My thoughts on the right wing Christian community's reaction to the Orlando massacre

www.rawstory.com...

Here's seven leaders celebrating the event.

It's these people, and there are more of them, that my OP refers to.

If anyone reading this is a Christian and they sympathise with us, thank-you. I am only talking about these people. And they are more numerous than people perhaps realize.

I've not heard that being said by Christians. Then again I'm not watching it on tv 24/7 to catch all the reports or was this online social media comments? Awful if that was said.

I think most people are very saddened by it and aren't paying attention to them being gay. They were human beings, like all of us, who died. Young people. i cried watching the news about it. I think that was because at first it seemed gays were targeted and my child is gay and I kept thinking this might happen to 'me'. To think my child could be taken over such unwarranted hatred.

The world is still not very accepting of gays and at times I admit I get sick of hearing about some things and have said so. Yet I cannot fathom hating people for stupid reasons like that.

a reply to: markosity1973
That's truly disgusting. I can't bear to read what they say. The wesrborough church always attacks gays.

People like this piss me off

a reply to: BO XIAN


Then it's you I'm talking about.

Have some sympathy you cold hearted prick. These were real people with real lives and real hopes and aspirations.

I dare you to tell the remaining members of the mother of 11's family that she was not a real victim I dare you to tell the wife and children that her husband was not a real victim.

Congratulations, I have zero respect for you now.

originally posted by: randomtangentsrme

originally posted by: markosity1973

originally posted by: ketsuko
I'm sure it was only atheists who lined up to donate blood.

I'm sure that was the only atheist Chick-fil-A in the country who opened on Sunday (something the company NEVER does) to feed the first responders and blood donors waiting.

I'm sure no one who claims the faith cares at all that 50 people died.

Do you know that Gay people who wanted to donate blood to help their brethren in this time were denied the right?

We are not even allowed to help ourselves.

edition.cnn.com...

There were legitimate health reasons that there was a lifetime ban on gay men donating blood in the 80s, due to HIV transmission.

That ban has been lifted. But there are still health concerns. They were not denied any right.

www.cnn.com...

Oh please, there is a 12 month stand down after sex for gay men. Yeah right.... No discrimination......

A straight man can go direct from whorehouse to blood bank and donate.

originally posted by: markosity1973

originally posted by: breakingbs
a reply to: markosity1973

Westboro Baptists are horrible, I still don't even know if they're real or not. People who believe in the scriptures aren't about to get rid of their beliefs over this, I'm sure you will find some characters among them that have extreme views but youll be hard pressed to actually find proof of mainline Christianity endorsing these views or even wanting to..they're just not that into it.

We're even seeing it here in Australia. The (Christian) family first party has politicised the Orlando shooting and called the advancement of gay rights as a warning to families and children

www.news.com.au... 7afcab60b7a88

What do you mean 'even seeing it in Australia' as though Australia is a hotbed of progressive, modern thinking? Sheesh, Australia had a whites only immigration policy that wasn't (officially at least) fully dismantled until the '70's - hardly the most liberal of countries.

For the record, I'm a lapsed Catholic and have never attempted to judge anyone based on their race, creed, gender, gender preference or colour of their skin. Bigots come in many guises.

Dearest markosity1973, No i was not aware of the fact that you are gay. I'm sorry to hear that.I am well aware of the Samaritan story that Jesus told, and because of the stories Jesus told i believe gay people are being deceived like the rest of us are. I think you are no worse than either one of us that sin against Gods ways..We who cast the first stone. But that doesn't make what you are doing right in Gods eyes, any more than any other sin, no sin is greater than another, all sin is the same in Gods eyes. Sin is Sin.Is your sin greater than mine? No! Because God said so.But to sin is still sin, however small it might appear to the one doing it. Let us say, Why do you see the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? Be of good cheer my friend, and go and sin no more..

a reply to: justmesoashamed

Your sentiments I can accept .

Each of us is flawed, imperfect. I get that.

As a Christian both you and I believe that we will have to stand in front of God one day and be judged for our wrongdoings. I am accountable for my life and how I have lived it and I alone.

