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After Orlando, time to recognize that anti-gay bigotry is not religious freedom: Neil Macdonald

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posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 07:15 PM
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originally posted by: shredderofsouls
Well this put Conservatives in a conundrum, who do they hate more..gays or muslims?


If you place the word "some" in front of Conservatives there, I agree with you 100 percent.

Beyond that though, 50 AMERICANS died and 50 or more were seriously wounded and and THAT is what we should all remember and work to stop. Sexual orientation or religion are not the primary concerns here.

Or they shouldn't be.




posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 07:17 PM
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a reply to: Gryphon66

Yeah your right. Fixed it.



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 07:20 PM
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originally posted by: shredderofsouls
a reply to: Gryphon66

Yeah your right. Fixed it.


Oh, I was only speaking for myself ... but ..




posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 07:21 PM
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a reply to: Pyrrho


You're going to have to come up with a decent explanation for why you think this. How does not being allowed to shop/browse/etc at a particular privately owned establishment prevent one from living freely?


If you can't see that preventing people from doing that prevents one from living freely in America, I can't help you.


So if I decide I don't want blacks to enter my home, they should be allowed to enter my home just because it's discrimination?


You HOME is not a business that serves the PUBLIC. See the Civil Rights Act. Even if it is, you still can't discriminate.

I hope you're trolling.



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 07:25 PM
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originally posted by: Boadicea

I'd love to see that... but I fear we would both be sadly disappointed. On the plus side, we do have some really great ATSers of the Muslim faith whose comments do shine that light here for all to see.


I think a lot of American Muslims don't speak up because they still have family in the Middle East that they could endanger.

There are Muslims that speak up on ATS. Have you read the responses they usually get? I'm surprised they keep trying.



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 07:33 PM
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a reply to: Annee


I think a lot of American Muslims don't speak up because they still have family in the Middle East that they could endanger.


I think you're right about that. It's a very real concern for too many -- here and everywhere. They know better than anyone just how ruthless and cruel the extremists can be.


There are Muslims that speak up on ATS. Have you read the responses they usually get? I'm surprised they keep trying.


Yes, I have... And the responses they get are pretty darn pathetic not just sometimes, but lots of times. I'm very thankful they keep trying though.



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 07:41 PM
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originally posted by: Liquesence
a reply to: Pyrrho


You're going to have to come up with a decent explanation for why you think this. How does not being allowed to shop/browse/etc at a particular privately owned establishment prevent one from living freely?


If you can't see that preventing people from doing that prevents one from living freely in America, I can't help you.


So if I decide I don't want blacks to enter my home, they should be allowed to enter my home just because it's discrimination?


You HOME is not a business that serves the PUBLIC. See the Civil Rights Act. Even if it is, you still can't discriminate.

I hope you're trolling.


Not all businesses are publicly held

You want to be free, but you don't think what you see as stupid people should be free as well because it hurts your feelings. You excuse your disregard for others' rights as being "for the greater good" while you ignore the obvious dangers that follow this type of attitude when adopted on a large scale.

Instead of working toward social change, you want government force to violently stop all of those with opinions that you disagree with.

Dangerous, dangerous mentality to have. It's a shame that you ignore the obvious examples from history of why it is so important to protect freedom of speech, even for those that use their freedom of speech to offend others.



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 07:46 PM
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When will the U.S strength their gun laws



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 08:03 PM
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a reply to: Pyrrho


Not all businesses are publicly held


If they are business that serves the general public, they are a place of public accommodation. Period.

Civil Rights Act


TITLE II--INJUNCTIVE RELIEF AGAINST DISCRIMINATION IN PLACES OF PUBLIC ACCOMMODATION
SEC. 201. (a) All persons shall be entitled to the full and equal enjoyment of the goods, services, facilities, and privileges, advantages, and accommodations of any place of public accommodation, as defined in this section, without discrimination or segregation on the ground of race, color, religion, or national origin.

