Bernie Sanders and his supports should through their support behind a third-party candidate.

Bernie Sanders and his supports should through their support behind a third-party candidate.

It’s the only want to affect any real change in the political system we have today. A system where the two major political parties (and/or nefarious NWO) has a strangle hold on the processes and the outcome of most elections.

I’ve often advocated that voting for the lesser of two evils is a self-defeating; and that at the end of the day this paradigm creates a race to the bottom. Voting for “the lesser of evils” makes “being just a little bit less evil than your opinionates” the goal for most politicians; and with cycle after cycle of this is there any wonder why we are left with Trump and Clinton – who’s negatives are the worst in modern history; and an election that will be decided by which of these people can vilify their opponent the most.

Before this year I would tell anyone who would listen to consistently vote out the incumbent. No matter who they are; no matter if they are less evil then their opponent. Only in this way would the American electorate cause enough instability and turn over in the system that the two major parties would start to loss their stranglehold and individual carrier politician would have to start taking the people seriously.

Now this year we have a great opportunity to deal a sticking blow the republcrats we only need to courage to make it happen.

Almost certainly if Bernie Sanders and his supports through their support behind a third-party candidate this would help Trump win the election … and this fact probably doesn’t sit well with many of Sanders supporters and we know it doesn’t sit well with the man himself. But to these people, and the Senator I would urge them to see the bigger picture and not squander long term gains for short term consolation.

Yes if Trump wins the election you are not going to see the polices you want to see; and yes Clinton is more your speed than Trump is. But we’re only talking about 4 years here; what’s 4 years in the grand scheme of things? You got to play chess not checkers; handing a win to the republicans today by letting a third party have more power than they have ever had in the past is a long term victory. It will show the American people that third-party is a viable choice; it will cause the Democrats to think twice about the issues you have been supporting … and as for the republicans; if Trump is as bad as you think he is than as president he will help to sink the republicans faster than a loss in the current election ever could.

a reply to: DanDanDat

I am
I will
Johnson!

There is a third nut bag?.... maybe we can get Weird Al to run...how bad can he be?
Cheers

originally posted by: DanDanDat
Almost certainly if Bernie Sanders and his supports through their support behind a third-party candidate this would help Trump win the election …

Any why would a Sanders supporter (like me) want an asshat like Trump for a president? I can't think of ONE good reason. Voting third party MIGHT shake the stronghold that the 2-party system has (emphasize MIGHT), but the outcome is NOT worth the possible gain. And one 4-year cycle isn't enough to change anything in the system, but a Trump presidency could (and probably would) cause wars and other negative repercussions that would last my lifetime.

No, thanks. I'll be voting AGAINST Trump this year. And regrettably, that probably means I'll vote for Hillary, because she's the only one who can beat him.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

I'm still unsure.

I want very badly to vote for Johnson and as much as I dislike Hillary, I'm much more scared of Trump.

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: DanDanDat
Almost certainly if Bernie Sanders and his supports through their support behind a third-party candidate this would help Trump win the election …

Any why would a Sanders supporter (like me) want an asshat like Trump for a president? I can't think of ONE good reason. Voting third party MIGHT shake the stronghold that the 2-party system has (emphasize MIGHT), but the outcome is NOT worth the possible gain. And one 4-year cycle isn't enough to change anything in the system, but a Trump presidency could (and probably would) cause wars and other negative repercussions that would last my lifetime.

No, thanks. I'll be voting AGAINST Trump this year. And regrettably, that probably means I'll vote for Hillary, because she's the only one who can beat him.

A Trump presidency would not cause wars, not any more than our current level of conflict around the world. That is one of the stupidest things I have been hearing this election cycle; world destruction if Trump wins. This is the exact thing I’m talking about that needs to stop; the scare mongering by the DNC (and RNC) needs to stop … but it won’t unless the American electorate grows a pare and starts to trade short term gains for long term gains.