Nobody has the right to tell me or any gay person how we should live. They have not walked our path and they do not know our silent suffering.

a reply to: markosity1973

Dear markosity1973 - please accept my sincerest condolences on the loss of all who were murdered and the families and friends involved. The people are not just statistics or the day's news - they were/are our fellow man and living, breathing individuals who contributed to this world and each gave love and only wanted to be loved. Their lives have been stolen from them.

It seems the hatred and violence towards the LGBT people never ends, and in fact seems to be rising.

We are all in this world together. I, along with every other person on this planet, are equal, and none sins more or less in God's eyes. I am a Christian but lately, and I think it was someone here on ATS that said it, I find myself moving away from the term of "Christian". I am a Jesus follower and I go by his teachings and instruction. I, as well as the rest of all people, have no right to judge anyone else. Only one can judge and that is God. Anyone who condemns another, or judges another is not acting with love, compassion, understanding or right. Unfortunately, the worst thing that ever happened to God's word was "religion".

I am shocked, ashamed and so very saddened by people who call themselves Christian for acting in such a violent and condemning manner. We will all be held accountable for our words and behaviour when we face God. And those in a position of trust and power will be held to a higher standing as it is their leading that will cause others to fail, others who follow blindly.

I am so sorry that you are feeling hurt and attacked and unloved. I can't speak for the rules about blood donation, although I understand the reasoning. I am sure if those victims were asked that they would readily have accepted anyone's blood in order to survive.

Just wanted to add my input and to let you know that as a Christian I love you for who you are and that you can always pm me if you need to talk. I truly believe love is what it all boils down to and so I offer that to you and hope you hear the sincerity I am trying to explain with words. Big hugs.

a reply to: ccseagull

Thank-you. You represent the Christ like Christian I want to believe in. The type that Jesus talked about in the good Samaritan story.

My beef with the blood donation thing is this;

A man (assuming he is the same blood type as his wife of course) could give blood to save her life if they had been intimate that day.

A gay man (or woman) cannot give blood in the same circumstances to save their partner or their friends. I know had I been there and survived I'd have wanted to give my blood to save someone dear to me.

The OP is not so much about acceptance as it is respect. If Christians morally object to our lifestyle, so be it. I understand, I've read the bible too. Freedom of conscience is something I strongly believe in.

But when we suffer such a heavy loss, silence would be far more acceptable to condemnation.

a reply to: markosity1973
Hey there - I had no idea that a gay per on can't give blood in the same circumstances to their partner/friends. I imagine it comes under the blanket of blood giving rules. I hear what you are saying and that doesn't sit right with me. You made a point earlier about how a guy can go and have sex and bring it home to his wife. The rules in this world are sometimes insane.

I really have to say that the shock I felt when reading about those Pastors advocating the deaths in this incident and that more should die, etc equals the shock upon hearing of the killings itself. Simply unbelievable that anyone would want another fellow human to die, and especially because they are so righteous in their own minds. Disgusting. And scary.

This world is heavy with grief. Grief of deaths, loss and about the loss of any kind of decency and humanity.

a reply to: ccseagull

The blood donor rules were set in a time when AIDS was a huge problem in the gay community and screening was not so quick and easy. It made sense at the time, but things have moved on and AIDS is not such a problem, while screening has got much more efficient.

The rules have been 'relaxed' now so that we have can give blood. But we have to have abstained from sex for 12 months first. I'm 42, have never had any STD's and until early this year had been in a 10 year long committed and monogamous relationship. My blood is not considered suitable for donation because naturally we had sexual relations in the last year. So I cannot help anyone with my blood. And I am just one person this affects.

As for the Pastors - they should know better. As we used to say at Church, you reap what you sow. And when you sow the seeds of hate, you are on the path to damnation.

a reply to: breakingbs

Westboro Baptists are horrible, I still don't even know if they're real or not.

They are very very real.

Quite real. I've seen them protesting, with my own eyes. I've heard one of the estranged kids of Fred speak at a conference for open-minded skeptics, agnostics and atheists (against WBC). They are real.

As the LGBT and Latino communities mourned, right-wing religionists pounced to exploit the moment.