(b) Each of the following establishments which serves the public is a place of public accommodation within the meaning of this title if its operations affect commerce, or if discrimination or segregation by it is supported by State action:

(1) any inn, hotel, motel, or other establishment which provides lodging to transient guests, other than an establishment located within a building which contains not more than five rooms for rent or hire and which is actually occupied by the proprietor of such establishment as his residence;

(2) any restaurant, cafeteria, lunchroom, lunch counter, soda fountain, or other facility principally engaged in selling food for consumption on the premises, including, but not limited to, any such facility located on the

premises of any retail establishment; or any gasoline station;

(3) any motion picture house, theater, concert hall, sports arena, stadium or other place of exhibition or entertainment;



Instead of working toward social change, you want government force to violently stop all of those with opinions that you disagree with.

Dangerous, dangerous mentality to have.


I never said anything about or advocated for suppression of opinion, and never said anything about "violence." Again, nice hyperbole.

You are free to have an opinion. You are not free to discriminate and deny people their right to live freely. Period.


even for those that use their freedom of speech to offend others.


The greatest thing about free speech is protecting the most unpopular of speech. But DISCRIMINATION IS NOT FREE SPEECH.

You're either trolling or you are truly and willfully ignorant. Which is it?

I've made my point several times.

Bye.



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 08:07 PM
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originally posted by: walker275
When will the U.S strength their gun laws

never.
americans generally are too stupid.
just check this thread out.



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 08:11 PM
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Lots of hate for Americans, guns owners and Christians in this thread, while lots of sympathy and admiration being given to Muslims.

Makes sense.



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 08:23 PM
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originally posted by: Liquesence
a reply to: Pyrrho

I never said anything about or advocated for suppression of opinion, and never said anything about "violence." Again, nice hyperbole.


How is it hyperbole?

How do you think a government would take away the rights of the people? By asking nicely?

Dangerously naive



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 08:24 PM
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originally posted by: TheBulk
Lots of hate for Americans, guns owners and Christians in this thread, while lots of sympathy and admiration being given to Muslims.

Makes sense.


Yep.

It's all about special snowflakes.

Very PC.



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 08:41 PM
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a reply to: tothetenthpower

This is an overreach. So is the talk about misogamy after the Canadian incident.



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 08:43 PM
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originally posted by: stinkelbaum

originally posted by: walker275
When will the U.S strength their gun laws

never.
americans generally are too stupid.
just check this thread out.


French have some really hard gun laws......lots of good they did



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 08:50 PM
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a reply to: Pyrrho

I have made my point multiple times.

You're intentionally moving the goalposts away from the initial argument because you can't reasonably support it or back it up.

You are trolling and I have nothing else to say to you in this thread.



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 09:04 PM
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a reply to: tothetenthpower

There is a vast difference between bigotry and in going out and killing those one dislikes. People have every right to dislike whomever they want. They even have the right to hate others. Not productive, but still their right. Where that stops is when it comes to depriving someone one dislikes, or hates, of their life. Talking about depriving people of their freedom of religion, because of an act of terrorism, isn't a road we need to travel. Violence is the problem, not religion.



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 09:13 PM
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a reply to: LadyGreenEyes


Its amazing as well that there are some that will toss the blanket over all religion in a case like this but then turn around and defend Muslims as not all bad ect.

Taking the whole of Muslim violence where it has been and be what it may all over the world over the last 15 years and breaking out the "organized religion" card on all has got to be the f'in panicle of stupid or shill. No one comes close in comparison. There is not a total "organized" number......just those little ol Muslim radicals and infighting.



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 09:14 PM
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a reply to: LadyGreenEyes




There is a vast difference between bigotry and in going out and killing those one dislikes.


It a fine line and a slippery slope.



People have every right to dislike whomever they want.


Bigotry has nothing to do with personally disliking someone. Bigotry is about hating a group because of who they are.



posted on Jun, 13 2016 @ 09:21 PM
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originally posted by: tothetenthpower
a reply to: ketsuko


So the majority of us lose our freedom and rights because of the few?


No I'm not asking anybody to loose rights and freedoms. I'm asking that they don't create laws that are ONLY used to discriminate against a specific group.


What you are actually saying is that you want to suspend the rights of certain groups - religious groups - in the name of supposedly protecting the rights of another group. It's sick, and completely against freedom, and frankly, I am disgusted that more than forty people flagged this anti-religion bigotry thread.

That is what this is.




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