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Colo. Sends Non-Vaccinating Parents ILLEGAL Order to “Register Their Child With the State”

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posted on May, 9 2016 @ 12:53 PM
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originally posted by: retiredTxn

As a conservative in favor of limited government, people often ask me what kind of government intervention I do support. The answer is simple: I’m in support of people doing anything they want in a free and democratic society—until their actions infringe on my freedom or anyone else’s. At that point, the state ought to step in, if only to maintain personal liberty. If the state doesn’t intervene in those instances, when minimal intervention would be required to rectify the situation, then the situation risks spiraling out of control to the point where extreme measures become warranted.

Something many people often forget.


Nice one.


edit on 9-5-2016 by Annee because: (no reason given)




posted on May, 9 2016 @ 12:57 PM
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a reply to: UniFinity

I slightly agree with you. Emphasis on slightly.

The one thing I agree with is there are too many vaccinations and wrapping kids in bubble wrap. When I was a kid (I'm not old!) we used to do the stupid things and get cuts, bruises, infections and stuff. Today, I don't remember the last time I saw a dirty child or teenager.

Saying that, I do think certain vaccines should be mandatory.

Also, with medicine, nothing is ever 100%. There are possible side effects to literally everything. There will never be a 100% drug unless it is made per person. I can't see that happening because of resources. It takes more than 1 person to make a drug. Imagine how many people it would take to make tailor made aspirin for everyone on the planet.



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 02:00 PM
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originally posted by: TerryDon79
. . . wrapping kids in bubble wrap. When I was a kid (I'm not old!) we used to do the stupid things and get cuts, bruises, infections and stuff. Today, I don't remember the last time I saw a dirty child or teenager.


Oh Gawd!, so true.

I'm raising a now 8 year old boy. The other day at the park he's swinging high and jumping off the swings. He did a face plant. Comes over to me, asks me if he has a black eye. I say No, go play. The other moms tried to baby him, asked me if I wanted to give him a pain pill, told me I should take him to the doctor. UGH! About 15 minutes after I sent him to play, I went and checked on him inconspicuously. He had a slight bruise, but he'll be fine.

He also has a throat cough, from sinus drainage - - allergy possibly. We just give him a spoonful of honey to coat the throat. Doctors suggest kids will outgrow most allergies. I counter medicate him and/or put him under a mister if he's congested. And keep an eye on him in case he does need to get checked by a doctor.

And we do not have him bathe every day either. We have him wash his hands, and I try to remember to wash his feet before bed. I'm old school in building up resistance.
edit on 9-5-2016 by Annee because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 02:47 PM
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a reply to: TerryDon79

ha ha, you made me slightly laugh. Emphasis on slightly : )

thanks for that, laugh is still a laugh, hah.

But otherwise, good points.
Also I agree, some should be probably mandatory, but really only most critical ones.
And maybe it should depend on the location and population, everywhere are different cases and diseases due to different environment etc...

About the last point.
that is exactly, why there should be more research into the cause and effects and these things should not be mandatory until they can sort out about what effects does chemical cocktail from all different vaccination really has or has not.

maybe they should rather focus on the ones who got sick and try to get results the other way around.
They have effect, what caused it?

research that in depth, Identify all possible causes and maybe correlate them with others similarly unfortunate kids, etc,..
and than when they have something.
test other kids for that before injection.
if there really is low % of cases as some of them say, than this seems for example a bit more realistical and cheap.

But I am sure there are many other ways, probably better ways,
than a pothead like me can think in five minutes : )

from half the money it goes for wars, if it went into science focused for the good of all the people and as it should be any way, than these things would already be resolved and we would not have this problems or if they would occur they should at least do something about it.

not hid it as it seems to be the case.
that is the most important point for me.

they should discuss this cases openly through out all medical fields and globally, they have internet and technology to share information without effort.

Why is this a secret?
Some kids get sick.
They should just admit it and be open about it!

But then, they would lose a lot of profits...

edit on 1462824327505May055053116 by UniFinity because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 03:02 PM
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a reply to: riley


That really is a disgusting assertion.. not to mention you don't actually have proof. Just call them liars.. and feel safe in the knowledge that they won't be able to defend their own innocence because they are not even allowed to show their vaccine injured children in a real court room.


It is not a disgusting assertion, it is disgusting when it happens. Not every parent who thinks that a vaccination is responsible for their children's condition are liars; in fact, most are sincere. Unfortunately, there is a lot of Neo-Luddite propaganda out there, and in seeking to make sense of the random hand the universe dealt them, they are prepared to accept faulty reasoning in order to settle on a cause. Post hoc ergo propter hoc is a common fallacy. As for not being able to defend their own innocence, they are the prosecution!


Bibles. Torches. Pitch forks. Syringes.


I'm sensing some anger here.



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 05:10 PM
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originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: tnhiker

The government should have no right, and technically doesn't, to force anybody to put anything in their bodies or their children's body if they do not wish it.


The government should have Every Right to prevent an epidemic.


Not when it violates parents or individual rights.

Grr posted before I finished.

