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California PC Police Dishonor "The Duke"

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posted on May, 3 2016 @ 12:26 PM
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a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

I'll reply, but kindly tread carefully considering the subject.

My Mother passed away last year. She was 86 years old and a wonderful person. She didn't have a mean bone in her body and liked everyone for who they were. Those she didn't like, were criminals and down right evil people and no one would argue that.

At 86 years old, she grew up in a different time. My Brother and I would roll our eyes every time she did this one thing that I'm sure a lot of people here have seen before. She called Brazil nuts "n-word" toes. That was how she was brought up, raised and the terms used. It didn't make her racist...just the product of a different time.

That is my point. You can't judge a person from one time based upon the rules of another time.




posted on May, 3 2016 @ 12:27 PM
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originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: Annee

I'm a product of that time and I knew better.



Oh? You're 109 years old? That's amazing!!!

Oh, you're not even close to 109? THEN YOU'RE FULL OF IT AND NOT AT ALL A PRODUCT OF THE SAME TIME AS JOHN WAYNE.


NO, but I did grow up with him as I am 70.

Did think he was closer to my age.

But, my mom knew better then to make racist comments - - and made sure we didn't.

She was not a Public Figure Legend - - - that people would hang on her every word.


I'm not buying it. 40 years is more than a generation's worth of difference. You'd have been 25 when Wayne made the comment, he was 64. You grew up after the Civil Rights Era, Wayne was already a middle aged man when it started. That's a world of difference. John Wayne made the comments to Playboy in 1971... only a scant 3 years after the first interracial kiss on American TV from a Star Trek featuring Kirk kissing Uhura. That same year, All in the Family debuted as a family comedy which dropped n-bombs to studio audience laughter and applause. the POTUS of the time was Nixon and from the Nixon tapes, Wayne's comments were tame compared to Tricky Dick's comments on blacks, brains, and welfare. LBJ, the civil rights hero, dropped n-bombs like the word "the." When I was growing up in the 80s quite a fair bit of what is today viewed as horribly racist was pretty damn commonplace. It wasn't until the Rodney King trial and then the OJ trial that this became a nation-wide point of attention.

When my grandmother was in her twilight years, the care home she was in was visited every weekend by a black family from a local church. They would show up to read to the elders, play board games with them, or just sit and talk with them. They showed up one day when I was there and my Grammy happily (and loudly) stated "Oh, the colored people are here, everyone!" The whole family gave my Grammy big hugs and recognized her "racist statement" wasn't racist in the least, it was generational differences. What was acceptable or even what was introspective 45 years ago may well be considered racist today... but back then, not so much.
edit on 3-5-2016 by burdman30ott6 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 3 2016 @ 12:29 PM
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Once again I'm going to correct the inaccuracies posted by certain persons here.

People HIGH UP IN THE US GOVERNMENT wanted John Wayne to remain stateside making films and appearances to boost morale domestically and on the front lines.

Wayne wanted to serve, but acquiesced to the government's request that he remain a civilian.

As I have repeatedly pointed out, he wanted to enlist and regretted that he did not the rest of his life.

He respected the government's wishes, as good citizens of the time did.



posted on May, 3 2016 @ 12:29 PM
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a reply to: burdman30ott6

Have at it.

Go for whatever perspective you want.

The state rejected it.



posted on May, 3 2016 @ 12:31 PM
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a reply to: Annee

Well that certainly adds a lot to a productive discussion...



posted on May, 3 2016 @ 12:38 PM
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originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

I'll reply, but kindly tread carefully considering the subject.

My Mother passed away last year. She was 86 years old and a wonderful person. She didn't have a mean bone in her body and liked everyone for who they were. Those she didn't like, were criminals and down right evil people and no one would argue that.

At 86 years old, she grew up in a different time. My Brother and I would roll our eyes every time she did this one thing that I'm sure a lot of people here have seen before. She called Brazil nuts "n-word" toes. That was how she was brought up, raised and the terms used. It didn't make her racist...just the product of a different time.

That is my point. You can't judge a person from one time based upon the rules of another time.

The thing is, your mom's statements weren't meant to disparage an entire class of people.

A persons actions and words can do damage that won't be so easily healed by the passage of time. Hitler has been dead for what, 70 years, but his actions and legacy will live on for many, many more generations to come. Do we say, "well, he's been dead 70 years so lets put it all behind us, celebrate his accomplishments and forget the horrible atrocities he was guilty of?"

John Wayne's words aren't being twisted. Right or wrong, he said what he did, and I can't fault members of the community for not wanting to afford an honor to a man who showed such disrespect to them. That would be like asking jewish people to go along with a Hitler day.

It's time to move on.



posted on May, 3 2016 @ 12:42 PM
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Good job, invoking Hitler.

This place amazes me.

John Wayne = Adolf Hitler?

