It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

I just had my life threatened debating ideas within Islam!

page: 8
31
<< 5  6  7    9  10 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Apr, 19 2016 @ 07:16 PM
link   
a reply to: TechniXcality

Aww, he's really peaceful, and just misunderstood, honest! /sarcasm


Seriously, that's typical for a lot of such debates. Seen similar threats in comments various places online, too. That sort of behavior, seen all too often, is a better picture of the actual beliefs of that group than any claims to the contrary. In this case, Islam is more a political ideology than a religion.




posted on Apr, 19 2016 @ 08:07 PM
link   

originally posted by: MystikMushroom
If one seeks out other cultures and finds "radicals" to "debate" with -- one really isn't debating, but rather intentionally looking for explosive situations in order to confirm their own biases and prove themselves right. "





posted on Apr, 19 2016 @ 08:20 PM
link   
I don't mean to be an ass but is there anything here that can confirm the OP?



posted on Apr, 19 2016 @ 08:48 PM
link   
a reply to: intrepid
a reply to: Hazardous1408


Yes,this has been questioned twice, time to put an end to this ridiculousness, the funny part is that I bring membership here to ATS from these skype groups, here is a private conversation I had with a friend of mine regarding last night (just after it happened) with time stamps.



Here is screen shot of me getting off the call at 11:33pm in a group called "mass skype debates" expressing that" I got to cool off" (all of this happened on cam, and it wasn't recorded via a recording) I could even have someone come confirm this, (who heard it on call) but I believe I've provided more than enough proof, I have been a member here for years and I am quite offended that- once a new member called me a liar, and now a mod is questioning the veracity of my claims.



And furthermore if any of you would like to participate at some point let me know via private messaging and we can work that out, enough with calling me a liar, I am straight shooter, if I tell you that's how it happened then that's how it happened.

Drops mic
edit on 19-4-2016 by TechniXcality because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 19 2016 @ 09:07 PM
link   
For those saying the conversation was potentially made up, I can tell you that I was there and did witness the conversation. I will also say that the Aussie has said multiple times that he is Muslim in other calls.



posted on Apr, 19 2016 @ 09:40 PM
link   

originally posted by: TechniXcality
a reply to: intrepid
a reply to: Hazardous1408


No this has been questioned twice, the funny part is that I bring membership here to ATS from these skype groups, here is a private conversation I had with a friend of mine regarding last night (just after it happened) with time stamps.



Here is screen shot of me getting off the call at 11:33pm in a group called "mass skype debates" expressing that" I got to cool off" (all of this happened on cam, and it wasn't recorded via a recording) I could even have someone come confirm this, (who heard it on call) but I believe I've provided more than enough proof, I have been a member here for years and I am quite offended that- once a new member called me a liar, and now a mod is questioning the veracity of my claims.



And furthermore if any of you would like to participate at some point let me know via private messaging and we can work that out, enough with calling me a liar, I am straight shooter, if I tell you that's how it happened then that's how it happened.

Drops mic




You dont need to be lying for the premiss of your post to be ridiculous...


People act like tough guys while hiding behind their keyboard, daily. Unfortunately, it appears to be a human condition, not a Muslim specific one.



posted on Apr, 19 2016 @ 10:08 PM
link   

originally posted by: Hazardous1408
Muhammad never married a child...
You lied...

That's a lie propogated by Persian Hadith at a time when they Hated Arabs...
250 years after Muhammad passed away...

Such important information would have been recorded instantly.


Secondly I don't believe you were on Skype with anyone...
I think you lied twice.



Also, since i disproved your accusations of lying (which i fully expect them to be removed) let me get to the part about Muhammad's child bride, even if he didn't take a nine year old child as a bride, it is widely believed throughout Islam that he did, therefor there is a precedent set for this type of behavior, will you also deny this? It is not the Muhammad the man that is a problem, but Muhammad the legend- which leads to a doctrine of extremism and abhorrent acts.



posted on Apr, 19 2016 @ 10:49 PM
link   
Respect for Islam ? When Islamic States like Saudi Arabia donate some of their money to charity like helping tsunami victims or famine victims in Africa I will begin to change my mind about Islam being a Religion of War and of Worship of Satan.
edit on 19-4-2016 by mazzroth because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 19 2016 @ 11:37 PM
link   
a reply to: TechniXcality



...let me get to the part about Muhammad's child bride, even if he didn't take a nine year old child as a bride, it is widely believed throughout Islam that he did, therefor there is a precedent set for this type of behavior, will you also deny this? It is not the Muhammad the man that is a problem, but Muhammad the legend- which leads to a doctrine of extremism and abhorrent acts.


What an ignorant, narrow-minded, and distorted talking point, especially this part:



it is widely believed throughout Islam that he did


Q: How many Christians actually try to follow the life of Christ to a tee in the same context you suggest? What makes you so sure that all Muslims try to emulate the life of Mohammed to the tee as you seem to suggest despite the fact you acknowledge above it may not even be true that he had a child bride?

