What are we looking for.

originally posted by: odzeandennz
5) and advanced race, logically would rather stay secluded from outsiders. an advanced race would create paradise on their homeworld and remain there. an advanced race would not have doubts, need to conquer,war, wouldnt yearn anything or have any more questions. movement would seem pointless if theyve conquered all questions.

Why is that logically so? Why would not an advanced race spread out into the Universe and adapt it to its needs? Every cell multiplies, do they not? If an 'intelligence' of some sorts developed 2 billion years ago, it is more likely that we live in a Universe designed by them than not IMO. It is more likely than not that we're part of their design rather than a random spark of intelligence, because an advanced race could spread life in an organized fashion.

originally posted by: Heliocentric

originally posted by: odzeandennz
5) and advanced race, logically would rather stay secluded from outsiders. an advanced race would create paradise on their homeworld and remain there. an advanced race would not have doubts, need to conquer,war, wouldnt yearn anything or have any more questions. movement would seem pointless if theyve conquered all questions.

Why is that logically so? Why would not an advanced race spread out into the Universe and adapt it to its needs? Every cell multiplies, do they not? If an 'intelligence' of some sorts developed 2 billion years ago, it is more likely that we live in a Universe designed by them than not IMO. It is more likely than not that we're part of their design rather than a random spark of intelligence, because an advanced race could spread life in an organized fashion.

i beg to differ.

your idea of an intelligent race is just us but smarter. what you listted are things we would do if we could. thats all.

a truely advanced race would see no need to spread. their emotions would not be the same as us, they would not only evolve technologically, but biologically presumably. their needs would evolve from our needs. they would not want the implications which would inevitably come with spreading their cultures around the universe. they would rather try to attain perfection, in every sense of the word.

its less likely an advanced being is the way we paint advanced beings in our sci fi writtings and movies.
again, were simply imagining a version of us.

a reply to: odzeandennz

We will never find intelligent and civilised life on another planet. Not because there is no potentiality , but because if life does exist, if it civilized, if it is intelligent, it will do everything within its power to avoid us as those are concepts we do not possess.

Until we evolve our prospect of meeting new life "100% smarter" than us is abysmal. Would you want to relate to a race like us if you had an extremely high level of intellect and assumably, by extension, a highly civilized civilization?

a reply to: RevolutionAnon

a novel and tangible point, still that is something us humans would do and therefore project that unto an advanced civilization yet to be found.
its safe to say whatever we think that advanced race might do, is exactly what we would.


realistically, i think were basically looking for ourselves.

a reply to: odzeandennz

I think humans would adopt a "lesser species", some for moral reasons, some for personal gain, others through arrogance.
If an alien race exists and knows of us, and they possess an intellect greater than ours, I am pretty sure they would just leave us to our corrupt leaders, our destructive greed and primitive civilization.

a reply to: odzeandennz

There are alot of poeple whose jobs are dependent on the "Search." If we find anything then what happens to their jobs? So, the search continues........

originally posted by: TinfoilTP
If we made contact with a more advanced life, they would force us to follow their religion by sending missionaries with colonizing armies. Maybe you would be forced to bow down to an actual spaghetti monster or else. Would be an interesting prospect for atheists.

Unless the Spaghetti Missionairies can prove that we were created by their God, I would expect a lot of dead atheists & a lot of religious people actively changing their priorities.

originally posted by: odzeandennz


1) we are constantly looking for 'intelligent life forms'
why? really why? what is the point, what do we hope to achieve, what cant we do without finding these 'intelligent life'. if weve figured out the big questions, why not keep going solo and keep pushing forward. what makes us think those life forms will unveil or expose something we dont already know or at least theorized.

We're looking for what we can steal or "borrow". Those with power want one thing....more power.

2) why do we insist on looking for ourselve when trying to "detect" those 'inteligent life', what makes us think they will have similar physiology. i.e. means to see hear breathe and [need of energy as we know it. ]
if we send videos, data, writting, sound clips, what makes us think they take in information as we do? why assume they will "see or hear" what we sent up there. what if they are absolutely nothing like us, so much so we dont even think they are 'alive' (in the generic term). what if they "see" using something we cant even imagine.

The only "intelligence" we acknowledge is our own...us being egocentric beings and all...human arrogance and ignorance is likely one of the largest factors in how we perceive intelligent life....

