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Before The Beginning There Was...

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posted on May, 14 2016 @ 07:49 PM
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originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: MissSmartypants

originally posted by: introvert
Where did the chaos come from?
I was hoping no one would ask that before I had time to think of the answer. Sigh...
It came from a chicken, ok? Or an egg...whatever.


This sort of topic is not my sort of thing, but let me step-out of my realm and say this:

Perhaps the "chaos" is the manifestation or reflection of the "creators" own internal conflict. The chaos within itself trying to come to terms with it's own omnipotence and reflected on to the "physical" existence. Once that inner-turmoil was resolved, chaos turned to order. Blackness to light, unawareness to self-awareness.

Ok, I'm done.
Nope. Never happened.




posted on May, 14 2016 @ 08:09 PM
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originally posted by: maria_stardust
I could have sworn in an alternate universe this made sense.

Damn Mandela Effect.
I have something to tell you and you may want to sit down first...The universe I'm posting from is the primary universe. Sorry but the universe you inhabit is the alternate one. Thought you knew.



posted on May, 16 2016 @ 10:40 AM
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originally posted by: MissSmartypants
So does anything exist if there is no observer? No it does not and perhaps the void HAD to give rise to the Awareness in order for the void to be able to exist. The chicken and the egg all over again.
.

I'd say everything exists regardless if it is observed or not. If it didn't, it couldn't be observed in the first place. It's like if the tree falls in the woods and nobody hears it, does it make a sound? Of course it does! We aren't that special and observation is not a special act.
edit on 5 16 16 by Barcs because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 26 2016 @ 02:52 AM
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There was no 'before' the beginning; the concept of timer/change only existed after the universe got created...



posted on Jul, 11 2016 @ 07:34 PM
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a reply to: Barcs




It's like if the tree falls in the woods and nobody hears it, does it make a sound?


There is no sound other than the phenomenon your brain creates after it converts the vibrations from your ear mechanism, both electrically and hydraulically, into what you call 'sound'.

If a tree falls, and there's nothing to hear it, it does not make a sound. Nothing, in and of itself, can create a sound. It has no existence outside of your perception of it.
edit on 11-7-2016 by Visitor2012 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 11 2016 @ 07:43 PM
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a reply to: MissSmartypants

That doesn't make sense though. There isn't anything before the Beginning. That's why it's called the Beginning. There may have been chaos before the order but there was a beginning to the chaos.

You're comparing two different things. Beginnings are a reference to time while chaos isn't a reference of time at all.



posted on Jul, 12 2016 @ 09:37 AM
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a reply to: Visitor2012

That's not true in the least. The sound waves created by the tree falling are measurable, whether somebody is there to interpret it or not, these sound waves are still created. Even if a deaf person was there, they could record these waves and interpret them on a computer, and even figure out what type of sound it is without even listening to it. Sound exists, even if you don't hear it. If it was based completely on perception, then we wouldn't be able to record sound waves. It's a tangible, observable thing, even if you can't hear it.


edit on 7 12 16 by Barcs because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 12 2016 @ 12:55 PM
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a reply to: Barcs



That's not true in the least. The sound waves created by the tree falling are measurable, whether somebody is there to interpret it or not, these sound waves are still created.


Yes, the vibrations are measurable. You can not measure sound. Vibrations in the air, only become the phenomenon of sound you experience, after it is hydraulically and electrically converted via the ear and brain. When a tree falls, vibrations in the air are created regardless if there is anyone there or not. BUT the phenomenon of sound is only the result of vibrational conversion. Car speakers don't emit sound, they send vibrations into the air. The sound only happens in your brain.




Even if a deaf person was there, they could record these waves and interpret them on a computer, and even figure out what type of sound it is without even listening to it.


You can record vibration, you can not record the phenomenon itself because it doesn't exist. The computer is electrically converting vibrations, it isn't funneling sound straight through.



Sound exists, even if you don't hear it.


Does the sun make a sound? No, it emits vibration, energy. The only time you can hear it, is when that energy is propagated through a medium, converted and sent to your ear as detectable vibration which can then be processed via the ear/brain mechanism into the phenomenon called sound.



If it was based completely on perception, then we wouldn't be able to record sound waves. It's a tangible, observable thing, even if you can't hear it.


Prove that sound exists outside of the perception of it. Yes, you can record the waves, but they are not sound. The vibrations are real, because it is energy. But the phenomenon of sound itself does not exist outside of your brain. Even if you want to call these vibrations 'sound waves', the phenomenon of sound (which is what we're talking about) does not exist in the vibration itself. It is a product created by the brain AFTER it has processed these vibrations into electrical impulses and creates the sound you experience. THIS sound you experience has no existential properties, it is only a phenomenon created in the brain of the hearer.