Btw, since the theme of *Child Marriages* seems to play a central role in this thread, I'm contemplating creating a thread about the topic because I feel it is something that should be discussed in order for some people to become more aware of this extremely disgusting act that often goes unnoticed throughout the world. It does not get the attention it deserves. If I do, I will link your thread and some of your very own comments relating to the subject to that thread. Here is a heads up:

"America’s Child-Marriage Problem"

www.nytimes.com...


IN the United States today, thousands of children under 18 have recently taken marital vows — mostly girls married to adult men, often with approval from local judges. How is this possible? The minimum marriage age in most states is 18, but every state allows exceptions under which children under age 18 can wed. The first common exception is for children marrying with “parental consent.” Most states allow children age 16 or 17 to marry if their parents sign the marriage license application.


"Children Get Married In The U.S., Too: #15Girls"

www.npr.org...


One of the striking aspects of Tahirih's further research, including a 2011 study on forced marriage in the U.S., is that there is no single profile of the girls and women involved. They came from families of Muslim, Christian, Hindu, Buddhist and other faiths, from immigrant families from many countries and from non-immigrant communities, too.


"There Are More Child Marriages Happening in 2015 Than You Think: A Q&A"

www.hrw.org...


Last week, Spain raised its minimum age for marriage from 14 to 16, and also upped the age for consent from 13 to 16. The BBC said last Thursday that, while only 365 marriages involving people under the age of 16 have occurred in Spain since 2000, there were 2,678 such marriages in the ‘90s and 12,867 in the ‘80s. All I could think when I read those numbers was WHAT. THE. F---. Spain is the 31st richestcountry in the world, with an estimated GDP of $33 billion in 2014. I was so surprised to learn that a developed country like Spain had only just begun to take steps to protect its girls from forced marriage before the age of 16.


What I find appalling is you seem to be more upset over being threatened online than the fact children are being married off across the globe. The impression I got from reading your OP was this:

Here is two grown ass men allowing their emotions to be manipulated like children to the point one of them has the need to whine about it on another site and at the same time feels the need to state he is grateful there is a babysitter (moderator) here to keep others from emotionally manipulating him again.

Book a vacation, bruh...








edit on 19-4-2016 by Involutionist because: Grammar and punctuation SUCKS!



posted on Apr, 19 2016 @ 11:42 PM
link   
some would argue religion is man made...

i would concur.

all of it is tripe to divde man.
Islam is no different than the rest of the nonsense.
every religion has extremists.
evry religion terrorizes, every religion manipulate its constituents.

end religion then we can move forward. otherwise were trapped in a bubble, taking big strides; ultimately end up where we were, watching progress pass us by.

i would have thought religious unknowns would have been ironed out thousands of years ago, you know, when it was the right time to set records straight, with empirical evidence and all. not in 2016, who the fork is going to know jack shet about muhammad or his pedo tendencies. its all speculative.
all of it, asking questions, the answers
, the emotions... all over speculations.



posted on Apr, 19 2016 @ 11:53 PM
link   
a reply to: TechniXcality

Firstly, my sincere apologies for believing you lied.

I am highly sceptical of anecdotal evidence on ATS and call it as I usually (correctly) see it.


I was wrong. Absolutely wrong.


You are also indeed correct that some Muslims believe Muhammad married a child.
But it is not universal to Islam.
Only to those who follow one specific Hadith.


A Hadith that most Muslims feel is weak.

This was explained to you earlier though by EnlightenedServant and all he got in return was the label apologist.


So while you may be correct in what some believe, do not pretend that it is a known fact that Muhammad actually did marry a child...

More recent estimates put consummation at the age of 19 based on the age of Aisha's sister at the time of the marriage.
It's a more mathematically astute hypothesis than just words on a bit of paper ie the weak Hadith...
Instead taking into account other details including the Islamic Calender.


Please, forgive me for calling you a liar.
That was out of order, sir.



Now, as to this belief, yes it is abhorrent and I cannot whitewash the notion that some Muslims follow it to the law of the letter, for example it's already been stated that child marriage is common in some countries...
It is sickening. I myself am a Quranist and do not believe in any Hadith unless they follow the Quran...





Ps I'm not new here, my other account had problems but wasn't banned.
PM me for more info on that if you're interested, my friend.



And once again, please accept my apology, it wasn't an attack, just sceptical on my part.
If mods can edit my previous post to reflect I was wrong, I hope they do.
edit on 19-4-2016 by Hazardous1408 because: Clarification.



posted on Apr, 19 2016 @ 11:57 PM
link   
a reply to: Hazardous1408

I have nothing but respect for what you just said, star for that. The poster second above you I cannot say the same for... Thank you, for taking responsibility the way you did , most would not and you have gained my respect, I hope for further debate and you are more than worthy of debating, cheers my friend
edit on 19-4-2016 by TechniXcality because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 20 2016 @ 12:05 AM
link   
a reply to: mazzroth

Is that so, mazzroth...


