Most millennial men don’t identify as masculine, 1-in-5 actually identify as feminine

To quote my favorite character, Tyler Durdan, in my all time favorite movie...

"We're a generation of men raised by women. I'm wondering if another woman is really the answer we need."

a reply to: enlightenedservant

"When I was a kid you dressed like a women and sang about the devil. Now that was music" -Bill Burr.

originally posted by: awareness10
a reply to: enlightenedservant

Actually no, what's ridiculous is that you automatically assumed that You spoke for all Women, I simply brought you back to reality in reminding you that No, not all Women are Ninja's, Freedom Fighters and International Spy's. Most women are too busy raising families, working and trying to get through the day. Most Women don't have the time to play Wonder Woman. You really need to lay off the Movies a bit it's going to your head.

I'd much rather a Strong man do that for me, i can only do so much. I'm not Ninja material, sorry to burst your bubble.

I never once said I spoke for all women. But it's pretty easy to see that you and a lot of the other people in this thread think "femininity" deals with being soft or weak. I don't see it that way, and neither do the women I grew up with.

Also, I never said they were spies or Wonder Women, though many were also community activists, workers, and parents (so they were pretty much "Wonder Women" to me ). We had self defense programs in both the Muslim and Christian areas of my community when I was growing up. Even as kids, both the boys and girls could take archery, shooting classes, martial arts and far more. Because of that, I've always tried to empower women and have been attracted to strong women. Even my younger brother's first serious relationship was w/an amateur boxer lol.

So yeah, if you prefer to have men protect you, go for it. But that doesn't fly in my family line. The men may be on the front lines if something happens, but the women have always been just as capable. Even when someone's tried to break into one of our houses, the men will rush to see what happened while the women get a gun of their own and safeguard any kids or elders (or provide "backup" if there are no kids or elders). Even my Mom has a gun and she's retired lol.

(note: Then again, we don't particularly trust police or this govt (that's why I'm a gun's rights advocate even though I'm a proud progressive). My bloodlines on both sides of the family were involved in the Civil Rights Movement, the Women's Suffrage Movement, the US-Indian Wars throughout the South, and much much more. So needless to say, that damsel in distress crap doesn't fly w/us because we always needed their help in each stage of our "struggle". Or as I say, I want a Queen not a princess.)

originally posted by: jellyrev
a reply to: enlightenedservant

"When I was a kid you dressed like a women and sang about the devil. Now that was music" -Bill Burr.

LOL Exactly.

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: awareness10
a reply to: enlightenedservant

Actually no, what's ridiculous is that you automatically assumed that You spoke for all Women, I simply brought you back to reality in reminding you that No, not all Women are Ninja's, Freedom Fighters and International Spy's. Most women are too busy raising families, working and trying to get through the day. Most Women don't have the time to play Wonder Woman. You really need to lay off the Movies a bit it's going to your head.

I'd much rather a Strong man do that for me, i can only do so much. I'm not Ninja material, sorry to burst your bubble.

I never once said I spoke for all women. But it's pretty easy to see that you and a lot of the other people in this thread think "femininity" deals with being soft or weak. I don't see it that way, and neither do the women I grew up with.

Also, I never said they were spies or Wonder Women, though many were also community activists, workers, and parents (so they were pretty much "Wonder Women" to me

). We had self defense programs in both the Muslim and Christian areas of my community when I was growing up. Even as kids, both the boys and girls could take archery, shooting classes, martial arts and far more. Because of that, I've always tried to empower women and have been attracted to strong women. Even my younger brother's first serious relationship was w/an amateur boxer lol.

So yeah, if you prefer to have men protect you, go for it. But that doesn't fly in my family line. The men may be on the front lines if something happens, but the women have always been just as capable. Even when someone's tried to break into one of our houses, the men will rush to see what happened while the women get a gun of their own and safeguard any kids or elders (or provide "backup" if there are no kids or elders). Even my Mom has a gun and she's retired lol.

(note: Then again, we don't particularly trust police or this govt (that's why I'm a gun's rights advocate even though I'm a proud progressive). My bloodlines on both sides of the family were involved in the Civil Rights Movement, the Women's Suffrage Movement, the US-Indian Wars throughout the South, and much much more. So needless to say, that damsel in distress crap doesn't fly w/us because we always needed their help in each stage of our "struggle". Or as I say, I want a Queen not a princess.)

You said this to me

So you can speak for all women? That's ridiculous.

So when i said what i did, i was referring to the fact that you accused me for it first, that is 'speaking for all women'. Which i never said.