Just the day before the Orlando massacre, I attended a right-wing conference, Road to Majority, convened by Ralph Reed’s Faith and Freedom Coalition.

There, I heard the Benham brothers, minor celebrities whose show was canned by HGTV for making anti-gay remarks, demean trans people, from the main stage. (“I’m going to join the WNBA, and I will dominate,” one of the brothers, who are identical twins, told the appreciative crowd.)

I attended a break-out session titled “Bullies, Bathrooms and Big Brother,” where preacher Jason Jimenez accused leaders in the LGBT community of bullying local governments, such as Charlotte, North Carolina’s, into adopting public restroom protections for trans people. He derided the queer community’s inclusion of intersex people in its coalition by equating them with “dog lovers”—the clear implication being one of bestiality.

But naturally all the Christians will claim this is made up propaganda Christian-bashing.

And here's another interesting fun-fact story, too!

CIVIL LIBERTIES
Diabetic 15-Year-Old Weighing 37 Pounds Dies After Parents Choose Prayer Over Insulin
The parents are on trial for first-degree murder.

A 15-year-old Canadian boy suffering from severe effects of insulin-dependent diabetes died because his religious parents refused to seek proper medical care, CBC reports.

Emil and Rodica Radita are on trial for first-degree murder after their son, Alex, died in 2013 from what prosecutors say were the effects of his parents’ refusal to seek medical care and rely on prayer and home treatment instead.

Crocodile Tears from the Religious Right? Nahhh......they wouldn't be that awful! You must be kiddi--
oh wait.

a reply to: ccseagull

I wish there were more of you.

I'm not homosexual, but my pain for them is genuine. What a nice post.

a reply to: ketsuko

but there are preachers who say ugly things about all kinds of sin, not just homosexuality.

Stop calling it a "sin."
It's a part of the human condition, no different than being blonde or short or brown-skinned or green-eyed.

a reply to: markosity1973

The hatred I see for the victims of the Orlando tragedy coming from people of faith dismays me greatly.

So........if a terrorist shot up a mostly white suburban protestant mega church, would you be greatly dismayed to see the hatred poured out for the victims by the leftist active atheists and the anti-white Farrakhan types?

originally posted by: markosity1973
www.rawstory.com...

Here's seven leaders celebrating the event.

It's these people, and there are more of them, that my OP refers to.

If anyone reading this is a Christian and they sympathise with us, thank-you. I am only talking about these people. And they are more numerous than people perhaps realize.

I've sympathy with the family, friends, colleagues and loved ones of all affected by tragedies such as this. I'd like to think it would never be balanced by their creed, colour, gender or gender preference - I'd like to hope you do as well.

timelines.latimes.com...

a reply to: markosity1973

Your reply to my post is utterly mystifying.

Did you not understand a word I wrote?

Where was I even in the same universe as "cold hearted?"

Where did I say anyone was not a real victim?

I was and am the opposite of your assertions about me. Sheesh!

I don't think I've read a more utterly off the wall, totally inaccurate reply to one of my post in my 11 years on ATS.

Sheesh.

a reply to: TonyS

I was raised catholic..I don't really go to church......I pray sometimes and I try to be a good person and I am straight...I am so appalled by these preachers, they have no humanity...it sickens me........we are all PEOPLE...this was a terrrorist attack on our fellow AMERICANS

the hate has to stop

"You can safely assume you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do." Anne Lamott

From another author

"Modern conservatives Christians seem to focus on the negative almost exclusively, defining themselves far more through whom they oppose than through what they stand for as a group. They are against abortion, contraceptives, comprehensive sex education, the media, competing religions, anything that smacks of political correctness, socialist, gays and lesbians (along with their right to marry, adopt or have children, and enjoy legal protection from discrimination), academics, anyone who is anti-war, immigrants, feminists, communists, human and animal rights activists, Democrats, secular humanists, criminals, intellectuals, activist judges, foreigners, environmentalists, poor people, people with differing or no religious beliefs, people having sex out of wedlock, and liberals of any stripe," she writes.

The United States has been under this influence for decades. It is time to want something better, and do so without drinking from the same spring of hatred that others drink from. But it is time to take back Christianity from those who have perverted it.