Society is forced to be accepting of gays & transgenders.

a reply to: SisterDelirium



considering the title of the op - society is being FORCED to accept gays and transgender. it's my right to think this person is being a pansy. forced, give me a break!

i would LOVE some examples of this force being exerted on the op, but she hasn't come back to explain that one.

essentially you're asking me to be pc! sorry, but if you don't think gays deserve the same rights as i do i will think you're backwards, always, simple as that. i won't hate you for it but i'll sure as hell think it.

originally posted by: veracity
a reply to: ~Lucidity

That crossed my mind too, are these people upset that they cannot go up to a gay couple holding hands and whisper in their ears..."you are disgusting and I don't agree with you"

???

Is that what you want? to be a jerk?

Yep. Maybe it's some shift in society that's empowered so many to speak freely and openly, be politically incorrect, and so on and so forth, much of which the internet and social media can take the credit for. Problem is, that shift doesn't account for one or two things.

Just because you can say it doesn't mean what you said will necessarily matter much to anyone else or won't cause blowback.

Just because you can say it doesn't mean you should.

originally posted by: knoxie
a reply to: SisterDelirium

considering the title of the op - society is being FORCED to accept gays and transgender. it's my right to think this person is being a pansy. forced, give me a break!

i would LOVE some examples of this force being exerted on the op, but she hasn't come back to explain that one.

essentially you're asking me to be pc! sorry, but if you don't think gays deserve the same rights as i do i will think you're backwards, always, simple as that. i won't hate you for it but i'll sure as hell think it.

Ok, first off, if you're a big defender of "the gays", using pansy as a slur is pretty amusing.

Next, when every discussion online or over the airwaves basically equates anyone who does not endorse the gay lifestyle as the greatest thing since sliced cheese with the KKK...yes, that's annoying. It does feel like a force silencing any countering viewpoints.

No, I'm asking you to develop manners. There's a difference between being politically incorrect and being rude.

As an example, your comments, thus far are politically correct for the age we live in but fairly rude. Meanwhile, I'm making an effort to be civil, but no effort to be politically correct.

a reply to: ~Lucidity

Also I believe that what all these people really mean when they say "we are being forced into accepting gays" is "dammit, can't all these gays remain hidden in shame like they used to"?

What is actually a return to a more ethical situation, they see it as a loss of their personal right, the right to be a hateful person.

Sorry, being hateful isn't a right. It's a nuisance to society.

originally posted by: SpaceGoatFart
a reply to: ~Lucidity

Also I believe that what all these people really mean when they say "we are being forced into accepting gays" is "dammit, can't all these gays remain hidden in shame like they used to"?

What is actually a return to a more ethical situation, they see it as a loss of their personal right, the right to be a hateful person.

Sorry, being hateful isn't a right. It's a nuisance to society.

Very true, unfortunately

originally posted by: veracity
a reply to: ~Lucidity

That crossed my mind too, are these people upset that they cannot go up to a gay couple holding hands and whisper in their ears..."you are disgusting and I don't agree with you"

???

Is that what you want? to be a jerk?

Maybe, for some. For me, personally, it's freedom from having my religion and sexuality constantly mocked, maligned and derided in the public forum that I would appreciate. And I think the world would be a better place if bashing anyone was considered bad behavior....not just one group or another. We should play nice in the sandbox of life. And that standard should hold for gays as much as straights and Christians as much as Muslims or Atheists.

a reply to: Gryphon66

Same with trans* folks. Trans* folks just are. They exist. In terms of you being "ok" with that, what's the other option?

Right! This is what I always anxiously wonder...what is it that people who are so angry about LGBT existence feel like they are missing out on or prohibited (by law) to do?

Are you going to chase someone down that you think is Trans* and, what, spit on them? Tell them you don't think they have a right to be? What do you want to be able to do about someone who is Trans* that you now perceive you would be judged harshly for?

This made me LOL, I'm still stifling chuckles. I laugh but this kind of thing is what I'm constantly even if mildly concerned about in public. So far though of all the places I've been I haven't really noticed anyone staring, gawking, pointing or otherwise throwing shade in my direction.

