How Many People Were Shot by Open Carriers at the RNC?

a reply to: Snarl

This is convo I've had many times with several of my law enforcement buddies.

originally posted by: projectvxn
a reply to: maria_stardust

A GOOD point.

Irrefutable, as a matter of fact.

I always advise that it is better to spend 500 bucks on a rifle and 2k on training and ammunition than it is to spend 2k on a rifle and 500 on training and ammo.

It's all about priorities.

Absolutely. That's solid advice!

originally posted by: maria_stardust
a reply to: Snarl

This is convo I've had many times with several of my law enforcement buddies.

And my law enforcement friends here love that we are an armed county. Nothing ever happens here. No one gets robbed. (You may get shot) No one gets mugged (you may get shot) No one trespasses and we wave at our neighbors when we drive by. We don't shoot. We wave.

THAT is what Constitutional Carry laws are about.

I am a trained and certified Expert Marksman. (The Air Force gave me a medal.... lol) I don't go into malls, and thin out the clientele. I have ZERO desire to ever kill another human being... ever. I own guns, and I am trained... but, that does not mean that I ever seek to use them to kill another.

I would much rather spend my time chasing after my a$$hole goats.... and my pet turkey

"We are sending a letter to Gov. Kasich requesting assistance from him. He could very easily do some kind of executive order or something -- I don't care if it's constitutional or not at this point," Stephen Loomis, president of Cleveland Police Patrolmen's Association, told CNN. "They can fight about it after the RNC or they can lift it after the RNC, but I want him to absolutely outlaw open-carry in Cuyahoga County until this RNC is over."

I need to write a letter to my governor:

"This may not be entirely legal, but I want you to write an executive order allowing me to rob banks. After a couple of weeks, we can discuss it. No fines, jail time, or prosecution, though."

a reply to: madmac5150

I'm not arguing against the right to carry arms, nor do I belong to the anti-gun camp.

What I am saying is that we should not delude ourselves that open carry is a deterrent against crime, when it clearly isn't.

So all the back-slapping and high-fiving that the RNC was a success for the open carry crowd is self-serving. It's wonderful that nothing devestating occurred. So, yay!

That doesn't change the fact that the Dallas tragedy featured several open carry enthusiasts who were clearly exercising their right to bear arms. Yet that didn't mean a hill of beans to the shooter. So, not a deterrent.

a reply to: madmac5150

I'm not arguing against the right to carry arms, nor do I belong to the anti-gun camp.

What I am saying is that we should not delude ourselves that open carry is a deterrent against crime, when it clearly isn't.

So all the back-slapping and high-fiving that the RNC was a success for the open carry crowd is self-serving. It's wonderful that nothing devestating occurred. So, yay!

That doesn't change the fact that the Dallas tragedy featured several open carry enthusiasts who were clearly exercising their right to bear arms. Yet that didn't mean a hill of beans to the shooter. So, not a deterrent.

originally posted by: maria_stardust
a reply to: madmac5150

I'm not arguing against the right to carry arms, nor do I belong to the anti-gun camp.

What I am saying is that we should not delude ourselves that open carry is a deterrent against crime, when it clearly isn't.

So all the back-slapping and high-fiving that the RNC was a success for the open carry crowd is self-serving. It's wonderful that nothing devestating occurred. So, yay!

That doesn't change the fact that the Dallas tragedy featured several open carry enthusiasts who were clearly exercising their right to bear arms. Yet that didn't mean a hill of beans to the shooter. So, not a deterrent.

Back in 1995 I was stationed at Luke AFB in Phoenix,and my wife was PREGNANT. With twins. I worked the late shift, and she asked me to pick up a stupid watermelon on the way home, because that is what she happened to be craving that night.

I stopped at the local Albertson's market off of 83rd and Indian School Rd. I walked outside with my groceries, and several local gang kids surrounded my car.

I unstrapped my holster, and before I could even draw my weapon, they scattered like roaches.

