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Why We Should Not Be Transitioning Children.....

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posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 08:40 AM
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a reply to: samerulesapply

What the experts say:


It was traditionally thought to be a psychiatric condition meaning a mental ailment. Now there is evidence that the disease may not have origins in the brain alone.

Studies suggest that gender dysphoria may have biological causes associated with the development of gender identity before birth.


www.news-medical.net...



Gender dysphoria is a mental condition but is not a mental disorder.

Treatment is a multidisciplinary approach. The team includes a mental health professional trained in gender dysphoria, a neuropsychiatrist, a psychologists, counsellors, behavioral and occupational therapists and an endocrinologist who specializes in hormones.

"Hormonal interventions to block the pubertal development of children with gender dysphoria are effective and sufficiently safe to alleviate the stress of gender dysphoria," said the study's lead author, Henriette Delemarre-van de Waal, MD, PhD, a professor of pediatric endocrinology at Leiden University Medical Center, Leiden, The Netherlands.

"Reversible hormone treatment can relieve the psychological suffering of youth with gender dysphoria and allows the adolescent time to explore whether permanent hormone treatment and sex reassignment surgery is the best option," she said.


www.news-medical.net...


Gender dysphoria in adolescence may be accompanied by depressed mood, anxiety, and behaviour
problems, all of which can considerably heighten the adolescent’s distress. The Standards of Care
outlined by the World Professional Association for Transgender Health (WPATH, formerly the Harry
Benjamin International Gender Dysphoria Association; Meyer et al., 2001) clearly recommends against
physical interventions before the age of 16. They recommend that surgery only be performed after the
age of 18 and after the individual has lived in their desired gender role for at least two years. Pubertydelaying
hormones are sometimes considered for adolescents so that they might have more time to
explore their gender identity before experiencing the physical changes that come with puberty (CohenKettenis,
Delemarre-van de Waal, & Gooren, 2008).


www.cpa.ca...


The relative contributions of genetic and environmental factors to the development of gender identity have been debated. Twins were studied that are concordant or discordant for gender identity status in order to provide clarification of this issue. An extensive library search yielded reports of 27 male and 16 female sets concordant or discordant for transsexuality. An Internet bulletin board search and clinical contact requests for participants in a survey of twins in which one or both transitioned located 69 new twin pairs. In addition to asking about matters associated with gender, these new twins were asked about their transition, rearing, and sexual practices. Combining data from the present survey with those from past-published reports, 20% of all male and female monozygotic twin pairs were found concordant for transsexual identity. This was more frequently the case for males (33%) than for females (23%). The responses of our twins relative to their rearing, along with our findings regarding some of their experiences during childhood and adolescence show their identity was much more influenced by their genetics than their rearing.

www.hawaii.edu...


Why not wait to see if gender dysphoria resolves during or after puberty? Lorem Ipsum
They worry that these adolescents’gender identities or physical dysphoria may change during or following puberty. For many gender non-conforming, gender fluid, or gender diverse children, puberty blocking treatment is indeed not necessary or appropriate [14, 16]. However, doctors and clinicians specializing in the care of transgender adolescents point out that there is no evidence that the changes associated with puberty are helpful at resolving strong and consistent physical dysphoria. In contrast, preliminary research suggests that when strong and consistent physical dysphoria is present, delaying treatment is linked to higher rates of depression, anxiety, eating disorders, and sucidality.These mental health difficulties also can negatively impact social and academic functioning and distract from identity development in other areas [3, 4, 5, 14].
In addition, it is more difficult to align the body with one’s affirmed gender once physical changes in secondary sex
characteristics occur, especially for male-bodied individuals. Changes in facial structure, facial hair, Adams apple, and
voice will not reverse with hormone treatment once puberty is complete, which can make it very difficult for some affirmed females to have their gender correctly identified and respected. In addition, the medical procedures associated with altering these features are often expensive, painful, and time consuming (e.g., electrolysis, facial feminization). For both affirmed males and females, puberty blockers followed by cross-sex hormones helps to prevent the need for “top” surgery and produces a final height and body frame more in line with affirmed gender. These outcomes cannot be accomplished by only using cross-sex hormones. Additionally, while research suggests that rates of post-surgical regret are generally very low, those who do experience regret were more likely to have received care at older age. Regrets also appear to be more common among those who experience complications during surgery as well as those who experience difficulty “passing” as their affirmed gender, most likely due to higher rates of experiencing discrimination and violence [18, 19, 20, 28]
In light of the irreversible changes that occur during puberty, specialists who work with transgender adolescents
emphasize that “wait and see” approaches are not neutral responses to persistent gender dysphoria. That being
said, in a minority of cases, adolescents and/or families may initially express unrealistically high expectations for puberty
blockers. It is important to note that while extremely helpful in many cases, co-occurring mental health difficulties may
persist even after treatment. Transgender individuals also are likely to continue to face unique adjustment-related
challenges throughout adolescence and adulthood (e.g., navigating social stigma, managing disclosure). For these reasons,
providers also emphasize the importance of building and maintaining supportive social and professional networks for the
adolescent as well as their family [3, 4, 5, 6]


