Yiddish may be a TURKISH dialect

I found something very interesting.

DNA study suggests it was invented by Jews as they traded on the Silk Road.

- Yiddish was thought to have originally been an old German dialect
- A new genetic study, however, has pinpointed origin of Yiddish speakers
- Suggests it was invented by Iranian and Ashkenazic Jews on the Silk Road

It may have been spoken for 1,000 years, but the origins of Yiddish – the language of Ashkenazic Jews – has been a bone of contention between linguists for years.

Now researchers say the DNA of Yiddish speakers may have originated from four ancient villages in north-eastern Turkey.

And they believe the Yiddish language was invented by Iranian and Ashkenazic Jews as they traded on the Silk Road, challenging the popular idea it is an old German dialect.

Scientists at the Universities of Sheffield and Tel Aviv used a tool dubbed the Geographic Population Structure (GPS) to convert DNA data into ancestral coordinates.

This enabled them to identify the ancient villages - Iskenaz, Eskenaz, Ashanaz, and Ashkuz – close to the crossroads of the Silk Roads, which were a historically important international trade route between China and the Mediterranean.

link

JewFaq

I always wondered why they dont look like the original jews?

originally posted by: Azeban
I found something very interesting.

DNA study suggests it was invented by Jews as they traded on the Silk Road.

- Yiddish was thought to have originally been an old German dialect
- A new genetic study, however, has pinpointed origin of Yiddish speakers
- Suggests it was invented by Iranian and Ashkenazic Jews on the Silk Road

It may have been spoken for 1,000 years, but the origins of Yiddish – the language of Ashkenazic Jews – has been a bone of contention between linguists for years.

Now researchers say the DNA of Yiddish speakers may have originated from four ancient villages in north-eastern Turkey.

And they believe the Yiddish language was invented by Iranian and Ashkenazic Jews as they traded on the Silk Road, challenging the popular idea it is an old German dialect.

Scientists at the Universities of Sheffield and Tel Aviv used a tool dubbed the Geographic Population Structure (GPS) to convert DNA data into ancestral coordinates.

This enabled them to identify the ancient villages - Iskenaz, Eskenaz, Ashanaz, and Ashkuz – close to the crossroads of the Silk Roads, which were a historically important international trade route between China and the Mediterranean.

link

JewFaq

I always wondered why they dont look like the original jews?

Say what you like...but Yiddish sounds like a German dialect, so you'd have to pull Old German into the equation as well

a reply to: JohnnyCanuck

I believe Yi# is an own language to understand the simplest words of the trading posts for bartering. Almost like very bad english with an own dialect..

a reply to: Azeban
I don't think the Daily Mail headline is justified by the research they're quoting.
The proposal being put forward by the researcher is that Yiddish originated as a Slavic language which kept the Slavic grammar structure while replacing Slavic words with words drawn from other languages, mainly German.
Though Turkish is supposed to have supplied a few words as well, the main Turkish connection in the theory is that the language was being used by merchants passing through what is now Turkish territory on their way eastwards. That is not the same thing as being "a Turkish language". "Slavic language" would have been a more accurate headline for the theory.

a reply to: DISRAELI

Not sure what your point is? It clearly says, the jews are turkeys

originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: Azeban
I don't think the Daily Mail headline is justified by the research they're quoting.
The proposal being put forward by the researcher is that Yiddish originated as a Slavic language which kept the Slavic grammar structure while replacing Slavic words with words drawn from other languages, mainly German.
Though Turkish is supposed to have supplied a few words as well, the main Turkish connection in the theory is that the language was being used by merchants passing through what is now Turkish territory on their way eastwards. That is not the same thing as being "a Turkish language". "Slavic language" would have been a more accurate headline for the theory.