3) if the oceans are any indication of how life can flourish in the most remote and inhabitale regions of the planet, deprived of oxigen, light and 'nutrients'; why do we look for life on 'earth-like' planets. meaning planet that have similar 'surfaces' as earth. why would it be far fetched to assume life may be thriving on Saturn or Jupiter or mercury. if life is flourishing at oceanic depths where the earths core meets the surface, and toxic gases and heat would make life impossible, yet we see the opposite, why not assume there is life on say pluto or venus or ceres or the moon but were just looking for human like species. surface dwellers.

earth-like planets are simply more statistically likely to be inhabited by extraterrestial lifeforms than very harsh environments. Not only that, but exploring every planet, whether it's what we deem "hospitable" or not, would be very time and resource demanding...

4) were only .1% different from chimps, and we have phones that can start our motorized vehicles. look at us and look at the smartest xhimp alive today. now imagine meeting an intelligence that is 100% smarter than us. what then? would we even understand or be able to imagine what it does?

We would likely be able to kill it....and I think that's probably what we'd do....you know, for science....

5) theoretically, time is not linear. in essence if something can happen, it will happen and has already happened. meaning, if we created a time machine in the future, we would already have seen or observed such indications . remember that .1% difference from chimps, imagine what a really advanced race at 100000% our brain capacity. would they already have found us. what makes us think they havent?

We have no indication that they have, which leads us to think they haven't. If I don't find a flea on my cat, it would be quite ignorant for me to assume that she did indeed have fleas. Evidence is king...

5) and advanced race, logically would rather stay secluded from outsiders. an advanced race would create paradise on their homeworld and remain there. an advanced race would not have doubts, need to conquer,war, wouldnt yearn anything or have any more questions. movement would seem pointless if theyve conquered all questions. why do we think they would allow us, less advanced to polute whatever system they have worked for eons to achieve . an advance race would work toward using as little energy and emitting as little as posible, not create a Dyson sphere...

you've assumed quite a bit about an advanced race...but none of those are substantiated claims. No one can say for certain what an advanced race would or would not do. In fact, 2 advanced races could be completely different, one might be conquering warriors, while the other might be passive on-lookers.

6) lastly, is there anything ive asked here which scientists havent, or should not have asked themselves long ago?

They've likely all asked themselves these questions...but the quest for power and knowledge continues...because you know, science.

A2D

a reply to: odzeandennz

We are innately curious because we evolved that response to fear. Human beings, deep in their amygdalas, have fight or flight responses. We fear, to differing degrees, the unknown things in our world, our universe.

Some cower away from that which befuddles them, and others have the opposite response. They desire to conquer their fear, by learning, by knowing, and by so doing reducing the number of things they do not know, and thereby reducing the number of things they fear.

We can argue that our sophistication means that we no longer fear the unknown, but that would be hubris and inaccuracy of the highest calibre. Our minds have developed, but we still only get the binary choice of fleeing from, or fighting fear. Curiosity is the set of brass balls that our species has, that informs us that it is better to be curious than to live in constant terror.

originally posted by: odzeandennz

1) we are constantly looking for 'intelligent life forms'
why? really why? what is the point, what do we hope to achieve, what cant we do without finding these 'intelligent life'. if weve figured out the big questions, why not keep going solo and keep pushing forward. what makes us think those life forms will unveil or expose something we dont already know or at least theorized.

We are looking for a lot of things. Intelligent life is only one of them. To "keep pushing forward" you have to understand your environment, thus the drive to explore.

2) why do we insist on looking for ourselve when trying to "detect" those 'inteligent life', what makes us think they will have similar physiology. i.e. means to see hear breathe and [need of energy as we know it. ]
if we send videos, data, writting, sound clips, what makes us think they take in information as we do? why assume they will "see or hear" what we sent up there. what if they are absolutely nothing like us, so much so we dont even think they are 'alive' (in the generic term). what if they "see" using something we cant even imagine.

Who are those insisting persons you are mentioning? I doubt you will find many scientists thinking that alien life will be like us. Sending of information is done in the hope that an advanced life form will recognize it as such, even if it does not understand it.

3) if the oceans are any indication of how life can flourish in the most remote and inhabitale regions of the planet, deprived of oxigen, light and 'nutrients'; why do we look for life on 'earth-like' planets. meaning planet that have similar 'surfaces' as earth. why would it be far fetched to assume life may be thriving on Saturn or Jupiter or mercury. if life is flourishing at oceanic depths where the earths core meets the surface, and toxic gases and heat would make life impossible, yet we see the opposite, why not assume there is life on say pluto or venus or ceres or the moon but were just looking for human like species. surface dwellers.