www.impactprogram.org...

Just a few examples of research to show that :

a) it is becoming more apparent that gender dysphoria is biological, not psychological

b) treating children with severe gender dysphoria by giving them puberty blockers, then hormone therapy is an acceptable and necessary treatment.

This is not according to me; this is according to EXPERTS.

edit on 9-7-2016 by kaylaluv because: (no reason given)




posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 08:40 AM
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originally posted by: veracity
a reply to: samerulesapply

I'm just fine with the younger generation thinking it's cool. Better that than hateful shaming. However, I would not be ok with a confused teen trying to transition just to be cool...I don't think that is happening tho.


Except there was no massive "hateful shaming" from the youth towards transgendered.



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 08:45 AM
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originally posted by: veracity
a reply to: samerulesapply

I'm just fine with the younger generation thinking it's cool. Better that than hateful shaming. However, I would not be ok with a confused teen trying to transition just to be cool...I don't think that is happening tho.


This is why it is of the utmost importance to have the kid in therapy with someone who specializes in gender dysphoria. These therapists have studied it and worked with it for a long time, and they know the signs of true dysphoria verses something else going on. If a kid was just a little confused due to trying to be hip, or due to a traumatic childhood, therapy will usually help to work that stuff out.



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 08:52 AM
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a reply to: kaylaluv

Again!

We've gone over this..100 years ago an expert could diagnose you by feeling out the shape of your skull...and treat you by bloodletting and slapping leeches onto you...we now know that's stupid.

You already admitted earlier that we're still learning about this stuff, yet you take the information that's currently available and latch onto it as absolute fact.

Not at all subjective by any standard.



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 08:55 AM
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a reply to: veracity

I have already made my position clear on this...read back.

I've no qualms with anyone being themselves...my issue is specifically with a certain lifestyle being promoted to the young as if it's inconsequential...it clearly isn't

I think what we see among the youth of today is in a large part due to what they're seeing on television, films, hearing in music...and being taught in schools.

I don't understand why people are so upset that I and many other people feel this way.

Because the sad reality is, people like me are most definitely losing this fight.

They're getting what they want and it isn't enough...no we want our own way and we also want you to be happy about it...and never say anything or speak out against it.

I'll die kicking and screaming.



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 08:59 AM
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a reply to: samerulesapply

What the research shows:

No treatment at all of transgender children leads to depression, anxiety, suicide.

Treating transgender children with counseling, puberty blockers and hormones leads to happier healthier children.

This is a fact.

Some day, maybe a hundred years from now, we may be able to do some re-wiring in the brain while the fetus in the womb to cure gender dysphoria. But what do we do with children who are suffering NOW? The research tells us that treating the children with counseling, puberty blockers and hormones helps them. Why not help them? What do you have against helping children who have true gender dysphoria by using the current standard accepted treatment, when the research shows it helps them?



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 09:01 AM
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a reply to: kaylaluv

I can go back right now and quote the part where I said they should be treated.

You countered by asking me what treatment they should get, again projecting this idiotic notion that I can only partake in this thread if I'm some medical expert.

I know not of their treatment because I don't suffer this condition.

do I think we've reached the pinnacle of the possible medical or therapeutic applications that could be used? No...do I think we'll ever reach that point if we simply give in and resign to the fact that it's normal and that's just how it is, and it should be celebrated? No...I think the current mindset is that....screw it, we like it this way.

Yeah, it's normal.



