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The Genesis Paradox

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posted on Jun, 28 2016 @ 05:50 PM
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originally posted by: NOTurTypical
a reply to: TzarChasm

Here is my thoughts, if people don't get Paul or don't want to read his books, then don't. Don't even read any of the New Testament. The apostles and 1st century church taught Jesus as the Messiah from the LXX Old Testament.

Don't like that Paul taught that Jesus died for us all, for our sins? Okay, don't read Paul, you can read 1 Peter 1:18 instead. Or 1 John 2:1-2. So if Paul bothers you, the same gospel is taught in the OT and in Peter and John, no biggie.



Oh, I get Paul. I don't like him...at all, and I don't read his "scraptures" anymore...except when trying to expose him. I also don't trust 1st or 2nd Peter. In First John, the verse you referred to was Jesus being the propitiation for our sins. Ok, fair enough. Still doesn't exonerate Paul for all the ways he contradicted Jesus, and even himself at times. You really should take your Edmond Spenser quote at the bottom of your posts, to heart. Do some research into Paul. Try to be objective, too.




posted on Jun, 28 2016 @ 08:26 PM
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originally posted by: Utnapisjtim
a reply to: Matrixsurvivor

Also pay close attention in Acts 13 where Saulus (whom they call «st. Paul») calls a person «Son of the Devil» while his true name reads lit. «Son of Jesus». Saulus then carries on to blind «Son of Jesus» (revenge?). It's unclear what happens after that, but apparently, «Son of Jesus» gets help from his friend the Roman official, Sergius Paulus, who seems to offer Saulus his upperclass Roman family name at some point-- supposedly in exchange for «Son of Jesus» to get his vision back. The book never tells whether «Son of Jesus» ever regained his eyesight again, but from that incident onwards, Saulus changes his name into Paulus, or Paul in modern English Bible-translations.

PS: Saulus claims to be «from Tarsos». In Greek that's Strong's 2019 Ταρσοῦ, but the old NT scribes must have noticed, so instead of writing Ταρσοῦ, they wrote the Latinised Strong's 5018 Greek Ταρσεὺς, and the form Gr. Ταρσοῦ isn't used in NT although it would be fully adequate several places. Maybe because there is a direct link between the word Gr. Ταρσοῦ and 666? For if you exchange its letters with Hebrew ones, you get a Hebrew number תרסו and the number is 666. Tav 400, Resh 200, Samek 60 and Vav 6. I think John of Patmos was speaking about Saulus AKA «st. Paul» when he spoke of the number of the Beast and the Fall of Rome.


I think I've read up on what you wrote, somewhere. Can't remember exactly, but yea, makes sense. I think there is so much in this book called the bible that is twisted, it's no wonder that it divides people and causes so many arguments.
It definitely isn't inerrant, written by god through men. Though, I do believe some higher being, that is good, made sure those who actually can HEAR and SEE truth, figure it out. I think that's why the HS was so important to be sent to us, after Jesus ascended. Without it, we're all fair game. I wished I'd listened to my gut sooner. I spent way to many years in church, feeling like I had to conform to all the BS, always wondering WHY it felt like BS. Originally, I experienced something so pure and intense, that afterwards, and after going into "Churchianity", it was just plain stupid to me. I can't stand Christian music anymore, I can't stand pastors and preachers, and I sure as heck know that Paul started all that crap.
Anyway, this thread has been derailed enough by me, lol.
I appreciate the OP's original post. She/he had some awesome things to point out. I find it interesting that there are many, and I mean MANY people waking up to the contradictions and falsehoods in the bible. Some were die hard Christians (such as myself).
What do those still "die hard" Christians do with those of their "brethren" that throw their hands up in disgust and decide it's a crock of bullpoop? LOL. Well, I guess we're all deceeeeeived and going to hell.



posted on Jun, 29 2016 @ 01:28 AM
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a reply to: Matrixsurvivor

Nah, mate, Hell is to live without God. That's why they misuse his name so incredibly, God this Jesus that, and they literally babble, and they do all kinds of fake signs to pretend God is still with them, and then they have coinrolls and they collect money to do more of that crap, and play their usual tunes which all sound alike, while they look all hypnotised and wave their hands like dead reeds in the evening breeze.... And they do all this without drugs, it's incredible.... They sooo much wanna be hippies, but they don't dare to make the leap, so it ended up in all that makebelieve, they didn't have the right ingredients to complete their fevered corn-rust fantasies.
edit on 29-6-2016 by Utnapisjtim because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 5 2016 @ 05:01 PM
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There was a person called the serpent there who deceive Eve into eating. that person convinced her that eating the tree was good so she took and ate. We are told Adam was not deceived, but what story would be complete if a man did not die for a woman.


