Judge blocks Seattle from revealing locations of FBI’s hidden cameras on utility poles

So, our local utility company has been installing cameras for the FBI and someone contacted a Seattle television station... I wonder how that works? Did one of the utility employees spill the beans? Did they have to sign a non-disclosure agreement? Were they forced to do this? Did they do it unwittingly? Why can't the FBI figure out a way to spy on targets of investigation without involving utility companies? This just seems kinda fishy to me. This article doesn't give much information, but I suppose The Seattle Times is working for THEM, too.

From web-version of The Seattle Times reporter Mike Carter (June 13, 2016):

A federal judge has issued a temporary restraining order preventing Seattle City Light from disclosing the location of FBI cameras and other surveillance equipment hidden on some of the city’s utility poles. U.S. District Judge Richard Jones said in a written order Monday that he reviewed classified material before issuing the order, finding that the bureau could be “irreparably injured” if the information is released. Turning over the information could damage national security or “harm important federal law enforcement operational interests as well as the personal privacy of innocent third parties.”

It doesn't seem to me that they cared about the "personal privacy" of anyone... I wonder what "other surveillance equipment" refers to?

Federal prosecutors filed a complaint Monday in U.S. District Court asking that City Light be barred from turning over the information in response to a state public- disclosure request filed by Phil Mocek, a founding member of the Center for Open Policing, which has sued a number of public agencies over access to information. Jones said the temporary restraining order would remain in effect until further order.

I learned about this on KIRO radio this past week, I did look for related postings on ATS but did not find any...

The city, after strenuous objections to the release of any information by the FBI, agreed to redact the location of the cameras. That’s the information that Mocek was seeking — and that the city intended to release — before Jones issued the temporary restraining order. In its complaint, the FBI says the city’s decision to release any information has badly damaged the relationship with the bureau, and the FBI says it is no longer telling City Light when or where it might be installing surveillance equipment, which the complaint says is routinely disguised so it won’t be recognized by passers-by or the subject of the investigation. Every camera, the government said, is tied to a specific investigation.

I'm glad that Seattle tried to release the information, but this sounds like the FBI won't be so friendly with the Emerald City due to this snafu. Really? Shouldn't the relationship between federal agencies and the tax-paying cities be one of impartiality?

There is more to the the article, which can be read here: SOURCE ARTICLE FROM SEATTLE TIMES

Center for Open Policing

a reply to: seattlerat

A federal judge has issued a temporary restraining order preventing Seattle City Light from disclosing the location of FBI cameras and other surveillance equipment hidden on some of the city’s utility poles.

Why would they even know where they are? because they probably installed them for the FBI or let them work under their auspices to hide them.

Either way its indentured servitude. One day it will be all the poles, Big Brother is watching…

They are watching you buy guns and shooting them too!

The FBI is not the only federal law- enforcement agency using city utility poles as a base for surveillance. The issue came to light last August when the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives acknowledged it has installed cameras as part of an investigation in the Central District.

In some cities, DC the worst of all, you got biowarfare sensors mounted on the phone poles.

a reply to: seattlerat

Panopticon

2nd line

originally posted by: corblimeyguvnor
a reply to: seattlerat

Panopticon

2nd line

Cool- I learned something new today!

From Wikipedia:

The Panopticon is a type of institutional building designed by the English philosopher and social theorist Jeremy Bentham in the late 18th century. The concept of the design is to allow all (pan-) inmates of an institution to be observed (-opticon) by a single watchman without the inmates being able to tell whether or not they are being watched. Although it is physically impossible for the single watchman to observe all cells at once, the fact that the inmates cannot know when they are being watched means that all inmates must act as though they are watched at all times, effectively controlling their own behaviour constantly. The name is also a reference to Panoptes from Greek mythology; he was a giant with a hundred eyes and thus was known to be a very effective watchman.

a reply to: seattlerat

Who needs poles when the street lights (all) can do the job including video and audio .......... link below

Intellistreets

Big Brother ....... pah, that was nothing

a reply to: seattlerat

Read this here on wednesday, and had to laugh:

FBI Sues To Block Disclosure Of Surveillance Cameras Locations Because It Would Violate The Privacy Of Those Surveilled

How stupid are we people worldwide?
Stepping into a 1984 society and doing nothing against it.

a reply to: DerBeobachter

Here's a related article in Arizona. Someone was putting boxes with tinted windows up on utility poles:

www.abc15.com...

originally posted by: imitator
They are watching you buy guns and shooting them too!

