Dear Nakash, I still cannot understand why you are so intolerant when it comes to muslims' beliefs. This is what I get from this discussion.
1- You charge muslims with having their own view of Jesus Christ. A Jew can easily charge you with having your own view of Moses, and so on.
2- You call muslims' God a false one. This reminds me of an episode of South Park in which some Christians in Hell found out that the true religion
was mormonism. How sure can we really be about the authenticity of our religion? Were you there when the Bible was written? The Church of 16th century
had Bible-proven reasons that the Earth is flat. Search the internet and you can find many sites questioning the whole Christian doctrine. Some of the
charges seem too logical to me to be ignored. But unlike some friends of mine, I haven't lost my faith in it totally. The Bible was not meant to be
100 percent fool-proof. But I don't care. I read it and do according to it whenever it seems logical to me. Like you, I hate wine, but I don't care
why Jesus turned water to wine. Whether it really happened or was added later, I don't care. Because I have my wisdom to rely on.
3- The Quran is a botched up parody of the Bible? As a Jew, I could tell you that the Bible is a botched up parody of the Torah. But is it really
4- Your view of Mohammed is incredibly wrong. I don't know how you got it. He may not be a prophet, but he was indeed a great man of his time. When
he conquered Mecca, he forgave all his sworn enemies. During his life, he nevered fought for conquering the world. Instead, he sent messengers to
different kings and invited them to accept his religion. He got married several times all right, but he never raped and he definitely was not a sexual
pervert. In fact, raping is thought one of the (I think) forty biggest crimes in Islam which won't be forgiven by God. Definitely not an arrogant
person, because the tales say you couldn't recognize him among his followers in Mecca if you hadn't seen him before. His life, before and after his
ruling, was equal to the poorest of his people. He was called "the honest one" among his friends and enemies equal, and robbing people is totally
out of the question because he never owned any big deal of money and he never had an expensive life. What is awesome is that the muslims think all
prophets lived honestly. They think Jesus, Moses, Abraham and all had the same personality and the greatest one among their own people.
5- The story of Jizya, the way XT put it forward, is totally wrong. It's not the money non-muslims give to muslims the way he said it. Jizya was a
kind of tax for those non-muslims living in the Islamic Empire. The muslims paid their taxes too, but because the way the money was spent was
different it was given a different name. (I think mainly it was to ensure unity among disunited Arabs of those years.) But even non-muslims had a
wonderful life with muslims. An amazing story tells us about Mohammad's cousin, Ali, who when heard a Jewish woman was attacked and robbed of her
jewels in a far muslim city, told the people in a mosque: "If a man hears this and dies of grief, it comes as no surprise to me." What later was
done by greedy caliphs has nothing to do with them, the same way as what the popes did in the 16th century had nothing to do with Jesus Christ's
6- Islam was the first religion to ban slavery. But for those people who still resisted the idea, Islam has a very detailed set of instructions to
ensure their safety and comfort. Interesting to know that Islam even talks about slaves' sexual needs and that they should be given the opportunity
to satisfy that. And that slaves should be given a decent meal, a decent place to sleep, and that no way a master may insult his slave by cruel words.
And many many more ...
7- Your idea of respecting muslims is also strange. You call their God a false God, their prophet a pervert ,a rapist and a bloodthirsty ruler. You
call their book a botch up parody. Where is the idea of respect here?
8- To sum up, I invite you all to respecting each other. Nobody was there when God created the world. Nobody was there when God sent His messengers
unto the Earth to lead people. As a result, nobody can be sure what/who is exactly right or wrong. If I was born in China, I'd be a buddhist. If I
was born in Iraq, I'd be a muslim. Now I'm a christian 'cause I was born here, in the heart of christian kingdom. This certainly doesn't count.
God is much cleverer and far kinder to punish people for these social effects. God looks at clean hands, not full ones. And this world won't be a
good place to live, unless we all start to undestand our differences and learn to tolerate them. That's why we think of religion as a personal issue.
I don't think we can muck people because they eat what we don't like.
9- Believe in any religion you like, but being a human is a worldwide concept. Killing, terror, lying, murder, backbiting, ... are all bad in all
worthy religions. Why not focus on these aspects of our similarities?
[edit on 2-3-2006 by scorpinka]