If sound ACTUALLY existed outside of your head, why have ear drums or the mechanism of the inner ear? Ears are not funnels where sound passes through directly into your awareness of them. They're mechanisms that hydraulically convert waves into electrical impulses, which your brain (or computer) processes into the sound you perceive, regardless if it's a human, or a deer listening.
edit on 12-7-2016 by Visitor2012 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 12 2016 @ 01:27 PM
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Before the beginning there was chaos a black hole but it wasn't visible. It hadn't broke through into this realm. The sun(s) are holding back and are fueled by black holes from the other side or another dimension. They will eventually become black holes themselves again in time reversing the cycle, breaking back into another realm. This is why some solar systems seam younger or older than projected. This is the latest model.



posted on Jul, 12 2016 @ 01:51 PM
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originally posted by: TamtammyMacx
Before the beginning there was chaos a black hole but it wasn't visible. It hadn't broke through into this realm. The sun(s) are holding back and are fueled by black holes from the other side or another dimension. They will eventually become black holes themselves again in time reversing the cycle, breaking back into another realm. This is why some solar systems seam younger or older than projected. This is the latest model.


Where is the science that supports this theory?



posted on Jul, 12 2016 @ 01:54 PM
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a reply to: TamtammyMacx

Not only is this not the latest model, it's not a model at all. Please feel free to prove me wrong by properly citing appropriate peer reviewed papers that suggest something resembling what you claim.



posted on Jul, 12 2016 @ 02:03 PM
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First of all, thank you for your continued interest in this thread. But to clarify...observation is not just human observation but mechanical, such as by instrumental measuring, as well as sub atomic interactions such as photons interacting, or chemical interactions or even dare I say spiritual interaction such as prayer and meditation. Anything which by its interaction collapses the wave function of the energy and for the briefest of moments gives it form.
edit on 7/12/2016 by MissSmartypants because: More info

edit on 7/12/2016 by MissSmartypants because: Info



posted on Jul, 12 2016 @ 02:09 PM
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originally posted by: TamtammyMacx
Before the beginning there was chaos a black hole but it wasn't visible. It hadn't broke through into this realm. The sun(s) are holding back and are fueled by black holes from the other side or another dimension. They will eventually become black holes themselves again in time reversing the cycle, breaking back into another realm. This is why some solar systems seam younger or older than projected. This is the latest model.
Nope. Wrong.



posted on Jul, 12 2016 @ 02:11 PM
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originally posted by: mOjOm
a reply to: MissSmartypants

That doesn't make sense though. There isn't anything before the Beginning. That's why it's called the Beginning. There may have been chaos before the order but there was a beginning to the chaos.

You're comparing two different things. Beginnings are a reference to time while chaos isn't a reference of time at all.
Nope. Wrong.



posted on Jul, 12 2016 @ 02:24 PM
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a reply to: MissSmartypants

Nope, you're wrong.

Too bad for you.

Try again.

You Lose.

Incorrect.

Bye Bye now.

Thank you come again.

Loser.



posted on Jul, 12 2016 @ 02:30 PM
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originally posted by: mOjOm
a reply to: MissSmartypants

Nope, you're wrong.

Too bad for you.

Try again.

You Lose.

Incorrect.

Bye Bye now.

Thank you come again.

Loser.
You forgot to stomp your little foot and storm off in a huff. But that's ok.



posted on Jul, 12 2016 @ 02:34 PM
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originally posted by: MissSmartypants
First of all, thank you for your continued interest in this thread. But to clarify...observation is not just human observation but mechanical, such as by instrumental measuring, as well as sub atomic interactions such as photons interacting, or chemical interactions or even dare I say spiritual interaction such as prayer and meditation. Anything which by its interaction collapses the wave function of the energy and for the briefest of moments gives it form.


Which is all very interesting and makes you sound almost as if you know what you're talking about. Almost. But it still doesn't change the fact that "The Beginning" designates the start. So nothing is before it. Otherwise it wouldn't be The Beginning.



posted on Jul, 12 2016 @ 02:36 PM
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originally posted by: MissSmartypants
You forgot to stomp your little foot and storm off in a huff. But that's ok.


You forgot that your spiritual woo means nothing and is all just BS.

If there is something before the beginning then the beginning isn't the beginning.
edit on 12-7-2016 by mOjOm because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 12 2016 @ 02:58 PM
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originally posted by: mOjOm

originally posted by: MissSmartypants
You forgot to stomp your little foot and storm off in a huff. But that's ok.


You forgot that your spiritual woo means nothing and is all just BS.

If there is something before the beginning then the beginning isn't the beginning.
You're arguing semantics while this thread is about concepts.(Waits patiently for you to catch up)



posted on Jul, 12 2016 @ 03:08 PM
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a reply to: MissSmartypants

Your claim is that "Before the Beginning...." So when exactly was that?? When is before the Beginning??? Please explain that concept to me please.

Because whenever that Before was, That would be the Beginning. Because you're talking about a reference in Time with no distinction between events or divisions of Time meaning there is only one Beginning.

I'm not arguing semantics at all. I'm arguing your incorrect temporal concepts which make no sense.




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