The occasional mis-gender here or there but from what I sensed of those situations they always seemed to be benign in nature and a simple and forgivable slip up met with a playful scowl and smirk. I've heard an older and unattractive woman once whisper to her dinner companion how I was not a woman. I shot her a smile as I walked by and that was it, didn't berate her or otherwise acknowledge her with anything other than a smile. That was kind of early on in my transition and my face has definitely become softer and more feminine with the help of estrogen over time.

a reply to: SisterDelirium
Sorry but...
if you were strong in your faith and sexuality then you would not feel threatened, maybe you have some work to do spiritually

a reply to: SisterDelirium


if you're countering viewpoints are to take rights away from people i don't really care if you get offended by referencing bigots during the civil rights movement.


so the op feels she's being forced to accept people and i'm the rude one who isn't being civil. ok.

a reply to: SisterDelirium

But people on here constantly mock other peoples views on politics, sports, science (I know, "view" on science, ignore it) etc. I don't understand why one part of what a person thinks has special priority? Especially when that thing itself prides itself on the idea of faith and almost always has an intellectual siege mentality (Us (The true believers) vs Them (everyone else). There are the extreme of course who seem to almost relish criticism of their religion as vindication of what they do or believe.

I think it's a dangerous road to have intellectual subdivisions within a freedom of analysis, investigation, debate and speech.

No matter what people keep implying, it's not illegal (in most Western countries) for people to voice their opinion of sensitive matters whether they be religiously influenced or not. It is however illegal to abuse people or not allow them to avoid that opinion if they so wish.

I find this a strange comparison: upset about religious criticism but wanting to criticism who people can spend their lives with?

a reply to: veracity

That's the part that I can never understand. How shaky are christian foundations that somebody doing something in a whole other house outside of their eyes can somehow make things different for them?

If someone else's marriage 'ruins' the sanctity of your marriage...then YOUR marriage is the problem...

Amazing how we are talking about how marriage equality will end all times yet the whole catholic priest issue and protection of said priests is not causing issues

a reply to: KyoZero

for realz man,

The problem is within themselves. If gay rights or even a gay couple walking down the street hand n hand violates your whole "christian" religion point of view...then you are not a real Christian bc Jesus does not want you to judge.

You can no longer walk around using that as an excuse to hate anymore. You are literally tearing off your mask and revealing the demon inside of you when you judge and hate.

Jesus would be ashamed, and the devil is smiling...please let love win within your hearts.

a reply to: KyoZero

Catholicism is a bit more accepting about homosexuality than before.


Not yet enough, but at least it's going in the right direction.

They can't continue for long to pretend to ignore that, just as in the general population, some priests are actually more attracted to men. Especially when said priests are becoming more vocal about it.

The problem will still come from the more radical Christian sects (and Muslim or Jews) but then it's not the only problem we have with those more judgemental and literalist and radical Abrahamic strains.

Hopefully they don't represent the whole of these religions

a reply to: SpaceGoatFart

And most are Pedos, whats your point?

You can lie to get in, as most do, just look at any Seminary school exit polls. Most grads are secular and see it as a career, not a crusade.

Says nothing about the Church

originally posted by: veracity
a reply to: SisterDelirium
Sorry but...
if you were strong in your faith and sexuality then you would not feel threatened, maybe you have some work to do spiritually

I don't feel threatened. Annoyed maybe, but not threatened.

It's just a lot of schoolyard taunts and insults coming from a bunch of people who need near constant attention and validation for their lifestyle choices. I tend to view it the same way I would a small child screaming "notice me notice me notice me look at me look at me look at me...watch me now...I can do THIS".

It's not what people do in their bedrooms that irritates me, it's the constant media drum to ENDORSE other people's bedroom behavior.

If you read what I've said previously, I want the government out of the marriage business to allow for pretty much anything/everything without another social justice flip-out. Think about it: government stops getting involved in a religious ceremony and sticks to contracts and that appeases 1) the religious who want no part of it 2) the LGBTQ who want to marry more than one person 3) polygamists 4) adults in incestuous relationships. And the most beautiful part? No sloganeering, no protests, no flag flying... just paperwork. Which, as far as I'm concerned, is the only part the government should handle in the matter. Which, is probably a more liberal-minded attitude than most would be comfortable with.

