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Did God Abandon Us?

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posted on Jul, 18 2016 @ 09:25 PM
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a reply to: TheChuckster

It's experiences such as yours that make me believe there is a "God" .....a divine Goodness we are connected with in some way. There also seems to be some sort of "Devil" in play, and it/they seem to like to convince people to forgo "Good" or "God"......mirrors seem to be some sort of portal for evil spirits. I think maybe your searching for "faith" may have made you more susceptible to that "evil" that wants you to doubt "God".




posted on Jul, 18 2016 @ 09:55 PM
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I have some issues with the traditional idea of a God.

The main one being that "he" allows so much suffering of people he claims to "love". How could a loving God let babies and children starve to death on a daily basis? How can he stand the suffering, if he loves them so much?

The other problem I have is that we were "created" with all of this human nature stuff, much of it being off limits, and if we even entertain the idea, of whatever "sin" is tempting us, we could be punished for the very thought alone. Why create us that way? Why set us up for failure from the get go? Why set it up so that we have to run to him for forgiveness, for things that he ingrained in us, during our creation, on such a frequent basis?

Were we abandoned? Maybe... But what would be the point? Just leaving his experiment to run amok? Wouldn't an all powerful God have a better handle on the situation?

And, no, I'm not an atheist, just for the record.



posted on Jul, 18 2016 @ 10:13 PM
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originally posted by: daryllyn
I have some issues with the traditional idea of a God.

The main one being that "he" allows so much suffering of people he claims to "love". How could a loving God let babies and children starve to death on a daily basis? How can he stand the suffering, if he loves them so much?

The other problem I have is that we were "created" with all of this human nature stuff, much of it being off limits, and if we even entertain the idea, of whatever "sin" is tempting us, we could be punished for the very thought alone. Why create us that way? Why set us up for failure from the get go? Why set it up so that we have to run to him for forgiveness, for things that he ingrained in us, during our creation, on such a frequent basis?

Were we abandoned? Maybe... But what would be the point? Just leaving his experiment to run amok? Wouldn't an all powerful God have a better handle on the situation?

And, no, I'm not an atheist, just for the record.


That is sort of the same issue I have with the God of Christianity, the Catholic one, the Islam one, if I die and there is something there. I got a bone to pick with it and it better have a damn good explanation other than just "Faith"...

But, I also question the theory of freewill
and what if God broke into an infinite amount of pieces and became us. However, we can not fathom that theory as our understanding is limited and our selfish nature does not allow us to see it as - What if all of humanity puts aside the past, all the hate and differences and works together?

There are so many theories out there and I can not begin to say which is correct, because without truly knowing the answer we should not judge and cast aside other theories?

I don't like the Churches because they take but not truly give, if all the Churches in the world were true to the name. There would be no poverty, no homeless situation and there would be no hate, instead most oppose same sex rights, scientific progress and questioning.

So, you are right Daryllyn there are some issues in religion and the clergy as a whole that needs to be questioned and investigated.

But, What if the experiment is to see if we can become mature enough? So to speak grow up to work as one together? Hmm.

Anyway, I'm just an Atheist with theories



posted on Jul, 18 2016 @ 10:26 PM
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a reply to: TheChuckster




Jonh 14:15-19
15 “If you love me, keep my commands. 16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19 Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live.




God isn’t leaving anyone alone…

All you have to do is seek…

You’re asking the right questions though…IMO


- JC



posted on Jul, 18 2016 @ 10:49 PM
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originally posted by: MrThortan
a reply to: imod02

I always refer to God as an it, for it is not a man, nor women. It is the sum total of all things and none of us are certain what it is. This is not to take away the person hood of God, but more so the lack of human language to accurately define God in proper terms.


Jesus said my father in heaven..... not mommy.....

Pretty clearly written and explained in NT.

I do not see the confusion and why you have it?



posted on Jul, 18 2016 @ 10:57 PM
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originally posted by: ketsuko
Did God abandon us ... or did we abandon Him?


Winner winner chicken dinner!

You hit the nail on the head.

What non believers and some of faith do not realise is that sin keeps God out of your life.

God can not approach sin........one of the reasons his son will place his father's enemies at his feet to use as a foot stool. Once the second death is past, his children will be presented to him and God will return.



posted on Jul, 19 2016 @ 12:06 AM
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a reply to: DeathSlayer

so much for being all powerful.



posted on Jul, 19 2016 @ 01:26 PM
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a reply to: TheChuckster

There may be a god, and there may not be a god. I find it very arrogant that followers of any religion claim that the religion they follow is the "correct" or "right" religion. The belief in archaic books written by groups of men baffles me. The extreme levels that mankind goes to in order to verify to themselves that the religion they follow is true is very telling to me. I believe that this is human nature at it's worst. People despise being wrong, and I think that people's actions to verify that they are "right" throughout history shows that the faith people claim to have is wavering at best. Someone disagrees with Islam? Blow them up. Someone disagrees with Christianity? Burn them at the stake.

Closed mindedness and an unwillingness to look at new evidence or different ideas hinders human evolution. How can people be so sure that they have chosen the correct religion when they have not studied all of the other religions? How can people claim to be right, and others wrong without understanding the other options? Every major religion provides evidence of god by flaunting these ancient books, but only the book they have chosen.

If something good happens to a religious person, it is because god made it happen. If something bad happens, it is because god is testing us and gave us free will.

