Ok, undercoverchef, I see you believe that rich countries are somehow guilty for their vast wealth, I am here to show you that this left-wing propaganda is not true.

OK, First off im not a left winger! I do not think that one legged lesbian albinos are treated unfairly, nor do long for some left wing socialist society. I believe in democracy (when it is run fair) and do not believe we (in the west) should put down all our arms and pick up flowers. So just in case you think im some doped up hippie kid at Uni... you are wrong.

Those countries are poor, not because of "evil corporations" or western countries, but because of their corrupted and incompetent governments who do not wish to improve poor climate for business.

Clap Clap Clap... Oh well done... Oh i never realised this... NOT

Yes of course there own Governments are corrupt... WHO DO YOU THINK PUT THEM THERE???????

From CIA factbook about Nigerian economy, as a sample of African countries:

You taken information on Africa from the CIA Factbook??? OK, ill think ill get some love making techniques from Charles Manson

So your claims that we are living "on the back" of underdeveloped world is simply not true, those countries are poor because their governments are terrible

Yes and again i ask... Who put them there??

If we aint living off there backs then check out some of the links a provided earliar please...

As for Star Trek Utopia, it's pretty good now actually, with iPods, internet, lots of food and clothing obtainable by average person. Most people don't even realize how good they are doing.

OH LORD... How can you even include Ipods in this conversation... are you twelve... there are people who have to walk for hours just to get water... but oh no, it all ok cos you have a ipod and some Nike trainers. WTF.

And I am not even in USA, I am a student in Croatia, country with about 4 times lower living standard (which doubled since it adopted western-style economic practices) than in EU or US because of 40 years of communism.

OK... now it makes sense... A country that has just got rid of the Commies, not long got over a civil war, and is now pumped with more American Right Wing Propaganda than a Texas whore... And i had already guessed you was a student by your ipod comment.

Just out of curiosity... are you American or Crotian? (Im thinking you are an American Student on some kind of a swap.


And as a final note...

I have nothing against Americans (In case anyone is thinking im anti America)

America is a lovely country with some of the warmest people i have ever met... its just the Government that sucks. Just like most European Governments suck.

Originally posted by Amelia
Not only that!!!! smoking a blunt is illegal but "I forgot to lock the door of my car in a public parking and got a 50$ ticket"
And my dream would be to travel around the world, I just can't , it's too expensive, everything you want that cost money is against freedom IMO


Oh my what has the world come to! That sounds like a definite worldwide conspiracy to me. I see the Illuminati is alive and well.

[edit on 18-1-2005 by Osirisrisen]

[edit on 18-1-2005 by Osirisrisen]

Well, considering that almost all mainstream information about economic issues is biased to conform left-wing agenda, and knowing that BBC (known for its anti-americanism), and other sites you showed me are left-wing and socialist oriented, you can see that places where you get information are filled with lies.

Well it looks like we are not going to get very far with this debate. IMHO I think that all the links you have shown have a greedy right wing agenda. You are not going to change your view and I am not going to change mine. But I ask this... why are all human rights groups\aid organisations considered left wing nutters??? If wanting to help people and make the world a fair place to live makes you left wing then I would rather be left then right.

As for the link you have posted... oh yes its very clever, very clever indeed, I love the way it try’s to dumb down the atrocities that happened in south Africa by playing a numbers game with other African nations...

Quote from the website you posted...

But was South Africa the worst in terms of black lives lost? It turns out that about 5,000 South African blacks lost their lives. Do you see anything wrong with that picture: world silence in the wake of millions upon millions of black lives lost on the rest of the continent but world outrage in the case of South African apartheid and 5,000 lives lost?

The point with South Africa is that it was not a WAR... This was a simple case of White European settlers taking over someone’s land and then treating them like slaves.

And please do not reply to this comment with "it is the white s/Africans that made the country great... IMO big city’s and lots of money do not make a country great.

In fact the sites you have posted are so right wing biased its unbelievable... Because a lot of the famines in Africa are caused by war should we ignore them??? or is it just a case of "not my problem"

I don't know. WHO PUT THEM THERE? And how many years ago? And why does west pressure them to improve their economic practices? The only way to prevent those governments from exploiting their people is to invade them. And this is not a desirable solution.

America and Britain went to war with Iraq quick enough... why not stop some of these wars? why not remove some of these dictators? Answer is there is no benefit to the western powers... no oil

US and others cannot serve as a nanny for the whole world, you have to understand that everyone in the US, especially Bush admin. wants such countries to head towards the path of prosperity and democracy.

Why invade Iraq?

Again, you are instructing me to feel guilt because I am not starving. No thanks, I feel proud to live in a free society, unlike people in Africa. I'd like to see them free and prosper, and I would donate what I could to someone specific, but seriously, what can I do about it? Not even western governments can do anything without hard pressure or in worst case invasion.

I am not asking you to feel guilty about anything. I do not. But the first step to correcting a problem is to acknowledge it.

Having said all that what this thread was originally asking is do you believe there is a world conspiracy... I believe there is, the rich get richer while the poor get poorer. And we are offered gifts as a way of keeping us on the side of the corporates. We are just as enslaved as anyone, we just don’t see it. We are slaves without chains. Dogs being fed scraps from the tables of the corporate and we lap it up.

I do not have an answer but, being a religious person, I believe God will sort it all out at the end. So I just try to lead a humble life and acknowledge the things I believe to be wrong and try not to contribute to them.