Analzsing Trump's second amendment stance from a centrist viewpoint.

From my view of it, Trump has, again, proven to be two steps ahead of the rest of us.

First off, I do NOT think the current situation requires Trump's 'solution'. If for no other reason the right and second amendment defenders will and are dumping on it. Sooner or later, hopefully not sooner, it will be required......

Secondly, the intention is banning ALL AR-15s. Which I would-and Trump- would avoid. (That is the intention of the liberal left. Trump has no such intention and hasn't even implied it. That makes him centrist, from what I can see, NOT a liberal stance whatsoever.)

A few salient points. The number of attacks is increasing, as is the severity. Besides political rhetoric from both sides, I see zero evidence anything effective is being done to alter this trend. The likelihood is the trend will continue to worsen, both in frequency and severity.

If that holds true, then both the argument and momentum for outright banning of AR-15s will increase. Personally, I believe there IS a point where given a significant increase in these acts will justify restricting ownership of weapons by people on a terror watch list.

Yes, that solution/choice is laden with flaws. No argument from me on that score. It's effectiveness will be limited, to say the least. It WILL be more effective than an outright banning of AR-15s. It will also be more effective than doing nothing which what the current administration seems to be inclined to do.

Alternatives to banning the AR-15 needs discussion and planning now rather than later in the event that this situation worsens dramatically.

I would rather restrict the potential doers, rather than restrict the means of defense.

Please feel free to 'shoot' down this view....

Everytime they say they want to ban a specific forearm, they really mean they want to ban all arms of a similar function…

If the AR 15 is magazine fed, semi auto, then all rifles (and pistols) of that nature will be banned as well.

Its a sneaky way of limiting the firepower in the hands of law abiding citizens.

Any repeating arm with a larger capacity of rounds that is reloaded quickly and can penetrate police body armor is the threat. They could care less how many civilians get murdered by these rampage killers.

Folks, the US gubment is murdering people whole sale overseas with hi order WMD, if they really cared about you at home they would allow you to carry arms to protect yourself, wherever you go.

A gun at home under lock and key doesn't protect anyone. Guns in holsters of law abiding citizens don't threaten anyone in public, either.

In the case of every mass shooting in the past few decades, everyone would have been begging for someone, anyone to pull one out and waste the killers.

a reply to: intrptr


Concur. Trump's position-one he's apparently consulting/negotiating with the NRA- is easily the lesser of two evils, if in fact, restricting terror watch list individuals can be said to be an 'evil'.


Assuming Trump wins, I'd wager that the list of those people would be much different than the current one. Hopefully, more balanced....

a reply to: nwtrucker

Is that his solution, more watching of terror suspects? The 911 hijackers, the Boston Bombers and this guy were on watch lists…

Like his building walls comments, hardly a solution.

a reply to: intrptr

Perhaps not. What is your solution?


Personally, I have a problem with defending the 'right' of those that would undermine/destroy our nation and culture.


You don't?

All it would take to be put on a watch/no fly list would be for some pissed off neighbor, employee, boss or even total stranger, to call the authorities and say you are acting "suspiciously" and now with the current paranoia the office of Homeland security could make your life miserable, take your guns, and bring the IRS down on your ass for some serious investigation.

This BS isn't about restricting "terrorist" it's about restricting everyone. But Trump will change all this right?

You're like children clinging to the belief in Santa Clause....

a reply to: olaru12


So let the 'left' take the AR-14s?

Do nothing?

Once again, I'd assume a trump Presidency and a little saner watch list criteria....

Hey, you may be right. It IS worth the discussion because you surely know the momentum is building against the ARs and Obama could move at any time, unilaterally.

I would add Imams and the members of those mosques that openly promote killing Americans of any type.

Is a no-fly list valid? You tell me! If it is then why would it be acceptable for them to have gun ownership rights??

a reply to: nwtrucker

Personally, I have a problem with defending the 'right' of those that would undermine/destroy our nation and culture.

Is it still 'ours' (the peoples)?

a reply to: intrptr


Sigh. Good question.

a reply to: nwtrucker

That's what I was thinking.

