Climate Change Denial, Anyone?

a reply to: pl3bscheese

Since you're so into that 'evidence' thing, I guess you'll have some to back up the "it's too late anyway" doom-porn you got going on there.

Why? Are you saying I have no evidence to support my contention?

My point is that the situation has moved beyond debate, rendering further discussion irrelevant.

Yes, we’re doomed. It doesn’t turn me on, though. On the contrary, I devoutly hope I am wrong.

a reply to: Teikiatsu

If you think the climate is going to negatively impact you, move to where it won't negatively impact you.

Sadly, interplanetary travel on a mass scale has yet to be accomplished.

a reply to: mc_squared

We don't know how bad it's going to be and personally I am never going to give up working for a better future, no matter how bad it does get.

I agree, but my hopes are low.

I've wasted way too much time in the past trying to fight that ignorance with satellite data and basic physics, and I agree it's a lost cause. But that doesn't mean those that do see the forest for all the (burning) trees should give up too.

Do you think it may yet come to mass murder in order to save the human race?

originally posted by: stinkelbaum
they have gotten very quiet of late.

Droughts and climate change have collapsed civilisations thoughout history for example this study, so climate change has always been a constant, not an exception. so there's no point arguing climate change!

a reply to: TiredofControlFreaks

I agree that it is very important to look at oceans, as they are large scale physical integrators over 70% of the surface.

Your plots are looking at sea surface temperatures.

What is better is looking at ocean heat content over some significant depths as that will get true changes in heat, long term, that really matter and show trends.

Here they are:

www.nodc.noaa.gov...

It's pretty much up since 1970's, much less affected by shorter term variations and ocean cycles which heat the surface.

originally posted by: charlyv

I pop this chart up sometimes in these discussions. Some people say it is cherry-picking data.
However, it really shows only one thing, that impending climate change is eminent. It does not say human or cyclic as a culprit, but you can infer on the time line of the industrial revolution, if you will... or it could be coincidental, or heaped on each other.... This CO2 asymptote has an attitude, and there will be change because of it in itself.

It could be a coincidence or cyclical or human made but what's the norm? There is nothing that says this rise will affect humans or the planet in a bad way. Maybe it is just because we cut forests and replacing them with non-co2-absorbable substances like concrete and such. The recent rise is so small it is almost neglectable, 150 parts per million, really.

CO2 just makes up a minute part of the atmosphere and of the greenhouse gases.
I believe it's around 1,5 - 2% of the greenhouse gases.
Where the burning of FF by humans takes up around 5% of that, so that's roughly 0.1% of the total greenhouse effect is caused by humans.
If i would have to make a bet all my money is on water vapor which is far more likely to cause a significant change.
There is 0 proof that co2 is the main driver behind global temperature change let alone stand climate change.

a reply to: intergalactic fire

There is nothing that says this rise will affect humans or the planet in a bad way.

Drought, floods, fire, storms, habitat loss and destruction of entire ecosystems - not the least of which are in our oceans...increase of diseases, poverty, famine, economic collapse, war, refugees...totalitarianism

Time to wake up from our cocooning dreams and start planning for our new future - before it gets planned for us

... and don't try to go wine tasting over here- you'll be met with grim and rude (-er than usual) vignerons because there is no harvest this year. We had freezing temps last week that ruined all the vines. The losses are enormous.

Well, that's something that happens sometimes- but I was thinking about this subject today and how frustrating I find it when Americans repeatedly turn the question of climate change into some sort of political debate!

For most of the rest of the world, politics doesn't have anything to do with it- this is reality, this is happening now, and we are all just trying to find a way to survive and adapt. While americans are arguing and pointing fingers at each other...!

It just seems strange.

a reply to: Bluesma

It just seems strange.

It's beyond strange - it's like a full blown disorder

originally posted by: Astyanax
a reply to: pl3bscheese

Why? Are you saying I have no evidence to support my contention?

No. I'm saying exactly what I said.

My point is that the situation has moved beyond debate, rendering further discussion irrelevant.

Yes, we’re doomed. It doesn’t turn me on, though. On the contrary, I devoutly hope I am wrong.

Then you are refusing to provide evidence, and double down on your claim. I'll remember that in the future when you ask members for evidence.

a reply to: pl3bscheese

If you want evidence, simply go outside and look around. We have changed the face of this planet. We are changing the chemical balance of our waters and atmosphere.

I do realize no amount of evidence will be enough for some of those in denial.

a reply to: jrod

Actually, there are large number of credible people who disagree with anthropogenically sourced climate change.

Judith Curry, a climatologist is one of them.

As for my opinions - if you don't like them - ignore them. Its what I do to you

Tired of Control Freaks

a reply to: mc_squared

Poor spanish or not.

This is what it comes down to.

When El Nino is prominent, AGW theorists are out in full force. They point to weather conditions as proof of the AGW theory.

When La Nina is prominent, AGW theorists go all quiet except to remind everyone that weather is not climate.

I am calling bull#. If its just weather when its cool, then its just weather when its hot. Neither condition is proof of AGW theory.

Tired of Control Freaks

a reply to: TiredofControlFreaks

No, you bring up a quack whose claims have been debunked over and over again.

I am just astonished and embarrassed that your rants on climate change get more stars than informed posters who bring forth good information about climate change, the actual observations, and man's role in the mess.

a reply to: TiredofControlFreaks

You do not realize La Niña generally correlates with an active North Atlantic hurricane season.

Plenty of AGW speculation when the Gulf and East Coast of the US are getting hit by tropical weather.

Cute how you use the buzz word 'theorists' in your rant.

originally posted by: jrod
a reply to: pl3bscheese

If you want evidence, simply go outside and look around.

LOL you really went there, and yet ... I'm the one in denial, LOL! That's cute buddy.

We have changed the face of this planet. We are changing the chemical balance of our waters and atmosphere.

I do realize no amount of evidence will be enough for some of those in denial.

That's not a realization, that's a belief. I know we're causing quite a bit of change, but I'm not going to buy into the nonsense that we're going extinct or collapsing civilization anytime soon.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Unless, you know... you're just a fool.

a reply to: pl3bscheese

I know we're causing quite a bit of change, but I'm not going to buy into the nonsense that we're going extinct or collapsing civilization anytime soon.

Who has made these claims?

a reply to: Phage

Care to read the thread?

originally posted by: Astyanax

It makes no difference, because it’s too late anyway.

If Earth gets lucky, the impending collapse of human civilization will halt the damage and enable the biosphere to enter a new, largely human-free epoch.

If she is unlucky, well... welcome to the first days of the last days of the planet Venus.

a reply to: pl3bscheese

Oh, I read it.
It's the "anytime soon" part I was wondering about.

a reply to: Phage

Go ask the OP what he means by "it's too late".

People don't say that for things eons away.