed to walk in a funny way.

He has been in psychiatric care for a while for depression and social phobia.



posted on Jul, 25 2016 @ 12:22 AM
link   
a reply to: reldra

The problem is these attacks keep increasing in frequency. BTW, there was another attack in which a Muslim man hacked to pieces a pregnant woman and tried to kill two more before a man driving a BMW ran him over in Germany.

Syrian refugee, 21, hacks PREGNANT woman to death with machete and injures two others before hero BMW driver runs him over in yet another attack in Germany

When i saw the Munich attack, and that the majority of the victims were children.... I really had to stop myself from posting, because it has gotten to a point that almost every other day, or once a week we see a Muslim extremist attack and murder people.

Not all Muslims are extremists, but many seem to subscribe to extremism, more so those coming from regions in which extremist views are normal. And then we get people claim that it is ok to have an open refugee system by which we can't vet who is coming into the U.S. or Europe...



edit on 25-7-2016 by ElectricUniverse because: add and correct comment.



posted on Jul, 25 2016 @ 12:31 AM
link   
a reply to: reldra

... So Europe is also trying to cover these attacks just like the Obama administration is doing... What's new?... By definition any person who murders others due to ideology could also be considered as "mentally troubled"...
edit on 25-7-2016 by ElectricUniverse because: add comment.



posted on Jul, 25 2016 @ 09:01 AM
link   
a reply to: ElectricUniverse

The german gov. tends to cover up any right-winger attack, look into the NSU-terror story and their ridiculous leftwing-terror propaganda during that time.



another attack in which a Muslim


I'm just wondering why people on this site still think he was a muslim when... well... when he simply wasn't. But I guess any Breivik-copycat douchebag is an islamic fundamentalist by now? Is it the War on Terror or the War on Islam, that got through to your head?

Another thread turned into the same kindergarten we see in nearly every topic remotely connected to islam. Why can't you ignorant fools just stick to the facts and topics without smeering those ideology-driven genitals of yours all over the place?

Looks kinda desperate to me, just saying...

edit on 25-7-2016 by PublicOpinion because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 25 2016 @ 09:38 AM
link   

originally posted by: PublicOpinion
a reply to: ElectricUniverse

The german gov. tends to cover up any right-winger attack, look into the NSU-terror story and their ridiculous leftwing-terror propaganda during that time.



another attack in which a Muslim


I'm just wondering why people on this site still think he was a muslim when... well... when he simply wasn't. But I guess any Breivik-copycat douchebag is an islamic fundamentalist by now? Is it the War on Terror or the War on Islam, that got through to your head?

Another thread turned into the same kindergarten we see in nearly every topic remotely connected to islam. Why can't you ignorant fools just stick to the facts and topics without smeering those ideology-driven genitals of yours all over the place?

Looks kinda desperate to me, just saying...


You know, I'll probably get this message deleted as well, but if he was a muslim - so what? The question should be was it a horrific crime based on a twisted theology brainwashed into his mind by a terrorist group (ISIS/Daesh), or did his religion have nothing to do with it as seems to be the case.

Every time over let's say the last decade there have been terrible mass shootings in America by a non muslim, let's say by someone who is of a Christian faith if through baptism if not through actual practice, do Americans say ban all Christians? No. Funny that, isn't it.
edit on 25-7-2016 by uncommitted because: typo



posted on Jul, 25 2016 @ 10:19 AM
link   
a reply to: uncommitted

Maybe 'cause blaiming a religion isn't going to change a thing? Blaim the moon if ya like.



The question should be was it a horrific crime based on a twisted theology brainwashed into his mind by a terrorist group (ISIS/Daesh), or did his religion have nothing to do with it as seems to be the case.


Given all presented facts I don't see why this point isn't clear by now.

Meanwhile our red eyed Interior Minister blaimed all the violence in video games to muddy the waters further. Heck. And I thought weed is still illegal in Germany...
Finding suitable questions to ask is obviously not an easy subject and yet we don't see any debate taking place, do we?

I've got another question. You do realize, that extreme right wingers use the same tactics like our usual suspects? What exactly transpires here for you with regards to the War on Terror, the War on Drugs or the War on Hatecrime?

All those illusions of security achieved one thing and one thing only: more insecurity to witness on a daily basis. And there are you guys, moaning deleted postings while asking yesterdays questions... Yeah, right. Buck it, blaze away!





posted on Jul, 25 2016 @ 12:14 PM
link   
a reply to: PublicOpinion

Errrmmm, I was agreeing with you, did you read it otherwise?



posted on Jul, 25 2016 @ 01:27 PM
link   
a reply to: uncommitted


Not really. I'm just a living provocation and always eager to add my salt, thanks for your replys. Quite inspiring.