But I totally understand why a Sanders supporter (like you) doesn’t want an asshat like Trump for a president; what I’m asking you to do is quell your short term fears so that maybe we could all prosper long term … take one for the team.

a reply to: gladtobehere

I totally understand! I would love to vote FOR someone this year (like Johnson or Stein), but the consequences are too great, IMO. My single voice will be against Trump.

a reply to: DanDanDat

A Trump presidency would not cause wars, not any more than our current level of conflict around the world.

Funny that you think that's reassuring

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

A vote for or against Trump is a vote for David Rockefeller.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

A vote for or against Trump is a vote for David Rockefeller.

originally posted by: gladtobehere
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

I'm still unsure.

I want very badly to vote for Johnson and as much as I dislike Hillary, I'm much more scared of Trump.

Truthfully I don’t understand where all this fear is coming from; well I do understand that what the media and parties want us to feel; what I don’t understand is why we eat it up so easily.

I mean what exactly are we afraid of?

Trump will start a nuclear war … I’ve heard more than one person and talking head say they can’t trust trump with nuclear weapons. I mean first of all it takes a lot more than one mad to fire a nuclear weapon. Trump cannot wake up one day and say “Those fing Mexicans don’t want to build my wall … fine ill show them” and then by lunch the world is a nuclear waste dump … just can’t happen its simply imposable. There would need to be a major major major escalation in tensions with some other supper power for nuclear weapons use to even be discussed … and even than the doctrine of mutual distraction will put a stop to their use … Hell Trump is a self-loving egomaniac – why would he ever be passionate about a cause to the point where he would chose to die for it? If anything putting Trump white house will deter the use of nuclear weapons by our side.

He’ll ruin the economy if he peels back Dodd Frank? Even if Dodd Frank was saving us from the next economic collapse it took decades of bad actions to lead us to the 2008 down turn; 4 years of Trump can’t get us their fast enough.

He’ll piss off the world and bring back segregation and end women’s suffrage because he’s a racists sexist @sshat? Hardly; we can see how fast the republicans are recoiling from every comment he makes; they aren’t going to support him if he tries to push for social regression and since the Democrats wont be supporting him either; all that will happen is that he will sit in the white house sad and alone. Not to mention that most of evidence shows that Trump really doesn’t care about social issues and just used them to galvanize a marginalized group of people.

I just can’t see the “FEAR” – it is highly highly more likely that a Trump Presidency will go down in the history books as a blustering yet ineffectual presidency.

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis
a reply to: DanDanDat

A Trump presidency would not cause wars, not any more than our current level of conflict around the world.

Funny that you think that's reassuring

Its not exactly meant to be reassuring – Clinton won’t change the level of conflict involvement either. If however we change the way we elect presidents maybe we could lead to less conflict.

a reply to: DanDanDat

Here's a big question, can term limits be enforced in Congress and the house by presidential EO through a referendum? If it can, I would vote in the candidate for POTUS that would do that, because that is one of your biggest single problems.

Cheers - Dave

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic
a reply to: gladtobehere

I totally understand! I would love to vote FOR someone this year (like Johnson or Stein), but the consequences are too great, IMO. My single voice will be against Trump.

Copy that....

I'm not voting for anyone....just against Donald Trump!!

originally posted by: DanDanDat
Truthfully I don’t understand where all this fear is coming from; well I do understand that what the media and parties want us to feel; what I don’t understand is why we eat it up so easily.

"The Media" has absolutely nothing to do with my opinions on Trump. I have felt the same about him since I was first aware of him, LONG before he made a serious bid for the White House. And my opinions have recently been solidified by listening to HIM, not to the media.

We need election reform and I would LOVE to break up the two-party system, but I don't think Trump will have an effect on that either way.

a reply to: TheBandit795

Sorry, I don't even know what that means or who that is.

a reply to: DanDanDat

If however we change the way we elect presidents maybe we could lead to less conflict.

