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Revelation by a Freemason

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posted on Jan, 17 2005 @ 01:45 PM
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Originally posted by Osirisrisen
I do not mean any disrespect to Masonic Light, but there is no one authority when it comes to Masonry or any type of occultism.


True, but there is plenty of evidence, in the forms of books, biographies, documents and the like that one could study to become very knowledgeable about the subject.



I simply stated something that was revealed to me by a verifiable 32nd Degree Mason. I'm not going to argue or defend the point. I don't believe anyone here can prove or disprove what he said. Everyone here knows what they know and were taught and that's it.


Actually, I believe Masonic Light just dispelled everything you claimed that the guy told you. Most rational people here know what they know because they searched out the truth within respectable, comprehensive sources.



There is no one Freemason that has visited every lodge and knows what goes on in each one. And sir I really resent your arrogance like you somehow do. If you do know what goes on in every lodge can you please provide proof Mr. Sebatwerk.


Like ML said, every lodge needs to operate in much the same way in order to keep their charter. If you were a mason, I would gladly discuss these with you.

And let me add something else:
I resent people like you who (if your story is true) take what someone says at face value, without actually verifying it, proceed to repeat it to others as gossip, then get mad when the subjects of their gossip defend themselves against their slander and non-verifiable half-witted statements.

The purpose of this website is to deny ignorance, and the masons on this board do exactly that!




posted on Jan, 17 2005 @ 03:08 PM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light


Also, if he's really a 32° Scottish Rite Mason, he will have a large Patent of that Degree. It's gold, and features a drawing of two Sphinxes sitting at the Portico of the Temple, along with his name, his Scottish Rite degree, and various mottos written in Latin. [edit on 17-1-2005 by Masonic Light]


Im sure glad I dont participate in a "religion" that uses sun worship symbology... I have no clue what Masonry entails, because I have never sat in and participated in a masonic meeting or activities. I do though know one person whos Father is a Mason, and I must say the symbology and some of the things related with Masonry is clearly Anti-Christian.

I am a beliver in Christ, and a believer in the Bible, so I guess I could be labeled a Christian, but I dont take part in church at all.

I have always had a very strong intuition, and that I cannot prove to anyone here, but the people in my life, friends family who have experienced my strong intuition, would for sure back me up when claiming I can, I guess, "sense" "vibes" or "feelings" when dealing with something. Masonry is one of those things I get a very bad "vibe" from. But I cannot say I know, I just have a bad feeling about it. Almost anything ran in secrecy has something corrupt behind it.

Thats just my opinion, which means nothing on an internet forum...



posted on Jan, 17 2005 @ 04:18 PM
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Originally posted by Illuminous

Im sure glad I dont participate in a "religion" that uses sun worship symbology...
I am a beliver in Christ, and a believer in the Bible, so I guess I could be labeled a Christian, but I dont take part in church at all.


In case you weren't aware, Christianity uses "sun worship symbology" perhaps more than any other religion in the world. The Christians put the birth of Christ on Dec. 25, which was the birthdate of the Persian sun god Mithras, when the sun entered Capricorn in the Zodiac, heralding the winter solstice.
The day of Christian worship is the first day of the week, which is the day of the sun, also held sacred by the Mithraists for that reason.

Furthermore, many anthropologists, beginning with Frazer's "Golden Bough", have elaborated on the "Formula of the Dying God" as a sun myth. This universal myth concerns a man-god who redeems the world through death and resurrection, dying for the sins of the unrighteous. The myth seems to have begun in ancient Egypt with Osiris, but is possibly older. It alludes to the apparent death of the sun's generative power over nature, which culminates in his re-birth in December, when the days start getting longer again.

It has been argued by some anthropologists that Christianity is merely a modern form of Mithraism and Osirianism, i.e., disguised sun worship.





[edit on 17-1-2005 by Masonic Light]



posted on Jan, 17 2005 @ 04:31 PM
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Originally posted by Illuminous
Masonry is one of those things I get a very bad "vibe" from. But I cannot say I know, I just have a bad feeling about it. Almost anything ran in secrecy has something corrupt behind it.