I understand you may know women who like the things you mentioned but all i'm saying is that, Not all women feel that way. And what about Older Women, the majority do not do Karate or Physically enduring tasks. The Majority of Younger Women, over 30 don't either.

Just so you understand, i don't see Men being feminine because they have feelings, cry sometimes or show pain considered as feminine by some. I have a male friend who has more testosterone than most men who has a higher voice and he's bugged endlessly for it, in a good way.

He's not feminized in any way shape or form. I actually think it's normal for a Man to express his feelings just like a Woman would as in death or joy. It's the inbetween that i am witnessing. In the 80's i didn't see it, the makeup, the hair, the tight pants. We as girls thought it was cool because we were told it was via radio and MTV/Much Music, and Advertisements. Now i see what the true agenda was being subtly pushed.

Now, well it's just so out of hand it's scary. It's not subtle anymore now it's in your face like it or not, and the subliminal push is harder than a sledgehammer smashing into a Video Screen on MTV.

It's nice you have Queens in your family, thats nice for you. But where some of us come from Women are strong in their own right, just not in the fighting slaughtering killing way. Our Men stand up for their Women and don't expect Women to do it, even though Our Women could if they had to.

a reply to: enlightenedservant

Well this is the family I came from, I'm over there hanging off my mother, and guess what,my mother and father are still together and they instilled values into me, women are not any less but they are different, and our roles are equally important. So while your seemingly progressive attitude may feel good, I think the destruction of genders and the common roles associated with them, is harming our society.

of course I could cite the suicide rates of men, or women becoming unhappier later in life (which I have) but frankly, we look at things very differently and that's ok, though I do wonder.. in one thread you suggested you wouldn't let your wife alone in a garage with another man Ect you were called out on this, it was in context of Islam, so I'm not really sure how "progressive" you truly are, and also just because you see the world the way you do, does not mean the majority does or that it should, either way, I don't have much problem with what you said, I just see things differently.

originally posted by: BatheInTheFountain
Back in the 1980s, early 90s, my hay day, even the most feminine men then, rivaled some of the more "masculine" ones now.

Yep, men in the 60s, 70s and 80s were so macho.











What a surprise, another crappy deluded thread about how things were so much better in the past when there were no gayz, and women knew their place (in the kitchen and bedroom of course).

My partner just asked me to hang the washing out. Should I have told her to go # herself, and get me a beer?

a reply to: cuckooold

Fashion especially men's fashion is not typical for the average man.

the late 60's early 70's were a weird time for the US. would one rather be drafted or go to college and be a hippie?

Being masculine is not equivalent to being a sexist or a jerk which many have alluded too. Being assertive, being industrious, being a provider, being the protector....I know evil misogynist.

originally posted by: SomeDumbBroad
To quote my favorite character, Tyler Durdan, in my all time favorite movie...

"We're a generation of men raised by women. I'm wondering if another woman is really the answer we need."

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ THIS. Tyler Durden is my spirit animal...so thank you.

originally posted by: TechniXcality
a reply to: enlightenedservant

Well this is the family I came from, I'm over there hanging off my mother, and guess what,my mother and father are still together and they instilled values into me, women are not any less but they are different, and our roles are equally important. So while your seemingly progressive attitude may feel good, I think the destruction of genders and the common roles associated with them, is harming our society.

1. Different cultures and upbringings, obviously. Though my parents are also still married so I don't know if you were trying to imply something there? It's all good though.

2. "Progressive"? Hmm... I wouldn't call it "progressive" since it's something that's always been the norm for us. My family line has always been like this, going back to the Muscogee/Creek matriarch of one of my bloodlines. We've been involved in the Seminole & Creek Wars w/the US (not on the US' side), the Women's Suffrage movement, the Civil Rights Movement, and much more (like the Black Panthers). Of course, there are also the other members of my family that fought for the US in WWII, Vietnam, the Gulf War, and recent wars (like one of my deceased gramps, my deceased uncle, and several of my cousins).

In other words, this was always the way my African American and Native American ancestors lived. That's true for the Muslims, Christians, and indigenous members alike. Women were always seen as equal members of our cultures because we had to work together in those times. And women were always the "matriarchs" in my maternal bloodline, which elevated them even further . So maybe it's "progress/progressive" to you, but it's "the norm" to me.

