Spanish PM Mariano Rajoy opposes Scotland EU talks , "if the UK leave, Scotland leaves".

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

That remains to be seen.

You're ignoring that facts , Scotland will not be allowed to join the EU either on it's own or in conjunction with Gibraltar because that would cause problems for member states.

Additionally I do not think Spain would veto it

They would , it's in their national interest.

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: Hazardous1408

originally posted by: crazyewok
a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin
No its not unfair.

Its Democracy get over it.

Scotland had a referendum and it voted stay.

UK hate a referendum and it voted leave.

The votes in and the decisions done so everyone should stop crying and bitching over it!

whole way a vote works is one sides going to lose and your side lost. Get over it!

You sound like an ignorant & petulant child.

Nothing worse than a poor winner, I voted leave by the way, I just thought I'd let you know your massive generalisation and childish retort is pathetic.

So we are meant to disregard the English and Welsh votes and stay because Scotland wants to stay?

I didn't say that or imply it.

I just think there is a more grown up way of going about this division than "nee ner nee ner loser guffaw *insert Facebook meme* get over it".

Maybe that's just me.

Has me wondering who I allied myself with though when I decided to leave the EU.

originally posted by: gortex
a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

That remains to be seen.

You're ignoring that facts , Scotland will not be allowed to join the EU either on it's own or in conjunction with Gibraltar because that would cause problems for member states.

Additionally I do not think Spain would veto it

They would , it's in their national interest.

To be fair, there is no such thing as "National Interest" within the EU.

If any MPs are reading can we have a new referendum please in the UK for ridding ourselves of the Scots? Time to get rid of the Union, they do my nut in cheeky sods. The same happened in Czechslovakia where the majority Czech part devcided to rid itself of a similar troublesome, backward and ungovernable province. Look how well they've done since ridding themselves of their ball and chain.

a reply to: crazyewok

Let me be clear.

1. The Spanish PM is always going to be against a independent Scotland because that sets a precedent for the break up of his own state.

2. This vote shows that Scotland wants to remain as part of Europe and as a nation we are going to be dragged out of the EU this represents a violation of our nations right to self determination.

3. A independent Scotland leaving the UK to go independent as part of Europe does not violate the self determination of any other state as such England and Wales democratic will is still respected.

4. Quite honestly i dont think you have a deep enough understanding of this issue to understand the implications of this fully and just want to go with a "haha Scotland we won" mantra.

originally posted by: Hazardous1408

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: Hazardous1408

originally posted by: crazyewok
a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin
No its not unfair.

Its Democracy get over it.

Scotland had a referendum and it voted stay.

UK hate a referendum and it voted leave.

The votes in and the decisions done so everyone should stop crying and bitching over it!

whole way a vote works is one sides going to lose and your side lost. Get over it!

You sound like an ignorant & petulant child.

Nothing worse than a poor winner, I voted leave by the way, I just thought I'd let you know your massive generalisation and childish retort is pathetic.

So we are meant to disregard the English and Welsh votes and stay because Scotland wants to stay?

I didn't say that or imply it.

I just think there is a more grown up way of going about this division than "nee nee near loser guffaw *insert Facebook meme* get over it".

Maybe that's just me.

Has me wondering who I allied myself with though when I decided to leave the EU.

I'm not going nee nee near loser. I just stating hard fact.

I'm just very a blunt person.


I get people are disapointed. I have freinds in the remain camp and I feel for them but like grown ups they are moved on.

What I have a problem is those in the remain camp trying to block the will of the UK people or demanding second referendums ect

In my opinion its over. Its done.

As a nation we should move on.

originally posted by: ufoorbhunter
If any MPs are reading can we have a new referendum please in the UK for ridding ourselves of the Scots? Time to get rid of the Union, they do my nut in cheeky sods. The same happened in Czechslovakia where the majority Czech part devcided to rid itself of a similar troublesome, backward and ungovernable province. Look how well they've done since ridding themselves of their ball and chain.

& screw over a million and a half Scots who voted leave along with many in the UK.

Without those "cheeky sods" we'd have lost the vote.


Don't look a gift horse in the mouth.

originally posted by: gortex
a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

That remains to be seen.

You're ignoring that facts , Scotland will not be allowed to join the EU either on it's own or in conjunction with Gibraltar because that would cause problems for member states.

Additionally I do not think Spain would veto it

They would , it's in their national interest.

I am not ignoring any facts.

Actually I think i am being quite well grounded on this.

Spain has its own selfish reasons for wanting to keep Scotland as part of the UK which you have not even spoken about yet. Spain is highly relent on EU support, if France and Germany tell Spain to put up with it then that is it.

Also nobody really knows how this would play out but right now it does look like we will have Indy-Reff 2 on the basis of Scotland will stay in the EU.

This Spanish Guy sounds a good man.

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: crazyewok

Let me be clear.