The FBI is not the only federal law- enforcement agency using city utility poles as a base for surveillance. The issue came to light last August when the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives acknowledged it has installed cameras as part of an investigation in the Central District.

The source indicates BAFTE was conducting an investigation in the Central District of Seattle. Of 32 gun shops and 30 pawn shops in Seattle, only one pawn shop is in the Central District that has the potential of dealing in firearms. All other gun shops and pawn shops are in the downtown district or clustered along Aurora Avenue (US 99) north of the city. So the likelihood of BAFTE "watching you buy guns" for this operation is nil.

a reply to: seattlerat


Well, any one of a number of things could be going on here.

1. Why would the FBI even be opposed to the info going public? As everyone knows, there is no expectation of privacy when you're in public and even if the camera was pointed directly into your living room window, they could say you have no expectation of privacy if your curtains are open and you know people can see inside. So what does the FBI care if people who might be up to no good know that the FBI has cameras everywhere. That works as a deterrent to crime.

2. It only takes one person to spill the beans. It takes a bit of luck for that person to be able to spread the info far and wide. For example, if the person goes to the media, they're depending on the media actually being interested and willing to get involved. Which is not a sure thing.

3. If the media does get involved you can bet someone from the media at least attempted to contact the FBI for comment before going public with it. Whether or not they received any commentary from the FBI is anybody's guess but I find it unlikely they would publish a story without knowing how the FBI would react. That kind of thing doesn't seem to be the media's favorite thing to do. To piss off the FBI is probably not the kind of thing you want to do no matter who you are.

4. What exactly are they trying to accomplish by putting cameras everywhere? Possibly just collecting faces and license plates? Who knows?

a reply to: BrianFlanders

" What exactly are they trying to accomplish by putting cameras everywhere? Possibly just collecting faces and license plates? Who knows? "

Man, that's a great question and I for one can't quite wrap my mind around it.

They have the facial recognition technology and I saw an article to the effect they've collected 300 million "faces" into their system...........so they can identify who's walking down the street. So......they could, theoretically, be looking at Main Street, USA and have name tags on everyone walking up and down the street. I don't know what that gets them, really.

If a crime''s been committed, I suppose they could comb through the images collected on Day X, the day of the crime, to get hits to "follow" where the perp went and possibly even to I.D. the perp. That's a familiar theme in modern crime shows on TV.

And I guess they could be compiling lists of people frequenting gun shops, ammo shops and sporting goods shops to compile a data base of "potential" gun owners.

Yet another addition to the "creep" factor in daily life in the US cities.

I would be thinking more about the terrorist watch list.

Are the three mosque in Seattle being watched.

originally posted by: ANNED
I would be thinking more about the terrorist watch list.

Are the three mosque in Seattle being watched.

I live about 5 blocks from one of them- I will take a closer look tomorrow when I drive past it... Maybe even get some photos of the utility poles at the intersection in front of where the Mosque sits... Are there any members that could identify out of place objects that don't serve a purpose for the general public (electricity/telephone/internet)? Sure, any devices are probably heavily disguised, but what the heck- it might be worth a look. Funny thing is, there are cameras EVERYWHERE in Seattle already- they are most likely regarded as "traffic-cams", but I'm pretty sure they could be commandeered by THE MAN with the press of a button (and a twinkle in his eye).

a reply to: schuyler

So the likelihood of BAFTE "watching you buy guns" for this operation is nil.

Wrong.... ATF could keep an eye on you, if your a ffl dealer living in Seattle's Central District.