Though for the record, my amateur shooting champ ex was from a completely different background and region. Like I said earlier, I need a Queen not a princess. Or as one ex told me, she didn't want to stand behind me; she wanted to stand beside me... Man, I screwed up back then...

of course I could cite the suicide rates of men, or women becoming unhappier later in life (which I have) but frankly, we look at things very differently and that's ok, though I do wonder.. in one thread you suggested you wouldn't let your wife alone in a garage with another man Ect you were called out on this, it was in context of Islam, so I'm not really sure how "progressive" you truly are, and also just because you see the world the way you do, does not mean the majority does or that it should, either way, I don't have much problem with what you said, I just see things differently.

Well, suicide's against my beliefs so I won't comment on that. And I think unhappiness in old age can come from any number of different reasons, including severe pain or illness, loneliness, financial stress, etc. So it's hard to comment on that, too.

As for the bolded part, that has absolutely nothing to do with me being progressive/not progressive, being a Muslim, or anything else like that. It's a personal issue, because many of the women I care about have been raped before & because I've been cheated on several times (thanks for reminding me...). I don't particularly trust guys anyway, so that's also part of it. There are probably other reasons too but I don't care enough to look up what I'd typed then. So meh.

Just remember that everyone has different upbringings and it'll make things much simpler.

originally posted by: Bluntone22
Somebody has to be the first to die in the zombie apocalypse.

LOL like really hard!

a reply to: awareness10

Hey, the only reason I said any of that is because you were equating "feminized men" with "throwing tampons and running around like screaming ninnies".
www.abovetopsecret.com...

What would they do if War broke out? Throw tampons at each other and running around like screaming ninnies, perhaps?

That implied that you thought women fought like that and that these men would fight like that, too. But that clearly doesn't match my own upbringing or the women I've known my entire life, hence my responses.

I understand you may know women who like the things you mentioned but all i'm saying is that, Not all women feel that way. And what about Older Women, the majority do not do Karate or Physically enduring tasks. The Majority of Younger Women, over 30 don't either.

I understand that a lot of women don't do those things. But I also understand that a lot of women do. And the elder women in my extended family have guns just like the rest of us do. And just for the record, I might be a bit older than you're thinking.

Just so you understand, i don't see Men being feminine because they have feelings, cry sometimes or show pain considered as feminine by some. I have a male friend who has more testosterone than most men who has a higher voice and he's bugged endlessly for it, in a good way.

He's not feminized in any way shape or form. I actually think it's normal for a Man to express his feelings just like a Woman would as in death or joy. It's the inbetween that i am witnessing. In the 80's i didn't see it, the makeup, the hair, the tight pants. We as girls thought it was cool because we were told it was via radio and MTV/Much Music, and Advertisements. Now i see what the true agenda was being subtly pushed.

I can understand that. Though I also know quite a few guys who think the examples you listed also count as "feminine girly males", hence my other responses. So maybe our misunderstanding is over what that term actually means (assuming it even has a meaning)?

Now, well it's just so out of hand it's scary. It's not subtle anymore now it's in your face like it or not, and the subliminal push is harder than a sledgehammer smashing into a Video Screen on MTV.

I stopped paying attention to pop culture a long time ago, so I wouldn't know from that angle.

It's nice you have Queens in your family, thats nice for you. But where some of us come from Women are strong in their own right, just not in the fighting slaughtering killing way. Our Men stand up for their Women and don't expect Women to do it, even though Our Women could if they had to.

Strength doesn't have to be physical. I'm well aware of that. But whether people here want to admit it or not, many of our minority communities had to survive under completely different sets of rules for a long time. And I'm blessed enough to have elders who kept notes of our histories, family trees, and more.

I didn't appreciate it at the time, but I used to see my great grandmother almost every year when I was a child. She was the daughter of a literal slave and her 2 brothers were killed by Klansmen who seized their land (they were sharecroppers). The family tree would've ended right there if not for the strength and ingenuity of the women. I also got to meet and talk to her daughter (my great aunt), whose husband was unknowingly a part of the Tuskegee Experiments.

There's a boatload of stories that literally required the women to fight just for the rest of us to survive, whether the fighting was physically, politically, or economically (like the time period when my grandfather and his brothers and male cousins were drafted into segregated units in WW2). Of course, my family isn't the only one that went through these things, which is yet another reason why I responded the way I did.

a reply to: xuenchen

The main culprit is the Oestrogen in Dairy products, its gone up a massive amount since Cows are being bred to give more milk. To do this the Cow has to have high Oestrogen and growth hormone, which is transferred to the milk fats. Certain countries are adding an injection to boost it even more. So basically as the hormone based cancers get stupidly high levels,the males are getting increased amounts of which is a sex change hormone. Even fish and Caymans are showing signs of androgyny. You don't need much, a woman produces about a tea spoon full during her life time , it gets concentrated in cheese because it takes about ten litres of milk to make a kilo of cheese. Add a growth hormone that turns a calf into a two ton beast in eighteen months, which we shouldn't have after we are mature and no wonder their is a problem.