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 09:04 AM
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a reply to: kaylaluv

And to reiterate my point for the billionth time - you have selective blindness.

I don't want anyone to suffer, my beef is specifically with this idea that it's some choice or trendy lifestyle, it being pushed on kids as if it isn't an issue when it clearly is.

My beef isn't with the trans people, per se, but with the propaganda and the bull# being told to kids in schools...with gender studies, talking to kids about the concept of gender before they even give a crap wat it means or understand it.

You know fine well what my point is, I've been making it for a while now, you're deliberately choosing not to see it because it doesn't fit your mindset.

I'm sorry dictatorship isn't working out for you, maybe you ain't cut out for it...you're not even slightly manipulative in this regard, just a broken record.



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 09:12 AM
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a reply to: samerulesapply

You're as wrong as you can be.

Gender dysphoria is constantly being researched. We know much more about it today than we did 50 years ago. We are continuing to learn about it. The more we learn, the more we believe that its cause is biological, not psychological. We are still learning, but we have to work with what we know now.

We are still researching ways to fight cancer. We are learning more every day. But right NOW, we use standard treatment that works better than anything else - chemotherapy and surgery. Will there be a new standard treatment a hundred years from now for curing cancer? Very probably. Doesn't mean we shouldn't treat it the best way we know how NOW.



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 09:14 AM
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a reply to: samerulesapply

One doesn't get true gender dysphoria from reading about it in a magazine, or watching a movie with a transgender person in it, or from hearing about it at school. If you would read the research, you would know that.



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 09:18 AM
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a reply to: JoshuaCox

its cool.

All this nonsense only makes it easier to see who is a freaking moron.

If suddenly, like the flash fad it is, if you find yourself looking at your kids after the barrage of societal preassure to mess around with their identity.....then you are a moron and I want to know.

I want to know so as to avoid contact with you. So I can ignore and shun you.

call me anti-social. For that kind of mindless dumbass I am.

Stop acting like kids need anything but discipline, structure, trust and love.

The rest was invented in spurts of social engineering.

Then one day these social engineers make up whatever mess they want about a percieved enemy, or my kind, and suddenly we have a nation of willing assholes to do as told about it.

They already screw with their own kids childhood. What WOULDNT they do to us?

Enemy.


edit on 7 9 2016 by tadaman because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 09:24 AM
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a reply to: kaylaluv

You'll know more about it tomorrow than you do today.

I'm wrong about what? that it's morally corrupt to propagate perversions among the youth?

I'm sure you believe that 100%, for you to disagree with that statement would be to contradict yourself at a fundamental level...I think we're beyond even discussing this matter in a civil manner...you think one thing, I think another...you are welcome to it.

I, apparently...am not.

Case closed.



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 09:34 AM
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a reply to: samerulesapply

You're wrong that the medical world has just "given up" on learning more about gender dysphoria.

You're wrong that kids get true gender dysphoria from hearing about it at school.

You're wrong that kids with true gender dysphoria are better off not getting any treatment.

You're wrong that gender dysphoria is just some "sick perversion".

And with that - the case IS closed.



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 09:57 AM
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a reply to: kaylaluv

No it isn't...you again made false claims on my behalf...I never said the medical field had given up, quite the opposite.

I just stated in my very last response to you that you will know more tomorrow than you do today - ignored! No, I claimed that you and certain others have resigned to this notion, that we know enough to know how to deal with it...and you do.

It's in every damn response you've composed thus far.

Nor did I claim that kids get gender dysphoria from hearing about it. I'm pretty sure there are genuine cases, I never once refuted this...but it does influence young people. You aren't exactly denying that fundamental truth,. but you won't admit it, either.

Again you are claiming I said GD kids should not get treatment despite my having said the opposite in this very thread - multiple times.....ignored!

You're wrong the I claimed GD was some sick perversion - show me where I siad that.

I said that pushing it onto kids, oe 'educating' them about it is a form of sexual abuse, andit is.

You twist everything, you pick up on nonsense points to try and score some lame goal in a non-argument.

You're easily one of the most outwardly twisted people I've had a debate with on ATS...even though posterity trumps you - all I';ve said still stands, can be read again. Anyone who reads this entire thread and reaches your last post will know that you are as disingenuous as a person can possibly be.

Like I said - you are welcome to your opinions and I am not.