That's a ridiculous thing to say. Firstly, Freemasonry is not "run in secret". Lodges are well-established and prominent, listed in every phone book, clearly labeled. The only thing that is run in PRIVATE are our meetings, as Freemasonry is not a public organization. Are ousiders allowed at your business meetings at work? It must be corrupt!

There's no reason for you to get a bad "vibe" from Freemasonry just because you don't know anything about it. Do some research and you'll see there's nothing there but a group of guys who make themselves feel better by helping other people. Oh my God! What a conspiracy! *


*denotes sarcasm



posted on Jan, 17 2005 @ 05:11 PM
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Thank You for your Blinding Sword of Protection and Defense in the midst of these cowans and eavesdroppers, who have nothing better to do than sit around wearing foil hats fondiling themselves and believing everything that their intoxicated" friends, uncles,peculiar people their relatives know or knew,and any other slacked jawed barbarian who will whisper in their ear. " they are doomed to die ignorant ,simply because they choose to...
so mote it be...



posted on Jan, 17 2005 @ 06:12 PM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light


I am a 32° Scottish Rite Mason, a Royal Arch Mason, Royal and Select Master, and Knight Templar in the York Rite, Past Master in my Lodge, and hold various side and honorary degrees including Royal Ark Mariner, Super Excellent Master, and the Order of the Secret Monitor.




Wow ML, belonging to all those bodies must cost you a small fortune in dues. How long did you say you have been a Mason? It sounds like youv'e gone high as you can go in Scottish Rite and York Rite. Isn't Knights Templar tops in the York Rite?



posted on Jan, 17 2005 @ 06:18 PM
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Originally posted by York Rite91
Thank You for your Blinding Sword of Protection and Defense in the midst of these cowans and eavesdroppers, who have nothing better to do than sit around wearing foil hats fondiling themselves and believing everything that their intoxicated" friends, uncles,peculiar people their relatives know or knew,and any other slacked jawed barbarian who will whisper in their ear. " they are doomed to die ignorant ,simply because they choose to...
so mote it be...


Well, thank you for coming into our forums and insulting the membership that you have read for what? A week?

BTW ML, doesn't the festival of Saturnalia have something to do with the placement of Christmas?



posted on Jan, 17 2005 @ 06:47 PM
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It would be hard indeed to find a religion anywhere that does not take special note of the turning of the seasons and christianity is no exception.

In my conversations with a particular Ojibwa healer, who practices the traditions in the old way, I know for certain that these native peoples hold ceremonies on winter solstice, coinciding with the Christian Christmas.

What ML says about the Mithraic traditions is in agreement with what I know...here is an example out of Tom Harpur's 'The Pagan Christ', page 82;

Quote

The birthday of Jesus Christ was first celebrated by the earliest Church in the spring of the year. But in 345 AD, Pope Julius decreed that the birthday....should thenceforth be held on December 25, three days after the 'death' of the winter solstice and the same day on which the births of Mithras, Dionysus, the Sol Invictus (unconquerable sun), and several other gods were traditionally celebrated.

unquote


[edit on 17-1-2005 by masqua]



posted on Jan, 17 2005 @ 06:47 PM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light


In case you weren't aware, Christianity uses "sun worship symbology" perhaps more than any other religion in the world. The Christians put the birth of Christ on Dec. 25, which was the birthdate of the Persian sun god Mithras, when the sun entered Capricorn in the Zodiac, heralding the winter solstice.


Just because people calling themselves Christians, even if they are the majority of "Christians", practice pagan customs doesn't make it a Christian thing to do. Scripture warns agains getting caught up in such practices.


The day of Christian worship is the first day of the week, which is the day of the sun, also held sacred by the Mithraists for that reason.


The Lord's Sabbath is the seventh day of the week. It was established at creation as a mark and remains so to this day.


Furthermore, many anthropologists, beginning with Frazer's "Golden Bough", have elaborated on the "Formula of the Dying God" as a sun myth. This universal myth concerns a man-god who redeems the world through death and resurrection, dying for the sins of the unrighteous. The myth seems to have begun in ancient Egypt with Osiris, but is possibly older. It alludes to the apparent death of the sun's generative power over nature, which culminates in his re-birth in December, when the days start getting longer again.

It has been argued by some anthropologists that Christianity is merely a modern form of Mithraism and Osirianism, i.e., disguised sun worship.


