It's International Day Against Homophobia and Transphobia!

originally posted by: daaskapital

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: Domo1
How is using accurate adjectives to describe behavior rude? It is accuracy.

It's not like these people are masking it somehow.

'Insufferable bigots' and 'ugly Americans' are general characterizations you made of people you disagree with. You are personally attacking people for having a different opinion to yourself. You accuse others of being rude and request them to stop, but you proceed to be rude yourself. You are acting hypocritical, but i expect nothing less of a person who admits to starting a thread to 'piss off' the right-wind members of the site.

And before you say anything, i don't identify as a conservative or a progressive. I couldn't really give a # about these meaningless games. I'm sick and tired of seeing all this #.

It's not a matter of "disagreeing" with someone who comes into a thread and immediately starts posting insulting and bigoted remarks.

It's also not a matter of totally ignoring the topic and making bigoted comments about the topic.

Calling a bigot a bigot is not bigoted, and neither is being intolerant of intolerance.

Trying to equate the OP who posted a topic that is celebrating a group of people overcoming injustice and attaining (somewhat) equal rights with those who are still trying to demean those people and discredit that effort is absurd.

In my opinion.

I don't see any relation between homosexuality and transsexuals, they are very different things.
It's as if they are demanding everyone who thinks being gay is fine to also accept transsexuality.
I refuse to conflate any equity of terminology between them.

originally posted by: Gryphon66
Interesting ... a "barrage of LBGT" topics that are more often than not started by conservatives complaining about others.

I suggest that if a topic is of no/low interest to you, don't click on it.

Do you know what I'm thinking now? how about now?

It's a shame, it made me smile.

Surely some of the posts here give validity to the fact that this day is indeed warranted and needed.

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: Gryphon66
Interesting ... a "barrage of LBGT" topics that are more often than not started by conservatives complaining about others.

I suggest that if a topic is of no/low interest to you, don't click on it.

Do you know what I'm thinking now? how about now?

It's a shame, it made me smile.

Nope, I'm not telepathic.

Did you have an actual point about the topic to make?

originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: daaskapital

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: Domo1
How is using accurate adjectives to describe behavior rude? It is accuracy.

It's not like these people are masking it somehow.

'Insufferable bigots' and 'ugly Americans' are general characterizations you made of people you disagree with. You are personally attacking people for having a different opinion to yourself. You accuse others of being rude and request them to stop, but you proceed to be rude yourself. You are acting hypocritical, but i expect nothing less of a person who admits to starting a thread to 'piss off' the right-wind members of the site.

And before you say anything, i don't identify as a conservative or a progressive. I couldn't really give a # about these meaningless games. I'm sick and tired of seeing all this #.

It's not a matter of "disagreeing" with someone who comes into a thread and immediately starts posting insulting and bigoted remarks.

It's also not a matter of totally ignoring the topic and making bigoted comments about the topic.

Calling a bigot a bigot is not bigoted, and neither is being intolerant of intolerance.

Trying to equate the OP who posted a topic that is celebrating a group of people overcoming injustice and attaining (somewhat) equal rights with those who are still trying to demean those people and discredit that effort is absurd.

In my opinion.

I'm saying she is being hypocritical because as much as she is against other members expressing their opinions in a 'rude' manner, she is more than happy to do it herself. Even the topic of this thread, the day itself, is not celebrating a 'group of people overcoming injustice' so much as it is aimed at homophobia and transphobia.

The OP is apparently sick of these topics, but she relishes in continuing the discussion. Me, personally, i'm sick of it all. I'm sick of the pro and anti sides. I just couldn't give a # anymore, lol.

originally posted by: Asktheanimals
I don't see any relation between homosexuality and transsexuals, they are very different things.
It's as if they are demanding everyone who thinks being gay is fine to also accept transsexuality.
I refuse to conflate any equity of terminology between them.

Groups that were discriminated against because of their sexual orientation and gender identity?

Naw. Absolutely no connection there.

Kudos for standing up for your right to use words as you wish though!

a reply to: daaskapital

Yes, I read your post. You're calling out another member for responding to folks trying to derail the specific stated intention of her post in a way that you didn't approve of.

And I'm saying that you're complaining about OP responding to the precise kind of insulting behavior she kindly requested NOT be a part of this particular thread in her post.

Calling a bigot out for what they are is not "rude." Noting that bigotry is generally "ugly" isn't either.

originally posted by: 1984hasarrived
Surely some of the posts here give validity to the fact that this day is indeed warranted and needed.

Yep, it surprises me how many ATS members have such a problem with a social demographic which I can't imagine tangiably affects their lives in any way.
I muse to myself that it must be blind hatred for something different, fear, basic bigoted intolerance, religious faith, or a mixture of the lot.

It must make life a challenge to be so troubled and unsettled by gender/sexual orientation issues...maybe it is more indicative of the posters than the social demographic which apparently inspires so much emotion?

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: daaskapital

Yes, I read your post. You're calling out another member for responding to folks trying to derail the specific stated intention of her post in a way that you didn't approve of.

And I'm saying that you're complaining about OP responding to the precise kind of insulting behavior she kindly requested NOT be a part of this particular thread in her post.

Calling a bigot out for what they are is not "rude." Noting that bigotry is generally "ugly" isn't either.

I'm calling her out for being rude to members and (somewhat, even in jest) admitting to starting the thread to piss people off, all the while requesting her opponents (for lack of a better term) to remain civil. It's hypocrisy, and she knew full well what she was getting into with this thread.