Am I the only one that finds it hilarious that these supposedly "masculine alpha males" are whining and worried and scared about guys getting more feminine?

THAT just means they will be compliant for use later ,not at all combatative, limited reaction perceptions,programable by the EMF coming from their cell phones,no doubt created that way.
1984 Epsilons.

I'm gonna go with the "Social Engineering" crowd on this one. Though, i don't think it's so much social engineering, as in a group purposefully attempting to change the masses, but more of a meme that is popular now, but will fade in time. Whatever is most prominent in the news will be what the masses tend to follow, good or bad. Younger people have trouble differentiating between what they think they should be and what they really are. This is why there is the age cutoff between those that say they are more feminine and those that identify as pure male. The older folk have enough life experience to understand what they are about regardless of the current climate.

This will all blow over once the media finds a new meme to latch onto. Who knows what the new stuff will be, but once the election season is over, i doubt this kind of stuff will carry as much weight and the masses will cease to identify with whatever they were once told to be.

I like the quote from the first Men In Black movie. When Will Smith's character is first confronted with the fact that aliens exist, he asks Agent K why they don't just tell the people about the aliens. His reasoning is that people are smart and will understand. Agent K replies "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." These people that are claiming to identify as feminine are just dumb, panicky dangerous animals who are afraid of being branded a sexist due to the current climate and will change their tune once the hullabaloo dies down.

a reply to: TheLaughingGod

Yeah I was referring to the old Alex Jones theory.

I am aware of medication in the water supply,the pill and such things.

I have never connected this to the rise of feminine males,trans people and what not.

Fascinating

Some of the posts about femininity and women in this thread are missing the point imo.

I remember how feminine my gran was, she grew roses and wore dresses and was tiny.
Yet she raised her eldest son alone when my grandad was called up, she worked in a bomb factory too.
She cooked healthy amazingly tasty food on a very tight budget, killed her own chickens and all the other stuff country people had to do.
A woman doesn't ever have to do a traditionally male job to be tough.
You just need to open your eyes and see how tough things can be.
And if you doubt me, try making your own cake and bread with a hand whisk and wooden spoon. If your forearms aren't killing you after a few minutes then chances are, you are someone's mum.

Too many people to respond to so hopefully they all read this...

Let's touch on JUST straight couples for a second (which BTW feminine men can be Straight, I never took this post to be about homosexuals)

Multiple studies show that women view the attractiveness of a male based on their menstrual cycles. Women tend to be more into men with muscles and facial hair when they are ovulating. Where do you think that comes from? Maybe the primal urge seek out the man who can best protect her tribe/family? It's all pretty non-offensive basic human nature when you look at the facts.

The Royal Society

Science Direct

There are also plenty of homosexual men out there who also identify as masculine so I do not think that this whole "1 in 5" study has anything to do with sexual preference. It's about how confident you feel as a male.

Gender roles do exist and I firmly believe in them. Luckily in today's society we don't have to adhere to them if we choose not to but, like Technixcality brought up, there is a massive link between societal norms changing and the increased suicide/mental disorder rate.

originally posted by: SprocketUK
Some of the posts about femininity and women in this thread are missing the point imo.

I remember how feminine my gran was, she grew roses and wore dresses and was tiny.
Yet she raised her eldest son alone when my grandad was called up, she worked in a bomb factory too.
She cooked healthy amazingly tasty food on a very tight budget, killed her own chickens and all the other stuff country people had to do.
A woman doesn't ever have to do a traditionally male job to be tough.
You just need to open your eyes and see how tough things can be.
And if you doubt me, try making your own cake and bread with a hand whisk and wooden spoon. If your forearms aren't killing you after a few minutes then chances are, you are someone's mum.

I agree, as my 83 year old mother said to me recently "Women are so much stronger than men but in different ways". It really is not about being more or less masculine or feminine (whatever biased description each of us cling to for comfort or self-deception - where is your comfort level?) but in personal preferences of life choices and self-identification through conditioning and fitting in with societal changes, which include taking hormones/steroids to balance whatever deficiency some decide they must correct - again, a life or self-identification choice.