It is true that the majority of professing Christians are unknowingly worshiping falsely. They are ignorant because they choose to be spoon sped doctrine instead of proving all things using the word of God. This is why Jesus referred to the church as a little flock. You are using a false example to typify the Christian faith. The body of Christ is not a group of over 2 billion people. It is a relatively small number of people that to this day are ridiculed, shunned, and killed because of their beliefs.



Steve



posted on Jan, 17 2005 @ 07:10 PM
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Originally posted by TgSoe
Isn't Knights Templar tops in the York Rite?


K.T. is the highest "normal" Order in the York Rite. However, there's a whole lot of side degrees and honorary degrees attached to the York Rite. The presiding officer of a Chapter of Royal Arch Masons is called the High Priest. Once one has been elected to the office, he is eligible to receive a side degree called the Order of High Priesthood. Those elected Illustrious Masters of their Councils of Cryptic Masonry are eligible to receive the Order of the Silver Trowel, and those elected Eminent Commanders of their Commanderies of Knights Templar may receive the degree called Knight Crusader of the Cross.

Past Eminent Commanders of Knights Templars may also receive an honorary degree called Holy Royal Arch Knight Templar Priest. Those who have served as presiding officer in all the above, as well as Master in the Blue Lodge, are eligible to become Knights of the York Cross of Honor.

Furthermore, Royal Arch Masons may be invited to join the Allied Masonic Degrees, which controls side degrees such as Royal Ark Mariner, Secret Monitor, Order of the Red Branch of Eri, Order of the Bath, and Ye Antient Order of Corks. There are also other kindred side degrees in Knight Masons of the USA, Royal Order of Scotland, York Rite College, and Masonic Rosicrucian Society, among others.



posted on Jan, 17 2005 @ 07:14 PM
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Originally posted by intrepid

BTW ML, doesn't the festival of Saturnalia have something to do with the placement of Christmas?


Quite possibly. This site has a few links to pages concerning Saturnalia. ancienthistory.about.com...



posted on Jan, 18 2005 @ 02:34 AM
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Quote: "In case you weren't aware, Christianity uses "sun worship symbology" perhaps more than any other religion in the world. The Christians put the birth of Christ on Dec. 25, which was the birthdate of the Persian sun god Mithras, when the sun entered Capricorn in the Zodiac, heralding the winter solstice.
The day of Christian worship is the first day of the week, which is the day of the sun, also held sacred by the Mithraists for that reason.

Furthermore, many anthropologists, beginning with Frazer's "Golden Bough", have elaborated on the "Formula of the Dying God" as a sun myth. This universal myth concerns a man-god who redeems the world through death and resurrection, dying for the sins of the unrighteous. The myth seems to have begun in ancient Egypt with Osiris, but is possibly older. It alludes to the apparent death of the sun's generative power over nature, which culminates in his re-birth in December, when the days start getting longer again.

It has been argued by some anthropologists that Christianity is merely a modern form of Mithraism and Osirianism, i.e., disguised sun worship. "

Masonic Light be careful when Posting info such as this!
You might cause the Head of the Fundamentalist to EXPLODE!



posted on Jan, 20 2005 @ 05:23 PM
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Originally posted by Osirisrisen
ML, I've never really messaged with you before, but I just want to say that it's great to have someone like you around to shine light on some of these guys that try to do nothing but bring down and organization that has done nothing but help not only its members, but those around it as well. I thank you for fighting as hard as you obviously do to defend the reputation of our Craft from the attacks of its enemies.

That said, don't you ever get tired of the ignorance displayed by some of these posts?




I do not mean any disrespect to Masonic Light, but there is no one authority when it comes to Masonry or any type of occultism. If you believe there is, then you my friend are the ignorant one. I simply stated something that was revealed to me by a verifiable 32nd Degree Mason. I'm not going to argue or defend the point. I don't believe anyone here can prove or disprove what he said. Everyone here knows what they know and were taught and that's it. There is no one Freemason that has visited every lodge and knows what goes on in each one. And sir I really resent your arrogance like you somehow do. If you do know what goes on in every lodge can you please provide proof Mr. Sebatwerk. I find that astounding.