Don't get me wrong, if anybody wants to vaccinate, that's fine, if anybody wants to not vaccinate, that's fine. If my kid is vaccinated, I don't really care if yours is or isn't, not my business. I have read multiple reports on both pro and con. One big thing is numbers that are used. People see big percentages and quit reading, not realizing that large percent is a very small number.

The only sticking point is children with immuno compromised systems. Does somebodies non vaccinated child put them at risk? Only if they are sick too, in which case the parents fail for letting their child out of the house. Which is another point I am in favor of, personal accountability. Something the majority of sheep in this country don't understand.
edit on 9-5-2016 by tnhiker because: posted before done



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 07:22 PM
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originally posted by: tnhiker

. . . if anybody wants to vaccinate, that's fine, if anybody wants to not vaccinate, that's fine.


Wrong, read what RetiredTxn posted.



As a conservative in favor of limited government, people often ask me what kind of government intervention I do support. The answer is simple: I’m in support of people doing anything they want in a free and democratic society—until their actions infringe on my freedom or anyone else’s. At that point, the state ought to step in, if only to maintain personal liberty. If the state doesn’t intervene in those instances, when minimal intervention would be required to rectify the situation, then the situation risks spiraling out of control to the point where extreme measures become warranted.



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 08:31 PM
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originally posted by: DJW001

Bibles. Torches. Pitch forks. Syringes.


I'm sensing some anger here.


Observation that some people are quite willing to repeat history and act like the oppressors of the past.



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 08:36 PM
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originally posted by: riley

originally posted by: DJW001

Bibles. Torches. Pitch forks. Syringes.


I'm sensing some anger here.


Observation that some people are quite willing to repeat history and act like the oppressors of the past.


I have just noticed something about all of your replies in this thread. You cherry pick what to reply to and completely ignore the rest. The post I'm replying to is a great example. Out of all that was written you replied to a single sentence and didn't address anything of relevance.

If you have an argument, argue it. Don't just ignore things to fit to your agenda. That makes you look intellectually dishonest.



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 09:01 PM
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a reply to: TerryDon79

You want to talk to me about relevance? Really?

The government actually LIED to citizens in order to get their children registered as being unvaccinated.

You and others want to make this all about evils "antivaxxers" yet ignore the immorality and more importantly the illegality of what was done. Instead using "for the greater good" arguments downplaying it.

Now you have gone to the extremes of actually publicly documenting the manner in which I post which is frankly very creepy.

My observation about the way you guys have been posting? You seem to come up with the same arguments. You all speak like the death of one mother's baby is morally justified if others get their children vaccinated.

Like death from disease is more important than death from medical assault. The gun or the knife.

Many of the diseases vaccinated against to not even put people at risk. Apparently small children are expected to have over 20 vaccines now. I would want my kid to have a handful.. there is no way however I would risk that many with a medical science that has been deemed "unavoidably unsafe" and is pushed onto people to such extremes that government officials are actually lying to parent's about what their legal obligations are.



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 09:16 PM
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a reply to: riley

Guess I touched a nerve. Wow!

I still stand by sacrificing the few to save the many. You can stay with sacrificing the many to have an individual saved if you want.

The "your rights stop where mine begin"? What about the rights of the many over the few? Or is the individual more important?

And the anti vax thing is basically doom porn anyway. "What if we get sick?" "I saw someone on YouTube saying this that and something else!" Kind of sounds like 99% of scaremongers out there and very rarely backed up by anything other than YouTube vids or click bait.



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 09:19 PM
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originally posted by: TerryDon79
a reply to: riley

Guess I touched a nerve. Wow!

I still stand by sacrificing the few to save the many.


Have to.

The other way around makes no sense.



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 09:31 PM
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originally posted by: TerryDon79
a reply to: riley

Guess I touched a nerve. Wow!


..and you claim to be shocked despite intentionally setting out to hit a "nerve". When you personally attack people that is what happens.


I still stand by sacrificing the few to save the many. You can stay with sacrificing the many to have an individual saved if you want.


My child not being injected with heb b or Garsasil would not be sacrificing the many. You know this but that does not fit with the fear mongering and the "antivaxxers are going to kill us all!" rhetoric. Fear is a powerful way to influence the public.

So is telling them the truth.

The ONLY way you would be able to get all parents to vaccinate their babies with the 20+ vaccines which are not needed would be to do so by gun point like what has happened in third world nations. Sorry but I don't want to live in that kind of regime.


The "your rights stop where mine begin"? What about the rights of the many over the few? Or is the individual more important?


This has already been answered many times over. If you were arguing for vaccines for something as serious as the black plague then I honestly think that most parents, even those who are wary of vaccines would get that vaccine.

But again some of the vaccines are not life saving, not necessary and have no overall benefit for community health aside from making money like hep b and gardasil as mentioned before.


And the anti vax thing is basically doom porn anyway. "What if we get sick?" "I saw someone on YouTube saying this that and something else!" Kind of sounds like 99% of scaremongers out there and very rarely backed up by anything other than YouTube vids or click bait.


Doom porn?