Please.



posted on May, 3 2016 @ 12:43 PM
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a reply to: ReprobateRaccoon

Oh sweet baby Jesus, did you seriously just compare a throw away comment regarding blacks, education, and responsibility with Adolph Hitler?

There is such a vapid black hole where perspective should be in that ideology that it boggles my mind. Even bringing Hitler's name into this discussion is like burning your goddamned house down because you saw a garden spider in the kitchen.



(post by BootsOnNecks removed for a serious terms and conditions violation)

posted on May, 3 2016 @ 02:00 PM
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originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
That is my point. You can't judge a person from one time based upon the rules of another time.


If the person grew up in an era where racism was much more prevalent and institutionalized and they espouse those ideals then they are in fact a racist. If everyone just went with the flow and did not question this type of behavior Jim Crow would still be kosher.



posted on May, 3 2016 @ 02:02 PM
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a reply to: Restricted
Can you guys give me one reason why John Wayne should be honored by people he spoke disparagingly about? His racist comments were unacceptable, both in 1971 and by modern standards. If you want to honor his bad acting that's certainly your prerogative, but don't expect the government to endorse it on behalf of the entire population.



posted on May, 3 2016 @ 02:05 PM
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originally posted by: BootsOnNecks
a reply to: ReprobateRaccoon

[snipped]

Says one who probably didn't lose any close relatives due to him.

Some people here amaze me. I'm done at ATS
edit on 5.3.2016 by Kandinsky because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 3 2016 @ 02:25 PM
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originally posted by: ReprobateRaccoon
a reply to: Restricted
Can you guys give me one reason why John Wayne should be honored by people he spoke disparagingly about? His racist comments were unacceptable, both in 1971 and by modern standards. If you want to honor his bad acting that's certainly your prerogative, but don't expect the government to endorse it on behalf of the entire population.


Go ahead and be a crybaby about history.

You're the perfect human being, aren't you?

AREN'T YOU?

No, thought not.



posted on May, 3 2016 @ 03:09 PM
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a reply to: ReprobateRaccoon

ATS isnt your safe space, its a discussion forum.



posted on May, 5 2016 @ 07:17 AM
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originally posted by: Restricted

originally posted by: ReprobateRaccoon
a reply to: Restricted
Can you guys give me one reason why John Wayne should be honored by people he spoke disparagingly about? His racist comments were unacceptable, both in 1971 and by modern standards. If you want to honor his bad acting that's certainly your prerogative, but don't expect the government to endorse it on behalf of the entire population.


Go ahead and be a crybaby about history.

You're the perfect human being, aren't you?

AREN'T YOU?

No, thought not.

I never professed to be a perfect human being. I do, however, profess to be a generally hospitable and civil poster. I accept that some wont agree with what I say, but the outright hostility of your responses is reprehensible.



posted on May, 5 2016 @ 08:48 AM
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a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Then following that logic, a gay person from today moved in to the distant past was a degenerate the should be put to death. It works both ways. When times change, people change and what is acceptable or forbidden changes. You can't judge those from one time to those of another.

Example: Today, you decide to go to a rally carrying a sign and blocking entry into a building. Twenty years from now, there is a law that would send you to jail for five years. So twenty years from now are we supposed to put you in prison? Or another one...in twenty years alcohol is outlawed. Do we then look at everyone who drank alcohol as a bad person? Are we supposed to look down upon you for doing then, what is illegal or wrong now? I say no.
edit on 5/5/2016 by WeAreAWAKE because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 5 2016 @ 08:53 AM
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originally posted by: ReprobateRaccoon
a reply to: Restricted
Can you guys give me one reason why John Wayne should be honored by people he spoke disparagingly about? His racist comments were unacceptable, both in 1971 and by modern standards. If you want to honor his bad acting that's certainly your prerogative, but don't expect the government to endorse it on behalf of the entire population.

Absolutely! Our "founding fathers" often owned slaves because at the time, it was permitted and not viewed as any different than owning a cow. They are still to be praised for much of what they have done and not demonized for doing something that most people did or approved of. Things that were totally legal and considered morally acceptable.

You can't tell a person what their limits are and what is permissible and then come back later and be pissed off at them for doing what was considered fine by everyone at that time.

This is actually a pretty simple idea. You tell your child it is bad to skip school but OK to smoke pot. They smoke pot. Then ten years later you change your opinion and give them crap or demonize them for smoking pot? How wrong is THAT?



posted on May, 5 2016 @ 08:55 AM
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One more quick example...and probably the easiest to understand. If you did something that was totally legal at the time, but ten years later it was outlawed, you can not be prosecuted for a crime because it wasn't a crime when you did it.



posted on May, 5 2016 @ 09:34 AM
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originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
Then following that logic, a gay person from today moved in to the distant past was a degenerate the should be put to death.


Homosexuality in ancient times was not a death sentence in many cultures. That is a bad example.



posted on May, 5 2016 @ 09:40 AM
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a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Yeah...you are probably right. But I was in a rush
But you get the idea.



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