That is true and a very good point. I dont know what is true when it comes to topics like this but you finaly said something that is true.



posted on Jan, 20 2005 @ 05:45 PM
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Originally posted by Shadow Ghost 7
I do not mean any disrespect to Masonic Light, but there is no one authority when it comes to Masonry or any type of occultism. If you believe there is, then you my friend are the ignorant one. I simply stated something that was revealed to me by a verifiable 32nd Degree Mason. I'm not going to argue or defend the point. I don't believe anyone here can prove or disprove what he said. Everyone here knows what they know and were taught and that's it. There is no one Freemason that has visited every lodge and knows what goes on in each one. And sir I really resent your arrogance like you somehow do. If you do know what goes on in every lodge can you please provide proof Mr. Sebatwerk. I find that astounding.

Since Masonic Light is a Mason, some credability has to be given to his statements. However, you are not a Mason and you have never attended a Lodge meeting and your information is third-hand, so the information that you are providing is, at best, dubius. Naturally, no disrespect is intended.



posted on Jan, 20 2005 @ 06:14 PM
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Masonic Light, I like your posts. Could you please direct me to sites that might offer a different perspective of the Masons (Anti-Masonic sites are everywhere, I can find those easily), say, a Masonic perspective of the Masons?

Thanks

P.S. I'm new and don't know the facts



posted on Jan, 20 2005 @ 07:33 PM
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Originally posted by poonchang
Masonic Light, I like your posts. Could you please direct me to sites that might offer a different perspective of the Masons (Anti-Masonic sites are everywhere, I can find those easily), say, a Masonic perspective of the Masons?

Thanks

P.S. I'm new and don't know the facts


I know your post was directed towards ML, but thought I'd interject anyways

I'm so happy to see someone like you who comes on, admits he does not have all the facts, and, most importantly, doesn't take the first bit of slander he reads as being the truth. Good for you.

Here's some informative mason-run websites for you to check out. They contain tons of info on the fraternity and dispel many myths about the organization.

www.freemasoninfo.ca...
web.mit.edu...
www.freemason.org...

Good luck in your search for more information. I welcome you to come to your own conclusions about our organization and hope you find what you're looking for.


[edit on 20-1-2005 by sebatwerk]



posted on Jan, 20 2005 @ 07:42 PM
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Also if I may throw some in...

freemasonry.bcy.ca...
www.masonicinfo.com...

Those mentioned before are great sites, these are just some more I highly recommend as well.



posted on Jan, 20 2005 @ 11:53 PM
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Originally posted by poonchang
Masonic Light, I like your posts. Could you please direct me to sites that might offer a different perspective of the Masons (Anti-Masonic sites are everywhere, I can find those easily), say, a Masonic perspective of the Masons?


Those are good sites listed above. Also, please take a look at the online book "Is It True What They Say About Freemasonry?" by Brothers Arturo DeHoyos, 33°, and Dr. S. Brent Morris, 33°, G.'.C.'.
There's a link on the bottom of the first page that will take you the next chapter.

www.srmason-sj.org...



posted on Jan, 21 2005 @ 12:33 AM
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To: sebatwerk, cotwom, Masonic Light

Thanks for the links, they were exactly what I'm looking for


The first time I even heard about the Masons was on a TV show about "exposing conspiracies" and I just would like to hear the Masons' story.



posted on Jan, 21 2005 @ 09:47 AM
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Originally posted by me again

Originally posted by Shadow Ghost 7
I do not mean any disrespect to Masonic Light, but there is no one authority when it comes to Masonry or any type of occultism. If you believe there is, then you my friend are the ignorant one. I simply stated something that was revealed to me by a verifiable 32nd Degree Mason. I'm not going to argue or defend the point. I don't believe anyone here can prove or disprove what he said. Everyone here knows what they know and were taught and that's it. There is no one Freemason that has visited every lodge and knows what goes on in each one. And sir I really resent your arrogance like you somehow do. If you do know what goes on in every lodge can you please provide proof Mr. Sebatwerk. I find that astounding.

Since Masonic Light is a Mason, some credability has to be given to his statements. However, you are not a Mason and you have never attended a Lodge meeting and your information is third-hand, so the information that you are providing is, at best, dubius. Naturally, no disrespect is intended.



i got a question how do you know i never attended a meeting. as far as i know I have not disclosed the fact that i do not know what gose on in these meetings.



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