1. The Spanish PM is always going to be against a independent Scotland because that sets a precedent for the break up of his own state.

2. This vote shows that Scotland wants to remain as part of Europe and as a nation we are going to be dragged out of the EU this represents a violation of our nations right to self determination.

3. A independent Scotland leaving the UK to go independent as part of Europe does not violate the self determination of any other state as such England and Wales democratic will is still respected.

4. Quite honestly i dont think you have a deep enough understanding of this issue to understand the implications of this fully and just want to go with a "haha Scotland we won" mantra.

You had your chance to leave in 2014!
You voted to stay!

We cant keep having referendums!
A independent Scotland in the EU sounds like a oxymoron to me. Going from 69MP's out of 600 to 6 MEP out of 700 in the EU doesn't seem live a improvement in Independence.

a reply to: Hazardous1408

To be fair, there is no such thing as "National Interest" within the EU.

Of course there is , Spain don't want to find themselves in the position England is in , the region of Catalonia wants to beak away from Spain and an independent state like Scotland joining the EU fresh from leaving the UK give them hope of the same deal.

Scottish independence would mean just that , an independent Scotland outside of the UK and EU.

originally posted by: ufoorbhunter
If any MPs are reading can we have a new referendum please in the UK for ridding ourselves of the Scots? Time to get rid of the Union, they do my nut in cheeky sods. The same happened in Czechslovakia where the majority Czech part devcided to rid itself of a similar troublesome, backward and ungovernable province. Look how well they've done since ridding themselves of their ball and chain.

So your argument for Scottish independent is that Scott's are cheeky sods that you want to get rid off

Real mature and deep political reasoning there.....

dp

Sturgeon is an idiot !

She thinks everyone is going to bend over backwards for Scotland !

She got no chance!

I feel for Scotland having her , all the EU are laughing at her more than farage.

a reply to: crazyewok

There is blunt and there is braggadociosness.

We should move on, I agree.


Bluntly put, I'm sick of both sides since the result...
It hasn't been a grown up debate.

It's been snidey back patting, casual racism, boasting, and on the other side whinging, and false accusations even a fraudulent petition.



Everyone needs to grow up IMO.


Let Scotland have another referendum, I have no doubt they'll choose the UK over Europe.
& it will be the end of Sturgeon, thank the Lord.

a reply to: crazyewok

We cant keep having referendums!

emmmm yeah you can.....

Especially if there has been a huge shift in the political land scape that has chanced the public opinion.

originally posted by: gortex
Nicola Sturgeon has been in Europe today meeting with senior EU officials about an independent Scotland joining or remaining in the EU , Sturgeon believes she can gain entry to the club after cutting ties with England but she ignores that fact that Spain has in the past said they would oppose an independent Scotland in the EU.

Today Spain has reiterated its position by saying it was "extremely against" membership for Scotland without England.

Mr Rajoy said after a summit of EU leaders in Brussels that he wanted to be "very clear Scotland does not have the competence to negotiate with the European Union".

He added: "Spain opposes any negotiation by anyone other than the government of United Kingdom. "I am extremely against it, the treaties are extremely against it and I believe everyone is extremely against it. If the United Kingdom leaves... Scotland leaves."
www.bbc.co.uk...

Welcome to the real world Nicola , the grass isn't greener on the other side.

Good god please switch the brain on :

S P A I N . . . . . G I B R A L T E R

Do you not think there might be a bit of self interest with the Spanish in ensuring parts of the UK don't split off and become members of the EU ? Gibralter has already thrown into the discussions that it should be bye bye England and everyone else remains !

Now please don't tell me that Gibralter's 96% vote for remain should be ignored since the UK voted leave because that is dumb beyond words. There is a massive difference between Gibraltar and the UK mainland.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

They always go on about independent Scotland........................ Let them have it. I have no reason like most Brits to ever set foot in the place and rely on nothing from there so if they want to go good on them. I just can't take on more Salmond/Sturgeon types on my TV. Let em go Mercy They can have a few old frigates and flintlocks and some mill equipment to start making more kilts

a reply to: gortex

The whole reason we voted leave is because there is no National Interest.

You're contradicting your vote.

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: crazyewok

Let me be clear.

1. The Spanish PM is always going to be against a independent Scotland because that sets a precedent for the break up of his own state.

2. This vote shows that Scotland wants to remain as part of Europe and as a nation we are going to be dragged out of the EU this represents a violation of our nations right to self determination.

3. A independent Scotland leaving the UK to go independent as part of Europe does not violate the self determination of any other state as such England and Wales democratic will is still respected.

4. Quite honestly i dont think you have a deep enough understanding of this issue to understand the implications of this fully and just want to go with a "haha Scotland we won" mantra.

Yes but he posted a 'funny' picture so he must be right, isn't that how it works?

Now I think about it I don't know why we bother with any form of political debate, just settle everything by who has the best internet meme...