I don't speak any Slavic language, but I have some knowledge of German and I don't pick up any Slavic vibe from Yiddish. It may be a patois...but it be based in German, certainly not Turkish.

a reply to: JohnnyCanuck
I don't know Yiddish at all. I was only trying to decipher the article being linked, and as far as I can see the Slavic element was supposed to be the grammatical structure rather than the vocabulary.

originally posted by: Azeban
Not sure what your point is? It clearly says, the jews are turkeys

My point is that it doesn't "clearly" say anything of the kind.

a) Only the headline says "Turkish", the research they're citing has a different angle.
b) The article is not talking about all Jews, only those speaking Yiddish.
c) Even the article is not saying that those Jews ARE Turkish. It is only suggesting that they speak a Turkish-derived language.
If that was enough to make them "Turkish", then the fact that most American Jews speak English would be enough to prove them Anglo-Saxon, wouldn't it?
You need to understand that genetic origins and inherited language are two different things, and you can't use one to prove the other.

a reply to: DISRAELI

But it does say the Jews are turkeys, it shows in the DNA, the language confirms, the jews are turkeys.

a reply to: Azeban
In the first place, let me repeat the second point I made above;
The article does not say ALL Jews. It is talking about some of those speaking Yiddish.
There is no rational ground for jumping from "some Jews" to "The Jews".

I take it that English is not your first language.
In standard English, "Turkey" is the country or the bird.
The people are Turks or Turkish.

a reply to: Azeban
Let me draw your attention to another point, which you and the Daily Mail have not noticed.

This DNA is supposedly traced back to an area which is NOW part of Turkey.
But Yiddish is supposed to have developed in this area much earlier, at a time WHEN THE TURKS WERE NOT THERE.
The Turkish ethnic group arrived in that region originally with the Seljuks.
If the DNA evidence showed anything, it would show a connection with those who occupied those regions before the Turks turned up.

But I see from your last post that you are not interested in rational scientific discussion.
What you have is an emotional commitment to believing bad things about Jews and Turks in combination (would your own ethnic group be Arabic?).
So there is no point in pursuing rational discussion beyond this point. It will get nowhere.

Ashkenazi jews to be exact

a reply to: DISRAELI

If you have problem concentrating on the article, i believe they have concentration camps in turkey.

DailyMail is a tabloid.

The tabloid writer has a poor understanding of the material.

Yiddish (developed in the 9th century) is not an extremely ancient language, and any DNA relating them to the people of Turkey would be far more ancient (10,000 BC or earlier) than the language is.

a reply to: Byrd

a reply to: Byrd

Greetings Byrd!

With all due respect, although the study draws controversial conclusions, the research did not originate with the DailyMail.

Localizing Ashkenazic Jews to primeval villages in the ancient Iranian lands of Ashkenaz (Genome Biology and Evolution, Oxford Journal)

DNA sat nav Uncovers Ancient Ashkenaz (Phys.org)

Scientists Reveal Jewish History's Forgotten Turkish Roots (Independent.com)

Abstract

The Yiddish language is over one thousand years old and incorporates German, Slavic, and Hebrew elements. The prevalent view claims Yiddish has a German origin, whereas the opposing view posits a Slavic origin with strong Iranian and weak Turkic substrata. One of the major difficulties in deciding between these hypotheses is the unknown geographical origin of Yiddish speaking Ashkenazic Jews (AJs). An analysis of 393 Ashkenazic, Iranian, and mountain Jews and over 600 non-Jewish genomes demonstrated that Greeks, Romans, Iranians, and Turks exhibit the highest genetic similarity with AJs. The Geographic Population Structure (GPS) analysis localized most AJs along major primeval trade routes in northeastern Turkey adjacent to primeval villages with names that may be derived from “Ashkenaz.” Iranian and mountain Jews were localized along trade routes on the Turkey’s eastern border. Loss of maternal haplogroups was evident in non-Yiddish speaking AJs. Our results suggest that AJs originated from a Slavo-Iranian confederation, which the Jews call “Ashkenazic” (i.e., “Scythian”), though these Jews probably spoke Persian and/or Ossete. This is compatible with linguistic evidence suggesting that Yiddish is a Slavic language created by Irano-Turko-Slavic Jewish merchants along the Silk Roads as a cryptic trade language, spoken only by its originators to gain an advantage in trade. Later, in the 9th century, Yiddish underwent relexification by adopting a new vocabulary that consists of a minority of German and Hebrew and a majority of newly coined Germanoid and Hebroid elements that replaced most of the original Eastern Slavic and Sorbian vocabularies, while keeping the original grammars intact.

Interesting that in this case the Slavic grammar was kept and the words changed but in the case Ladino the Hebrew grammar was kept and the vocabulary substituted for Spanish.

Yey ... the troll got banned .