We are looking for 'earth-like' planets because the chance to find life (as we know it) on them is higher, which means that they get prioritized. We are certainly not just looking for human like species. Not sure where you've got this idea from.

4) were only .1% different from chimps, and we have phones that can start our motorized vehicles. look at us and look at the smartest xhimp alive today. now imagine meeting an intelligence that is 100% smarter than us. what then? would we even understand or be able to imagine what it does?

But we can communicate with chimps and other animals. Yes, the communication is limited, but it is communication nonetheless. The communication with much more intelligent life forms will simply be limited to what we can understand.

5) and advanced race, logically would rather stay secluded from outsiders. an advanced race would create paradise on their homeworld and remain there. an advanced race would not have doubts, need to conquer,war, wouldnt yearn anything or have any more questions. movement would seem pointless if theyve conquered all questions. why do we think they would allow us, less advanced to polute whatever system they have worked for eons to achieve . an advance race would work toward using as little energy and emitting as little as posible, not create a Dyson sphere...

How do you know what an advanced race would do?

From a more general point of view, the main driver of life is reproduction. Reproduction in a favorable environment results in growth. Growth results in expansion.

We just want to know whether we're truly alone in this universe.

originally posted by: odzeandennz

originally posted by: Heliocentric

originally posted by: odzeandennz
5) and advanced race, logically would rather stay secluded from outsiders. an advanced race would create paradise on their homeworld and remain there. an advanced race would not have doubts, need to conquer,war, wouldnt yearn anything or have any more questions. movement would seem pointless if theyve conquered all questions.

Why is that logically so? Why would not an advanced race spread out into the Universe and adapt it to its needs? Every cell multiplies, do they not? If an 'intelligence' of some sorts developed 2 billion years ago, it is more likely that we live in a Universe designed by them than not IMO. It is more likely than not that we're part of their design rather than a random spark of intelligence, because an advanced race could spread life in an organized fashion.

i beg to differ.

your idea of an intelligent race is just us but smarter. what you listted are things we would do if we could. thats all.

a truely advanced race would see no need to spread. their emotions would not be the same as us, they would not only evolve technologically, but biologically presumably. their needs would evolve from our needs. they would not want the implications which would inevitably come with spreading their cultures around the universe. they would rather try to attain perfection, in every sense of the word.

its less likely an advanced being is the way we paint advanced beings in our sci fi writtings and movies.
again, were simply imagining a version of us.

I know you beg to differ, you made it clear in the OP.

You're simply stating an opinion, and so am I. We could spend all day arguing about what a highly advanced conscience would do or not and we're simply guessing. Ask an ant what the highway next to the colony is all about and where it leads and why, I don't believe we know more than the ant.

What I reacted against was your way of pretending to know the logical course of action of such a conscience.

There's a great variety of life on Earth, with many life forms that look almost nothing like other life forms. Yet they all have the underlying DNA structure and basic similarities in terms of how they function on the molecular level.

The universe, with its stars and planets, is pretty much the same on the basic level, too. I really believe that life elsewhere obeys the same physical and chemical rules, and thus functions in the same basic principle as life on Earth.

The Earth is just one planet out of trillions of planets out there, there's nothing special or unique about it. It formed in the same way, out of the same elements. The way life appeared and evolved on Earth is exactly how it could have appeared and evolved on any other similar planet out there. If life forms on Earth eventually develloped two eyes, elongated body, and pairs of limbs, in order to see better and to move more efficiently on dry land, there's every chance that life forms on other planets did the same.

There's absolutely no reason to maintain that extraterrestrial life forms have to be completely different from ours, just like there's absolutely no reason to maintain that we're alone in the universe.

a reply to: wildespace

If you'll pardon this, life is a virus...wherever we have sent detectors of any sort we discovered elements consistent with life's building blocks...

The Milky Way Galaxy and indeed the universe is teeming with life...it is the height of arrogance to believe intellectual beings have not evolved in every corner of the universe...while the ranks of aliens who self-actualize remain a minority when gauged against the whole of the universe's real estate, this does not change he fact that innumerable civilizations exist...

And while our leaders bother with whose magic being in the sky is the greatest, the general populace languishes...
Only until NASA is restored to its former glory will mankind be on the correct path...

Where have you gon, Werner Von Braun?

-Christosterone