You have an awesome ride as well, now!




posted on Jul, 25 2016 @ 07:07 PM
link   
a reply to: PublicOpinion

Calling people who disagree with you ignorant fools heh? And of course, your insults don't seem to attract the attention of the staff...

What the press has stated is that he had no connection to ISIS, and authorities claimed he might have been inspired by far-Right extremist Anders Breiviik.

That's not a statement of fact, it is a false assumption by which the press and the German authorities are trying to hide the fact this man was a Muslim extremist. This does not make every Muslim a bad person, but stop trying to hide the facts to fit your narrative.

The western media tried to change his name to David Sonboly when his name was Ali Daud Sunbulli aka Sonboly. Anybody could be depressed and not go on a rampage murdering everyone in sight...

Ali Daud Sunbullis' facebook page was erased, and it had been purged by Facebook.

But here is a link to an archived photo of Sunbulli's facebook page which shows he was pro Turkey islamists.

archive.is...

I will not post a link to the facebook page of his family, but if you took your time to look for their profile you will see they all carry Syrian, or Turkish flags, and they all are anti-Assad and pro Turkey jihad.

His family is not even Irani, they are of Syrian descent.

conservativepapers.com...


edit on 25-7-2016 by ElectricUniverse because: add and correct comment.



posted on Jul, 25 2016 @ 07:11 PM
link   
a reply to: uncommitted

First of all, where did i say "ban Islam"?... Never wrote that and in fact I have stated several times the difference between Islamic extremism and moderate Muslims.

Second of all, if you look at his family profile you can find they are all pro Turkish Islamists and anti-Assad.

My problem is with the constant attempt by authorities and the media to erase the facts when perpetrators are Muslim extremists.



posted on Jul, 26 2016 @ 02:38 AM
link   

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
a reply to: uncommitted

First of all, where did i say "ban Islam"?... Never wrote that and in fact I have stated several times the difference between Islamic extremism and moderate Muslims.

Second of all, if you look at his family profile you can find they are all pro Turkish Islamists and anti-Assad.

My problem is with the constant attempt by authorities and the media to erase the facts when perpetrators are Muslim extremists.


I wasn't replying to you, apologies if for some reason you thought I was. I've no issue when the fact Muslim extremists are rightly highlighted when guilty - they are over here (UK), more an issue with the fact if someone who is Muslim commits a terrible crime then the automatic assumption is that it must be to do with their faith.



posted on Jul, 26 2016 @ 06:08 AM
link   
a reply to: ElectricUniverse


Well. Why don't you post some facts in support of your point then? Ya know... we saw him on that parkdeck ranting about foreigners/poor folks and as far as I've heard he did write some sort of manifesto just like Breivik did, 5 years after those attacks.
Yes, I think it's foolish to make up a cover-up conspiracy while ignoring all facts. It's not that you disagree with me, you simply can't put up anything in support of your take. Confirmation bias much?

Also, if you can't stand a frank reply regarding your take please do us all a favor and knock yourself out. Or think before you post, just saying. Innocent kids died and here are you folks, capitalizing another event to promote your agenda.



pro Turkey islamists.


You just made that up, didn't you? Not pro chicken?
So he wasn't adding a turkish flag to his fakebook page after the terror attack in Istanbul occured? I know many people did, why do you think he wasn't? Maybe he even did that to trick people with a fake account, as he invited folks with said account to a free meal in the same McDonalds where his attack took place.
There are more assumptions on the table to put those fakebook factoids into context, sadly you didn't even mention them.





edit on 26-7-2016 by PublicOpinion because: (no reason given)

edit on 26-7-2016 by PublicOpinion because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 26 2016 @ 08:12 PM
link   
a reply to: PublicOpinion

I actually did post evidence that Ali was a Muslim. His whole family is Muslim, and he had in his Facebook page the Turkish flag as a background even though he was born in Germany. His family members all have Syrian or Turkish flags on their pages, not to mention the backgrounds they use show at least some of them to not be very moderate at all. The female members of the family have jihabs pointing out the fact the family is Muslim. Ali even lived in a Turkish neighborhood.

I did not link their facebook pages directly, but anyone can find in those links I gave evidence for my statements. BTW, no one should be writing hate mail to his family.

My only purpose to look at the family was to verify whether or not the media and the German authorities were saying the truth, and they are not saying the truth.

His family are pro Turkish and endorse Erdogan. Are you going to tell me Erdogan is a moderate Muslim?


edit on 26-7-2016 by ElectricUniverse because: add and correct comment.

edit on 26-7-2016 by ElectricUniverse because: add comment.




top topics



 
15
<< 4  5  6    8 >>

log in

join