Now enfore your dictatorship by physical means or simply acccept that I and many others hold opposing views. I know it's hard for you to come to this realisation that you wield zero control over me and many others, but that's life.

you sould have gotten used to it by now.



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 10:21 AM
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a reply to: samerulesapply

We deal with gender dysphoria the way we know how to deal with it today. The way we know how to deal with it today is therapy, combined with puberty blockers and then hormones. This is the way that works best in dealing with transgender children TODAY. No one here has said that they are resigned to that as being the way to treat it forever. Maybe it is, maybe it isn't - no one can tell what future studies and medical breakthroughs will tell us. But we have to deal with it TODAY, and TODAY, the best way is therapy, combined with puberty blockers and then hormones.

You say "treatment", but you don't agree with the standard acceptable treatment. That is, therapy, combined with puberty blockers and then hormones. Am I wrong? Do you actually agree with the standard acceptable treatment of therapy, combined with puberty blockers and then hormones for kids who have been diagnosed with true gender dysphoria?

You said it was "morally corrupt to propagate perversions among the youth". What "perversions" are you talking about? I can only assume you are talking about transgender people and gender dysphoria, as that is the topic of this thread, is it not?

Educating kids about things like sexual orientation and gender dysphoria is not sexual abuse at all. Not in any form. Nor is educating kids about the responsibilities of sex and having children. Educating kids about gender dysphoria will not make any kid have gender dysphoria. Your insistence on bringing up the poster who said their kid claimed to have gender dysphoria all of a sudden tells me you think that educating kids about gender dysphoria will cause them to get it or think they have it. They will not get it from anything said at school, and if they are confused enough to "think" they have it but don't, a little therapy will surely correct that.

Look, if your personal opinion is that it's wrong to be transgender, you have a right to your opinion. But don't state things that just aren't true. The facts are, trans kids are a real thing, no kid gets gender dysphoria from learning about it at school, and the best treatment TODAY for trans kids is therapy, combined with puberty blockers and then hormones. Surgery may come later, depending on the individual.



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 10:29 AM
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a reply to: kaylaluv

You just keep putting words in my mouth.

Where did I say I don't agree with the standard of treatment, I siad we're yet to reach the pinnacle, there's more to learn, you even acknowledge that yourself.

so on one hand, you reckon we're doing more research and will learn more...on the other hand you think we already understand this enough to say definitively how we can successfully treat it...your head appears to be all over the damn place...are you even READING what I'm typing?

I don't think you are.

I think you suffer from vision dysphoria...I'm away now because debating this issue with you is like nutting a cement wall...it's giving me a headache.

Just you continue making up stuff on my behalf...it's saturday night, I'm finished work and out of here.

Enjoy!



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 10:42 AM
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a reply to: samerulesapply

My head is in the same place as it always was. We should treat kids with gender dysphoria the best way we know how to TODAY, and that is with therapy, combined with puberty blockers and then hormones, with possible surgery later on. As we learn more, we may change that treatment, but TODAY it is the best we have and it helps trans kids tremendously.

And don't try to pretend you are accepting and tolerant of trans people. You tried to call me an "it" when you thought I was a transgender person, and you absolutely refused to address Freija as she or her. That tells us all how you feel about the subject.

I think you know you are wrong, and are just trying to save face by changing your argument and insulting me. That's cool, but I'm going to correct you anyway. Someone else might be reading these posts and I want to make sure the facts get out.



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 11:00 AM
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originally posted by: kaylaluv
Someone else might be reading these posts and I want to make sure the facts get out.
The facts have been out since the beginning of time. Nature doesn't lie or make things up for a laugh, people however do.



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 11:11 AM
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a reply to: liammc

So you think that people who suffer from gender dysphoria are making it up for a laugh? You think medical health experts who have been researching and studying this for years are just making things up for a laugh?

More ignorance.



posted on Jul, 9 2016 @ 11:22 AM
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originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: liammc

So you think that people who suffer from gender dysphoria are making it up for a laugh? You think medical health experts who have been researching and studying this for years are just making things up for a laugh?

More ignorance.
Not just for a laugh no, I think they make it up for a number of reasons. If a child is making the claim then I think their parents (or parent most likely) is to blame.

There is no such thing as gender dysphoria, and no amount of mumbo jumbo science will convince me otherwise.




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