I never fired a shot. I never drew my weapon. I didn't have to. THAT is the power of Constitutional carry laws... Idaho, Arizona, West Virginia, etc... they all get it.

Chicago has some of the most restrictive gun laws in America... how has that worked out?

a reply to: madmac5150

Ah, but you made a move towards your weapon. That in and of itself can and will work as a deterrent. However, that is a world apart from openly carrying a weapon for what is essentially show.

Unless a person is willing to use their weapon, it is simply a show and tell accessory.

originally posted by: maria_stardust
a reply to: madmac5150

Ah, but you made a move towards your weapon. That in and of itself can and will work as a deterrent. However, that is a world apart from openly carrying a weapon for what is essentially show.

Unless a person is willing to use their weapon, it is simply a show and tell accessory.

True.

There is always the fact that I was trained, and it most likely showed in my eyes. That is why I stress training for firearm owners. We used to teach that in schools...

originally posted by: maria_stardust
a reply to: madmac5150

Ah, but you made a move towards your weapon. That in and of itself can and will work as a deterrent. However, that is a world apart from openly carrying a weapon for what is essentially show.

Unless a person is willing to use their weapon, it is simply a show and tell accessory.

True.

There is always the fact that I was trained, and it most likely showed in my eyes. That is why I stress training for firearm owners. We used to teach that in schools...

If I might add this little tidbit in here.

Depending on the protest, where your protesting, and in what city, state, etc.

Open carrying of firearms in a protest, some places do not allow you to have magazines in the rifle, no ammo, etc.

There was one a few years back up near D.C., or as close to D.C. as they could get with a firearm. (It's illegal to have a gun in D.C. out in public.) The restrictions on that protest was no magazines in the guns, and no chambered rounds.

I dunno the specifics on the Dallas protest, but if they weren't allowed to have magazines, ammo etc, those firearms were nothing but flashy paper-weights, and those boys wouldn't of been of any use.

Just my $0.02.

The Demoncratic party starts picking up tomorrow lets see how they fare. I have a feeling it won't be so nicey nice but you never know.



HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It seems the presence of guns discouraged violent agitators and paid protesters. Imagine that. I mean $50 an hr to go and disrupt others doesn't feel like much when you might have to take a bullet.

a reply to: maria_stardust

I think the deal here is words.

Open carry IS a deterrent. But its not fool proof. A lunatic won't worry about the environment they are in when being a lunatic.

Besides, I don't carry a gun to protect the strangers around me. I carry to protect me and my family. So the only crime Im interested in deterring is that committed against me and mine.

originally posted by: maria_stardust
a reply to: Snarl

Again, how did that work out in Dallas?

Not so well. Even the Open Carry enthusiasts sought shelter, as opposed to standing their ground. Don't get me wrong, it sounds good in theory. Not so well in real life.

It was trained law enforcement and a robot who saved the day.

Only a FOOL would not seek cover when being fired on from a UNKNOWN POSISTION. step 1 find cover. step 2. asses the situation. step 3 formulate a plan of action. step 4 execute. And if possible step 5 terminate.

how many "good guys with a gun" have stopped mass shootings recently ?

that myth should be dead and buried

originally posted by: syrinx high priest
how many "good guys with a gun" have stopped mass shootings recently ?

that myth should be dead and buried

Well considering most happen in Gun free zones not many. Loaded question is loaded.

a reply to: yuppa

Yes, that works well in theory and in real life for those with enough training to think and act in a hostile active shooter situation.

As I mentioned earlier, that doesn't work so well for the average Joe who only practices on the ocassional weekend at their local gun range or who considers picking cans off a log in the woods the epitome of readiness.

Huge difference.

a reply to: madmac5150

Adequate and regular training under stressful scenarios makes all the difference.

a reply to: maria_stardust

The police didn't give them the authority to fire,at the time.
Not to mention it's not our training or battle zone to open fire with.
It's ILLEGAL to do so.
We don't FIRE unless we have to.
COPS had that under control just fine,and for all intents and purposes.