Ge 3:1-7 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden? And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden: But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die. And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.
1Tim 2:14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.



posted on Jul, 5 2016 @ 05:08 PM
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a reply to: ChesterJohn




There was a person called the serpent there who deceive Eve into eating. that person convinced her that eating the tree was good so she took and ate. We are told Adam was not deceived, but what story would be complete if a man did not die for a woman.


Wouldn't that woman, who is called Eve, be God's mistake, or God's trap? I mean, wasn't HE the one who said "It is not good that man should be alone"? Wasn't Eve was pulled from Adam essence? You can't blame Eve! You can only blame God.
edit on 5-7-2016 by windword because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 5 2016 @ 05:16 PM
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double post

edit on 5-7-2016 by windword because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 5 2016 @ 06:02 PM
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originally posted by: ChesterJohn
There was a person called the serpent there who deceive Eve into eating. that person convinced her that eating the tree was good so she took and ate. We are told Adam was not deceived, but what story would be complete if a man did not die for a woman.


Ge 3:1-7 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden? And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden: But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die. And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.
1Tim 2:14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.



I just love how this "god of the bible" AND Paul, make women the reason for so much crap going wrong. Uhg.



posted on Jul, 5 2016 @ 06:03 PM
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originally posted by: windword
double post


I really like you. LOL.



posted on Jul, 5 2016 @ 10:30 PM
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a reply to: windword

Maybe if we are looking for an escape goat for our failures we could say it is God's fault. I think that is why he gave his son to die for us. He took full responsibility for all the wrongs that everyone did from Eve to the present. But you have to take hold of that it is a gift. You must receive it or reject it.



posted on Jul, 6 2016 @ 01:21 AM
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a reply to: ChesterJohn

Our failures? LOL

Nope, I'm talking about God's failures.



You must receive it or reject it.


When Satan, who is Man's prosecutor, asks, "By what means do you consider yourself worthy of Heaven?", I will never claim someone else's innocent blood shed to be my passport. My experience is quite enough, and quite worthy enough, thank you.



posted on Jul, 6 2016 @ 11:20 AM
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a reply to: windword

you will have to ask him about the supposed failures you have placed on him yourself.

You could do it today, and then go through the AV bible for the next years of your life to see that he has failed not. Or when you die you can ask him face to face.



posted on Jul, 6 2016 @ 11:30 AM
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originally posted by: ChesterJohn
a reply to: windword

Maybe if we are looking for an escape goat for our failures we could say it is God's fault. I think that is why he gave his son to die for us. He took full responsibility for all the wrongs that everyone did from Eve to the present. But you have to take hold of that it is a gift. You must receive it or reject it.


Well, I'd like to ask him why he left the "backdoor" open to the serpent or "Nachash" getting in there to screw with Eve in the first place.
Here we are, on a planet that is full of misery, death, suffering, atrocities, etc., etc.....and apparently "God" thought that little test of free will was worth all of above. Oh, cause he had a plan....to wait thousands of years to send his son to pay for all the crap that never would have happened if he'd kept the dang serpent out of the garden in the first place.

I would like to add....I have nothing against Jesus. He is the one person in scripture who I admire and respect. The OT god....not so much. If..and I say "IF" the Genesis story is even true...then it looks like a complete set up to me.
edit on 6-7-2016 by Matrixsurvivor because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 6 2016 @ 07:21 PM
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a reply to: ChesterJohn




You could do it today, and then go through the AV bible for the next years of your life to see that he has failed not.