In the hands of the current administration, banning weapons based ONLY on a watch list could be disastrous. I could see this being abused, as they grow a watch list of "domestic terrorists", as in anyone who does not agree with them.

I see Trump's solution as a different approach. He is trying to diffuse the current situation by limiting purchases of weapons to those on terrorist watch list. The difference is that he is willing to label exactly who these terrorists are. Hopefully he will be elected, and will have a more common sense approach to who exactly is labeled as terrorist.


.

a reply to: nwtrucker

Once again, I'd assume a trump Presidency and a little saner watch list criteria....

Why? What power can he have over the already entrenched DHS, NSA, PRISM, FBI and the Corporate Security State.
Actually, I think all this AR confiscation BS is just feel good rhetoric to make the masses feel a little better and show that they are doing something about the terrorist problem. I also think this "dey gonna git our guns" is just conservative fear mongering. You just don't shut down a 33 billion dollar industry on a political whim.

But with creeping Fascism....I admit, I could be wrong.

I know it's obvious that I think Trump is a manipulative charlatan. His "make America white again" is appealing to a lot of people. That's really his underlying message. Hell it might even get him elected with a few more Islamic wacko attacks.

a reply to: olaru12

Somehow I get the impression those agencies are directly working under the agenda of the current administration.
For example, we know that happened with the IRS.
So, I think things could be changed with the right person in charge. (Trump, of course.)

originally posted by: BlueAjah
a reply to: olaru12

Somehow I get the impression those agencies are directly working under the agenda of the current administration.
For example, we know that happened with the IRS.
So, I think things could be changed with the right person in charge. (Trump, of course.)

Your hatred of Obama gives him more power than he has. The system controls Obama just like it will control Trump.

I find this "rock star" styled adoration of political figures very naive and frankly a little sad. Trump is no savior, Bernie isn't either, no one person can change our culture of greed, corruption and war.

I know you think think the Skull and Bones, Bohemian grove, Masonic, Bilderberg, structure is all woo woo....I can assure you, it's not.

a reply to: olaru12


Why not? If I was a cynical as you present yourself, I'd give up any hope. (Hopefully, that isn't your intent.)


I certainly don't buy into the left rhetoric of 'Make America White again'. They've had one jingo after another all the way back to Reagan and 'trickle down economics'. Crying wolf all the time only works on the room-temperature I.Q. level.....No shortage of those out there


In this case, I lean somewhat and 'potentially' in Trumps stance than some uncompromising stance on the 2nd which doesn't specifically mention "ARs".


The AR would end up added to the 'reasonable' assumption that N.B.C. weapons aren't Constitutionally protected...

a reply to: olaru12


Perhaps it lies somewhere between the two...

Much would depend on mandate, Presidential intent and willingness to scrap.


( I really think that deep down, you haven't really given up all hope. Otherwise, why would you even bother posting? Nothing can be done about it all? Sorry, that is just plain wrong..)

a reply to: olaru12

I find this "rock star" styled adoration of political figures very naive and frankly a little sad. Trump is no savior, Bernie isn't either, no one person can change our culture of greed, corruption and war.

Agreed. Our president is just the product sticker of what we have created. Nobody can save us from ourselves - except us

Hope and change

Talk about your opiates - and doped up masses

a reply to: nwtrucker

( I really think that deep down, you haven't really given up all hope. Otherwise, why would you even bother posting? Nothing can be done about it all? Sorry, that is just plain wrong..)

I'm just a cynical realist. I have given up all hope and thankful I don't have any kids to experience the coming horror. They didn't build those FEMA camps with the razor wire pointing in to protect us.
I don't know what the true agenda is but I think the Georgia Guide Stones are a fair indication.

It's ATS, the greatest entertainment site on the www. One day at a time...Easy does it....Live and let live....Don't sweat the small stuff; it's all small stuff

I sincerely hope I'm wrong about the future and will deserve the ridicule heaped upon a demented old man.

a reply to: olaru12

Likewise...

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

Talk about your opiates - and doped up masses

That would be me. My right hip is killin me!!