I'd personally prefer a world where people don't have to make others feel worse so that they can feel better. It's fine to disagree, but don't constantly poke/taunt/insult people who just aren't that into you. I mean, so what? So what if there are people who like traditional lifestyles and values? As long as they're not hurting you, what is their opinion, their worship service or their "vanilla" bedroom to you? Let it alone. Be nice.

originally posted by: yes4141
a reply to: SisterDelirium

But people on here constantly mock other peoples views on politics, sports, science (I know, "view" on science, ignore it) etc. I don't understand why one part of what a person thinks has special priority? Especially when that thing itself prides itself on the idea of faith and almost always has an intellectual siege mentality (Us (The true believers) vs Them (everyone else). There are the extreme of course who seem to almost relish criticism of their religion as vindication of what they do or believe.

I think it's a dangerous road to have intellectual subdivisions within a freedom of analysis, investigation, debate and speech.

No matter what people keep implying, it's not illegal (in most Western countries) for people to voice their opinion of sensitive matters whether they be religiously influenced or not. It is however illegal to abuse people or not allow them to avoid that opinion if they so wish.

I find this a strange comparison: upset about religious criticism but wanting to criticism who people can spend their lives with?

No one's view has special priority. That's precisely my point. Right now, the dominant attitude appears to be, at least media-wise, is that Christians are dumb, backward people who do stupid things like enjoying monogamous, heterosexual relationships. As a result it's en vogue to really pillory those values. If the same vitriol is expressed toward LGBTQ or racial groups, it's HATE speech.

I'm not championing Christian worldview at the moment, if anything I'm just mentioning that civility on both sides would be in order.

The frustration of the OP is real. It's very annoying to want to go along and get along, but then feel like 24/7 media is trying to drum into your head that you're evil if you don't ENDORSE a lifestyle you feel goes against your deepest values. It's not enough to simply agree to disagree. Nothing less than full assent to the rightness of gay sex will do.

If you don't want people to care what you do in the bedroom, in essence, don't put the webcam in there and broadcast ad nauseum.

a reply to: SpaceGoatFart

oh don't fear

I don't judge the group by examples. I know many Catholics are fine people...my whole point is how is it that pedophilia by Catholic leaders garners a fraction of the attention that anti-gay rhetoric gets

originally posted by: SisterDelirium

No one's view has special priority.

Wrong. You are definitely going to get a priority on a view that makes more sense to society. If you are purporting that slavery should have never ended, I'm not going to listen to your standpoint for very long. It's not like you're the first person to bring up the topic; don't be so arrogant to think so. It's nothing that we haven't heard.

That's precisely my point. Right now, the dominant attitude appears to be, at least media-wise, is that Christians are dumb, backward people who do stupid things like enjoying monogamous, heterosexual relationships. As a result it's en vogue to really pillory those values. If the same vitriol is expressed toward LGBTQ or racial groups, it's HATE speech.

Examples? I have seen this exactly nowhere.

The frustration of the OP is real.

Being frustrated does not mean you ave a legitimate reason to be frustrated.

My roommate gets frustrated with me every time I ask her for her half of the rent, as if it's my fault that the beginning of the month is happening every 30 days.

This girl in the OP is frustrated that she can't criticize someone's sexual orientation without being criticized herself. Sounds pretty spoiled to me.

If you don't want people to care what you do in the bedroom, in essence, don't put the webcam in there and broadcast ad nauseum.

Again, what in God's name are you talking about?

99.9% of all broadcasting/marketing/general conversation assumes a heterosexual. That's more representation than there are heterosexuals.

So, you get your cake and eat it, and then chime in on how someone else got a sliver of cake and is eating it and moan about how it's not right.

And how you have "the right" to say so.

And you do have the right to say so.

But don't complain when they chime back in reference to your bratty standpoint.

a reply to: SisterDelirium

people do not mock "christians" for being monogamous and believing in god, they mock them for being bigoted, racist and for putting up billboards that say "Lets make America WHite again".

Christianity is a wonderful religion, but many (not saying you do) like to hate and judge then go hide behind the bible thinking they are justified.

Jesus would not like that.

a reply to: SisterDelirium

I do understand that your frustrations should be towards the media and not the actual groups of people, if that is what you mean.

Trans and gays just want to live their lives out in peace and love, just like most of us.