No

This idea that we can elect someone that will make our country change for the better is nonsensical. Democracy isn't supposed to be about electing a savior or a guru

We're in the spot we're in because of us - not our presidents. It takes a lot of people to make a regime happen - for better or worse

My opinion - for what it's worth (I'm guessing nothing) is that Bernard accomplished something amazing in that he opened up a new road and made people think. He made Hillary defend her positions in a way she might not have otherwise. If anything good happens from these things, it won't happen for some time

He wouldn't be able to do as much as president as he can (and has) working from the outside. We're not electing a king with a magic wand - we're electing a figurehead for like minded individuals that hopefully have what's best for the country in mind. The change that he offers is not going to be something he can get close to in four years - or even eight

This country needs to change how it thinks before it can change how it functions . Elections are just a part of that. She said

People want a revolution

So, we have Donny. This is what change for the sake of change looks like. Not unlike Nixon, or McCarthy - he will have his supporters and in the end - we won't even have a figurehead. We'll have something else

Real change is hard work and I'm not sure we're up to the task. Even if we were - we hate each other. That is not going to go away over night

Hillary is a pill. She's not likeable, not magical - and she's just so pro military intervention. I'm a pacifist that has supported that on occasion. Not Iraq - but I was behind her on Syria. I have bad dreams at night - and a lot of cognitive dissonance that bothers my intuition and my stomach. We all try to make things work out in our heads - don't we?

Then - there's the money. Our true third party

If you got your wish - it won't be what you were hoping for. 20/30 years from now maybe. We'll see

We are - my friend - between a rock and a hard place. 2016 should be the year that makes us all look in the mirror

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis
a reply to: DanDanDat

If however we change the way we elect presidents maybe we could lead to less conflict.

No

This idea that we can elect someone that will make our country change for the better is nonsensical. Democracy isn't supposed to be about electing a savior or a guru

We're in the spot we're in because of us - not our presidents. It takes a lot of people to make a regime happen - for better or worse

My opinion - for what it's worth (I'm guessing nothing) is that Bernard accomplished something amazing in that he opened up a new road and made people think. He made Hillary defend her positions in a way she might not have otherwise. If anything good happens from these things, it won't happen for some time

He wouldn't be able to do as much as president as he can (and has) working from the outside. We're not electing a king with a magic wand - we're electing a figurehead for like minded individuals that hopefully have what's best for the country in mind. The change that he offers is not going to be something he can get close to in four years - or even eight

This country needs to change how it thinks before it can change how it functions . Elections are just a part of that. She said

People want a revolution

So, we have Donny. This is what change for the sake of change looks like. Not unlike Nixon, or McCarthy - he will have his supporters and in the end - we won't even have a figurehead. We'll have something else

Real change is hard work and I'm not sure we're up to the task. Even if we were - we hate each other. That is not going to go away over night

Hillary is a pill. She's not likeable, not magical - and she's just so pro military intervention. I'm a pacifist that has supported that on occasion. Not Iraq - but I was behind her on Syria. I have bad dreams at night - and a lot of cognitive dissonance that bothers my intuition and my stomach. We all try to make things work out in our heads - don't we?

Then - there's the money. Our true third party

If you got your wish - it won't be what you were hoping for. 20/30 years from now maybe. We'll see

We are - my friend - between a rock and a hard place. 2016 should be the year that makes us all look in the mirror

I agree and do not in any way think Trump can fix our system of his own actions. We can not elect someone who will fix things.

It would be the act of Sanders supporting third part to disrupt the DNC and a Trump bad presidency disrupting the RNC that would create a chance for change.


You said Sanders "accomplished something amazing in that he opened up a new road and made people think." ... he can take that one step further and show people they don't need to vote for a major part lest their vote is seen as a throw away.

The biggest mistake for Sanders supporters would be to vote for Hillary Clinton.

A major war will start inside of her 1st year as President (if she's elected).

Hillary is possibly the single most threat to international/USA relations.

Voting Green is the only way left.

a reply to: xuenchen

I couldn't say that any better. I've been reading this thread and thinking about saying that pretty much exactly how you just did. Killary scares the poop outa me and Trump well just wants to knock this off his bucket list. He is not for the American people he is for himself there fore doesn't deserve and is not fit to become the president of this once great country.......
Vote Gary Johnson and show the corrupt politicians that we don't have to play by there rules. And if all else fails youtu.be...

That will split the Democrat vote and cause Trump to win by a long shot