If there truly is a god, I cannot see that this god is benevolent. Most of us in the west live easy lives filled with little danger or discomfort even at the lowest points of society. Even the homeless in the USA live like kings compared to some people in other countries. If there is a god, he does not care. He does not care about starving Ethiopian children that have no choice other than to starve and die. The list of atrocities and horrors in the world actively discredit any notion of a good and loving god.

If there is a creator, it could be anything. We could be living in a computer simulation. Our universe could be a single cell in a larger organism. We could be living in a dream. We could be living in something else's dream. We could be anything or nothing. We could be living in hell or heaven. The possibilities are endless. The fear of the unknown does not scare me enough to dive into a religion created by man.

If there is a god, I will reserve choosing a specific religion, as there are more chances of choosing the wrong one and burning in hell then of choosing the correct one and being lucky enough to go to heaven.



posted on Jul, 19 2016 @ 01:31 PM
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originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: DeathSlayer

so much for being all powerful.


Sin is, apparently, like Kryptonite to God.



posted on Jul, 19 2016 @ 01:35 PM
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a reply to: windword

NOPE.

God is like a very thorough incinerator to sin.



posted on Jul, 19 2016 @ 01:37 PM
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a reply to: Winstonian

It's not that difficult.

God is quite willing to prove Himself real in the lives of those who put their trust in Him . . . step by step . . . in His ways and timing.

However, He doesn't tend to suffer fools gladly, easily, if at all.



posted on Jul, 19 2016 @ 01:38 PM
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a reply to: Winstonian

And, I don't think you begin to have a lofty enough omniscient perspective from which to

begin to justifiably judge God.

edit on 19/7/2016 by BO XIAN because: added



posted on Jul, 19 2016 @ 02:00 PM
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By the morning light
And by the night at its darkest
Your Lord has neither forsaken you, nor hates you.
Surely what comes after will be better than what was before.
And your Lord will give to you and you will be content.

Did he not find you an orphan and shelter you?
Did he not find you wandering and guide you?
Did he not find you in need and make you self-sufficient?

So do not treat the orphan with harshness,
Nor drive the beggar away,
Rather, proclaim with gratitude the bounty of your Lord.




...is what I was reminded of by your question. So yeah, God hasn't abandoned us.
The beautiful thing about that passage is that even to a nonbeliever, it holds the solution-no, you aren't forsaken or hated, have realisation of the good in your life, and use that as an opportunity to spread it to others- a self-fulfilling system.
edit on 19-7-2016 by babloyi because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 19 2016 @ 02:05 PM
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a reply to: BO XIAN




And, I don't think you begin to have a lofty enough omniscient perspective from which to begin to justifiably judge God.


And yet you want us to believe that you do. And in your loftiness you yourself judge God to be of this and that, of essence, but not of that and this, of essence. Then you proceed to judge those who don't share your judgement of the essence of God.



posted on Jul, 19 2016 @ 02:22 PM
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Both Leonardo Da Vinci and Sandro Botticelli used mirror writing.
Some subtle mystery from the early Renaissance in that case.

Nietzsche believed


“God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. How shall we comfort ourselves, the murderers of all murderers? What was holiest and mightiest of all that the world has yet owned has bled to death under our knives: who will wipe this blood off us? What water is there for us to clean ourselves? What festivals of atonement, what sacred games shall we have to invent? Is not the greatness of this deed too great for us? Must we ourselves not become gods simply to appear worthy of it?”


God is subtle beyond our understanding.



posted on Jul, 19 2016 @ 02:26 PM
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a reply to: BO XIAN

He made me in his image.



posted on Jul, 19 2016 @ 02:37 PM
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a reply to: BO XIAN

Like I said, there may be a god, and may not be a god. I do not claim to know either way.

So I have to believe in something before I can believe in something?

That's the thing, I do not have faith either way. If god would like me to believe in him, than it I guess it is up to him to provide the necessary evidence, which is definitely not the Bible.Qu'ran,Talmud, Book Of Mormon, or Aesop's Fables.

I got kicked out of church when I was in my teens for asking too many questions, and searching for the truth in the bible. It lead me to reading works of faith from other religions, and researching and searching for the evidence that others claim is so readily available. I have seen no such evidence. But if people wish to worship, have at it. I personally do not care until it infringes on other peoples rights, which many organized religious outfits still do to this day. When people come to my house trying to recruit me, which is quite often, I respectfully decline yet I still say "God bless" out of respect for what they believe in.



posted on Jul, 19 2016 @ 02:45 PM
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a reply to: windword

That's one conceivable perspective.

It's not the only one available.

I doubt it's even the most logical.



posted on Jul, 19 2016 @ 04:17 PM
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originally posted by: windword

originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: DeathSlayer

so much for being all powerful.


Sin is, apparently, like Kryptonite to God.


LOLOLOLOL.....
I see the ridiculousness of the whole "God can't be in the presence of sin" argument now. So, to get around that little factor, He requires blood...lots and lots of blood, all from innocent creatures. Hmmm....sounds mucho evil to me.



posted on Jul, 19 2016 @ 04:25 PM
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originally posted by: BO XIAN
a reply to: windword

NOPE.

God is like a very thorough incinerator to sin.




Bull. That's what the Bible tells you.
I swear, every Christian on ATS sounds the same. Have any of you ever thought it through? Like how can committing an EVIL act, somehow be righteous? When I say evil, I mean requiring bloodshed of innocent animals, or asking for the sacrifice of your son, or killing people for the stupidest reasons. Condoning slavery, rape, genocide, etc. Oh yea, it's all "OK", because GOD commanded it or did it Himself.
Sheesh.



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