The whole pro-vax narrative is designed to scare the crap out of people so they'll give up their medical liberties.



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 09:36 PM
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a reply to: riley

I'm not going to address everything because, well, I just can't be bothered.

There's a tiny bit of proof that some vaccines can have some adverse effects. I don't disagree with that. What I disagree with is those anti vaxxers that will not vaccinate for anything.

So how about people who are anti vax start providing real proof instead of the normal rubbish that's been debunked a hundred times over? Maybe some of us would listen.



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 09:52 PM
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a reply to: TerryDon79

There are thousands of parents who claim their babies have had adverse side effects.. yet they are not able to speak about them and have had the opportunity to prove it in a normal court room taken away from them.

Until they are allowed to do that the real percentage of vaccine injuries will not be known. As it stands adverse reactions often go unreported.

You talk about things being debunked.. and what I do and not respond to but you again ignored the issue of things like hep b and Gradasil being forced on people even though these vaccines are not needed and don't protect the wider community.

Can't be bothered? There is no argument to be had for overall public health in regards to these specific vaccines but given the "greater good" is your main argument I am not surprised you've chosen not to address them.



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 10:01 PM
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originally posted by: riley
a reply to: TerryDon79

There are thousands of parents who claim their babies have had adverse side effects.. yet they are not able to speak about them and have had the opportunity to prove it in a normal court room taken away from them.
I claim I'm a unicorn. Does that make it real? Also, if they can't talk about it, where did you hear it from?


Until they are allowed to do that the real percentage of vaccine injuries will not be known. As it stands adverse reactions often go unreported.
And you know they go unreported because someone said so? How do they know it goes unreported if it's not reported? See the problem?


You talk about things being debunked.. and what I do and not respond to but you again ignored the issue of things like hep b and Gradasil being forced on people even though these vaccines are not needed and don't protect the wider community.
I'm not sure where you're getting our information, but no one has been forced to do anything, yet. Or do you have more reports that haven't been reported?


Can't be bothered? There is no argument to be had for overall public health in regards to these specific vaccines but given the "greater good" is your main argument I am not surprised you've chosen not to address them.
Of course my argument is for the greater good. If you think otherwise that means you're happy with the possibility of a massive human wipe out. 7.4 billion people in the world. If 0.4 billion have to die to save the 7 billion, I won't have a problem with that. Even if I'm a part of the 0.4 billion. You're arguing to wipe out the 7 billion to give rights to not vaccinate to the 0.4 billion.



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 10:12 PM
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a reply to: TerryDon79

So genital warts or hep b could lead to the deaths of over 7 billion people?

Yeah okay. You keep with the dooms day scary stuff.. it still won't make those vaccines necessary for individual health or public health.



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 10:12 PM
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What are some of the myths – and facts – about vaccination? March 2016


Myth 3: The combined vaccine against diphtheria, tetanus and pertussis (whooping cough) and the vaccine against poliomyelitis cause sudden infant death syndrome.

FALSE
Fact 3: There is no causal link between the administering of the vaccines and sudden infant death, however, these vaccines are administered at a time when babies can suffer sudden infant death syndrome (SIDS). In other words, the SIDS deaths are co-incidental to vaccination and would have occurred even if no vaccinations had been given. It is important to remember that these four diseases are life-threatening and babies who are not vaccinated against them are at serious risk of death or serious disability. www.who.int...



Myth 10: Vaccines cause autism

FALSE
Fact 10: The 1998 study which raised concerns about a possible link between measles-mumps-rubella (MMR) vaccine and autism was later found to be seriously flawed, and the paper has been retracted by the journal that published it. Unfortunately, its publication set off a panic that led to dropping immunization rates, and subsequent outbreaks of these diseases. There is no evidence of a link between MMR vaccine and autism or autistic disorders. www.who.int...


Regressive autism has been blamed on vaccinations because of the coincidence in age/timing of when vaccines are given.


Regressive autism occurs when a child appears to develop typically but then starts to lose speech and social skills, typically between the ages of 15 and 30 months, and is subsequently diagnosed with autism. en.wikipedia.org...



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 10:16 PM
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originally posted by: riley
a reply to: TerryDon79

So genital warts or hep b could lead to the deaths of over 7 billion people?

Yeah okay. You keep with the dooms day scary stuff.. it still won't make those vaccines necessary for individual health or public health.


Again with the cherry picking of one part of the whole post.

Why don't you try addressing the rest of it?



posted on May, 9 2016 @ 10:20 PM
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a reply to: Annee

I neither trust the WHO or the CDC as there have been massive corporate conflicts of interests.
Oh and vaccine programs at gun point. Oh and oral polio vaccine causing side effects which they knew would happen but went ahead with anyway. Oh and illegal trials.

I also do not find Wikipedia credible in ANY way.

This just goes round and round. You keep posting "proof" from the same organizations and governments that are currently been accused of lying, corruption and of being puppets for pharma.

They have also lost their credibility and quite frankly it is their own fault for allowing pharma to dictate policies.
edit on 9-5-2016 by riley because: (no reason given)



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