Responding to people with ad hominem attacks is rude, regardless of whether or not they fit the description.

a reply to: daaskapital

Yes, thanks for repeating yourself (again), and I'm responding to you (for the last time) pointing out that calling out bigotry is not being rude.

The OP's intention was not as one-sided as you're trying to make it. What say you and I both drop the meta-discussion about the OP and our opinions about her intent and style and let the thread progress, on-topic.

Deal?

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: daaskapital

Yes, thanks for repeating yourself (again), and I'm responding to you (for the last time) pointing out that calling out bigotry is not being rude.

The OP's intention was not as one-sided as you're trying to make it. What say you and I both drop the meta-discussion about the OP and our opinions about her intent and style and let the thread progress, on-topic.

Deal?

All we're doing is repeating our points, so i'm just as eager to drop it as you are.

On the topic of pointing out bigotry, i do think it is rude to address the person and not their argument, especially when characterizing others (like the OP calling members bigots or ugly Americans). If someone called a homosexual member of our community 'ugly' or a 'bigot', i'm sure the OP and others wouldn't be happy.

Perhaps you are correct, but it is difficult to gain a sense of balance in a thread so chaotic and divided.

Thanks for the chat.

a reply to: daaskapital

If the homosexual member of our community was being a bigot, I doubt anyone would have a problem with calling it out.

Of note, you're not really doing anything here but trying to disparage Buzzy ... so it's a teapot/kettle/tempest thing.

You're welcome for the chat. No hard feelings.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
Really, people?

The words "insufferable bigot" keep coming to mind.

I even asked nicely to please keep it positive - and you just couldn't help yourselves. Amazing.

So people don't agree with you and have an opinion that differs from yours and you call them insufferable bigots? If that's not the pot calling the kettle black I don't know what is. Maybe you should go to an LGBT site if you don't want a real discussion. I hear the LGBT is big on free speech for only those that agree and you prove the point..

Isnt that the day the gay pastor came out and said he defaced a cake to try and steal money from Whole Foods? I mean he was hitting on all cylinders. "Thou shalt not bear false witness" AND he is a man of the cloth? LOL YA RIGTH!

I suspect 99.99% of these bigoted incidents are perpetrated by the LGBT.

"International Day Against Homophobia and Transphobia!." Pffft.. Give me a break..

originally posted by: RepealTheLaw
"International Day Against Homophobia and Transphobia!." Pffft.. Give me a break..

I'm curious, give you a break from what?
Does it trouble you when a social demographic attempts to raise awareness of the real abuse, even death, some of them suffer around the world, including 'developed' countries.

I don't have any issue with it personally as they are only identifying some sad facts of life which many suffer at the hands of bigoted people.
So yep, I'm curious, what exactly about a day of awareness to highlight hatred of a specific group of people do you need a break from?
You could easily have ignored this thread, yet you chose to partake in the discussion. Seems strange from someone who claims to need a break from the subject matter?

originally posted by: RepealTheLaw
Isnt that the day the gay pastor came out and said he defaced a cake to try and steal money from Whole Foods? I mean he was hitting on all cylinders. "Thou shalt not bear false witness" AND he is a man of the cloth? LOL YA RIGTH!

I suspect 99.99% of these bigoted incidents are perpetrated by the LGBT.

"International Day Against Homophobia and Transphobia!." Pffft.. Give me a break..

Your theory might have some merit ... Except you just proved what an insufferable bigot you apparently are.

/shrug unless you're "the LGBT" too of course ... Then you're just hypocritical.

a reply to: kaylaluv

People tend to get real emotional on the gun issue, just like this issue.

You can't take 'em guns without prizing them from their cold, dead hands!

Funny thing is I've taken part in gun debates before...the hardcore gun nuts remind me of the hardcore trans nuts....complete tunnel vision.

Should I refer to a man as 'her' or 'she' if...um...he, is trans? Or a woman as him?

If a trans man is masquerading as a female...is it still okay for people like me to say - see him..that guy over there, I like his hair, it's very colourful.

would it be taken as an offense if we don't refer to people as the gender they identify as?

a reply to: samerulesapply

I know you were not asking me, but for the record, I personally refer to people as the gender they identify with and publicly present themselves as in my community/society.
The idea of 'masquerading' is not something I perceive, but then I've known many in my life so perhaps the issue doesn't faze me as it seems to do for many members on ATS.

a reply to: grainofsand

How would that even work?

so if I see a chap all kind of limp wristed and displaying feminine attributes I should think...best call thsi person ma'am. Some might take that as an insult.

Soo, the point is...in order for this premise fo be enacted in a realistic way, myself and everyone I know will have to conform to some standard.

We'll have to probably call a him a her and what have you. I can see me offending many people in future, unwittingly.

It's not the transgender folk that are confused any more, it's people like me.

Do I want me neice and nephew calling men 'she' and 'her' - no.

Do I want to take part in such a charade? No.

There are countless problems with this whole thing, I genuinely am gobsmacked at how blind many people seem to be to these very real issues. Seems it matters not any more of consequences...people just want what they want.

We can claim bigotry and hate on both sides here. I've been quite flippant in my past posts but I am sincere in my beliefs, I believe this is a problem just as such and such believes they're a girl with mans bits.

In realistic terms I cannot see how this will ever work in a way that doesn't offend someone.

So serious question...how do trans people genuinely want this to play out? What's the plan?

We have mass ecceptance...how do things work now?