Plus you just described most of the gun-shops that are in walking distance from that area.

a reply to: seattlerat

I parked nearby the location and snapped a couple of photos. The intersection where the Mosque is situated already has a very fancy "traffic-cam" positioned kitty-corner from the main building. It has obviously has the ability to pan/tilt, and I suppose I shouldn't be surprised that it includes a WINDSHIELD WIPER! It is pointed in such a fashion that I'm sure they are able to easily capture most of the building even when it is not pointed directly at it (wide-angle lens)

As I mentioned in a previous post, I suspect that any of the surveillance agencies (you know who you are) could easily take control of these "traffic-cams" that are at many locations around the city. Some of them are at places where traffic is a problem (hard to find anywhere in this town where it IS NOT a problem), but I've noticed a number of them in areas where I would question WHY they are there at all.

Here are a couple of photos taken this morning at the Mosque in North Seattle:

As a side note, a couple of years ago I put up security cameras where I live due to problems with vandalism, harassment, and other issues like trespassing by suspicious individuals and peeping toms. One of my neighbors called the police (and my landlord) within a couple of days after she noticed them and asked them to force me to remove them. Apparently she decided that I was watching girls with them or some other illogical nonsense. This caused me a lot of problems, and it did not matter that the cameras weren't even functioning as I had not completed setting them up. The crazy thing (other than the woman who complained) is that there were already multiple cameras on other buildings pointing directly at this woman's residence (an old lady), but she didn't have a problem with them. I ended up taking the cameras down just to get her to leave me alone, but ever since this happened I have had to deal with multiple unrelated issues with this person and her relatives.

originally posted by: seattlerat
a reply to: seattlerat

I parked nearby the location and snapped a couple of photos. The intersection where the Mosque is situated already has a very fancy "traffic-cam" positioned kitty-corner from the main building. It has obviously has the ability to pan/tilt, and I suppose I shouldn't be surprised that it includes a WINDSHIELD WIPER! It is pointed in such a fashion that I'm sure they are able to easily capture most of the building even when it is not pointed directly at it (wide-angle lens)

As I mentioned in a previous post, I suspect that any of the surveillance agencies (you know who you are) could easily take control of these "traffic-cams" that are at many locations around the city. Some of them are at places where traffic is a problem (hard to find anywhere in this town where it IS NOT a problem), but I've noticed a number of them in areas where I would question WHY they are there at all.

Here are a couple of photos taken this morning at the Mosque in North Seattle:

As a side note, a couple of years ago I put up security cameras where I live due to problems with vandalism, harassment, and other issues like trespassing by suspicious individuals and peeping toms. One of my neighbors called the police (and my landlord) within a couple of days after she noticed them and asked them to force me to remove them. Apparently she decided that I was watching girls with them or some other illogical nonsense. This caused me a lot of problems, and it did not matter that the cameras weren't even functioning as I had not completed setting them up. The crazy thing (other than the woman who complained) is that there were already multiple cameras on other buildings pointing directly at this woman's residence (an old lady), but she didn't have a problem with them. I ended up taking the cameras down just to get her to leave me alone, but ever since this happened I have had to deal with multiple unrelated issues with this person and her relatives.

The thing about it is though is that at least it does make sense to watch a mosque in the US in 2016. I mean I don't like unwarranted surveillance at all but I truly believe if I was a Muslim in these times I would probably kind of understand it.

Long time lurker, first time poster. At some point I noticed the utility pole in front of my house seemed different. Here are a couple pix of it. Thought this seems relevant to ask since I also live in king county.

Just caught this article, thought you might be interested:
"Unregulated Police Face Recognition in America"
OCTOBER 18, 2016
One int two adults are in the facial recognition network.
Source

originally posted by: Bedlam
In some cities, DC the worst of all, you got biowarfare sensors mounted on the phone poles.

Yup.

And in NYC - Manhattan at least - the surveillance is almost total. Much of it done by the Feds but much by the NYPD.

Get used to it...coming soon to a theater near you.

And none of this even touches on the various eyes in the sky...