This is where you fail, believing that you can find God in a book.



posted on Jul, 6 2016 @ 07:45 PM
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a reply to: windword

I never said you would find God in a book. In it you could learn about his character and what his does and how he does it. Read it in the context and you would not have twisted it to say something I did not say.



posted on Jul, 6 2016 @ 07:51 PM
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a reply to: ChesterJohn

No. You're still wrong. You can learn about the character of men from books, but God's character has never been found in any book. Nope, especially not the Bible, which is actually pretty anti-god (anti-christ), all things considered.

It's a pity that, in your earnest, you still haven't a clue as to the nature of God. But I can tell you this, pull your nose out from behind that book, get outside and look at the world. It's greater than any cathedral or anything that you can surround in walls and book bindings.



posted on Jul, 6 2016 @ 08:22 PM
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a reply to: windword

I disagree, you can learn about the character of God in the Bible, and say you can't is a deception at best, at worse ignorance.

I know God far better than you think.

The Holy Bible tells me his creation is unique, uncanny and incomparable, that he clothes flowers better than man can clothe himself. You know not what wonders I have seen in the world and are ignorant to think I have never seen his wonderful creation or consider the eye of man and its complexities or the vastness of space as I have looked at the stars form locations far from city lights.

The Bible only adds to it not take away. But the character of a person is something you learn from knowing him personally, and the only real place to know him is in his word the Holy Bible. There you can learn how to become his friend and know him personally.


edit on 6-7-2016 by ChesterJohn because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 6 2016 @ 08:42 PM
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a reply to: ChesterJohn




I disagree, you can learn about the character of God in the Bible, and say you can't is a deception at best, at worse ignorance.


No. You believe God to be a character that has favorites, flies around in a pillar of fire, smiting perceived enemies and disobedients, incarnates as a human only to be murdered as a the ultimate human sacrifice to himself for the sins he committed in creating us and giving us free will.

Excuse me if I don't agree that you know anything about the nature of God.



posted on Jul, 6 2016 @ 10:46 PM
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a reply to: windword

Now you are adding to what I think?

Try to be a psychic much?

You are very unreasonable in your view.

I wish you could see how unbiblical your view is of god. God doesn't fly, he has no favorites, he has smited his own as well as his enemies.

The only thing you are even close in is his son paid the price of your and everyone else's sin, and you have fee will.

Nature and Character are two different things. Things that are different are not the same.

I am only explaining I am not trying to convince you. No one could convince you. Your heart is hard and blind and nothing I can say will change that.

Boy your tone sure changed quickly.

Good Night.


edit on 6-7-2016 by ChesterJohn because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 6 2016 @ 10:52 PM
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a reply to: ChesterJohn




You are very unreasonable in your view.


Ditto!



Now you are adding to what I think? Try to be a psychic much?


You're not a stranger to me. We've been around the block more than once. I'm very familiar with your beliefs.



posted on Jul, 7 2016 @ 04:17 PM
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I wish you could see how unbiblical your view is of god. God doesn't fly, he has no favorites, he has smited his own as well as his enemies.


You know....I used to spout that same rhetoric. I mean, that's what the Bible says. Chester, have you ever stopped and asked yourself, "why do we deserve smiting?" I mean, we didn't get this ball rolling, did we? We're all born, we live, we do the best we can, and then one day we croak. Yet, the bible tells us we're unworthy and sinners. We don't deserve anything but hell. Oh, but hey, god in his mercy and love (who started this whole mess in the first place) decides he'll throw us a bone and bail us out.....by sending his son to die in our place. Good grief! Why the theatrics??
No...I don't think all of the above is true anymore. One, Jesus said there were righteous people, from waaaaay back (like all the way to Abel). He said the kingdom of heaven belonged to those like little children. Apparently, he didn't think we all deserved to fry and kids and women were pretty high up on his "likable" list. Animals, too. My favorite thing in all the gospels that he did, was going postal on the money changers. I think it was more to protect the innocent animals from being sold and butchered by a corrupt priesthood, who were sold out to YHWH (who wasn't Jesus' Father).
Oh, and how can you be so sure that Windword is hard hearted and blind? Because the book says so? She/he doesn't agree with the bible, so now you label her/him hard hearted and blind? Oky dokey.
Love how "Christians" label people, who are "outside" their belief system. I was called a "fiend" last night, by a Jesus lover. Sigh.....




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