I'll hold you to that idea... In 3...


2...




1...

news.bbc.co.uk...



posted on Apr, 20 2016 @ 01:30 AM
link   
There is always something to debate ... ah I love Humans ..

I should open up a Social Justice Warrior school.



posted on Apr, 20 2016 @ 03:36 AM
link   
a reply to: TechniXcality

And that's the thing. I have asked Muslims this question before and every time fall on deaf ears or they will deny Mohammed had a child bride ( Aisha ) yet it is in black in white in the Hadith ? See this is unnerving , because if they know this fact , and if they read the Koran they have to well , you also have to consider the whole "infidel thing" ya know ... death to the non believers and jihad that is spoken of in this Hadith And then you have to wonder if they are comfortable with worshiping a pedophile without question then they probably believe in killing us "infidels" as well. It's almost as if there is a secret code among them that dictates certain facts of the Koran and or Hadith are forbidden to discuss with non Muslims.




edit on 20-4-2016 by DarthFazer because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 20 2016 @ 05:00 AM
link   
It seems all of Europr has now found out what the " Religion Of Love" is all about, love of raping young women, love of raping young boys, love of raping young girls, and the love of violence



posted on Apr, 20 2016 @ 10:28 AM
link   
When talking religion with anyone. When you point out the contradictions they lose there mind. They have been brainwashed so bad into believing there religion is 100% correct. The peoe that brainwashed them never brought up these points. So when they finally see them and are tlod them they have an initial denial stage. Like if I told you tight now that you were adopted and you really were yet free up always thinking this other lady was your mom. If I told you she wasn't you would lose your mind.



posted on Apr, 20 2016 @ 10:48 AM
link   
I thought this thread was trashed. It is gone from my threadlist. Did I delete it by accident? Let's see if it shows up again now.

Anyways, mods, this is why I sent a complaint yesterday.....lol.



posted on Apr, 20 2016 @ 11:38 AM
link   
a reply to: DutchMasterChief

Reading comprehension isn't really your thing is it?

The point I'm making is that trying to insinuate that someone 500+ years ago was a pedophile by judging them by today's standards is a total strawman argument, because back then what was considered "normal" most certainly isn't now.

That's not apologising for anything. That is simple fact.

Today, such actions are not considered normal, and rightfully so, but ripping the crap out of one person in history for something when - in all likelihood - it was more common practice at the time and people worldwide were likely doing the same is stupid, because it seems the West was no better and - as was shown in the link I posted the age of consent legally in most of the states of the OP's own country until the 1900's was 10.

That doesn't make it right by today's standards, but they are today's standards and didn't apply back then. Society did not know better.

Anything that happens today is governed by today's laws, and as such anyone who carries out such acts should be condemned and punished to the fullest extent of the law.

But if the OP takes actual historical context into account, condemning only one person from one religion is folly, and the context of his question about child brides is skewed. He can criticize it, but it's actually hypocritical to do so and implies an agenda to provoke.

I'm sure you won't see it that way, because you obvious bias won't allow you to. I think that's something we can both agree on.

Your example is flawed by the way, because by today's standards saying that is not acceptable, and you would be rightly castigated for doing so. Criticising people who said such things 60 years ago, when society wasn't as enlightened would, again, be folly, and a complete waste of time, because it can't be unsaid.



posted on Apr, 20 2016 @ 12:38 PM
link   
a reply to: neformore




Reading comprehension isn't really your thing is it?


Actually, it is completely my thing, and quite obviously not your forte.




The point I'm making is that trying to insinuate that someone 500+ years ago was a pedophile by judging them by today's standards is a total strawman argument, because back then what was considered "normal" most certainly isn't now.


Really. Differing standards have nothing to do with it.

~pedophile: a person who is sexually attracted to children.

It doesn't matter if a person was sexually attracted to children in 500 AD, or in current times. A pedophile is a pedophile by definition.

You are completely missing the point. The person it was said to, was supporting pedophilia in 2016, just like his prophet 1500+ years ago, at least according to religious texts.

It was a valid paralel to draw. So although it may have been accepted practise in the prophet's time, it is not in 2016. At least it shouldn't be. However, it still seems to be in the situation the OP pointed out.


My comment about your post being apologetic was refering to your remarks about European and American history, obviously, I even spelled it out for you, and you still didn't get it.

Let me try again, pointing out that "we" did it too centuries ago doesn't make it right for others to still do it in current times.

How were you not being apologetic towards those people who still do this today? And you were clearly suggesting that because "we" did it too, the OP shouldn't criticise those who do it now, which is utter BS.




But if the OP takes actual historical context into account, condemning only one person from one religion is folly, and the context of his question about child brides is skewed. He can criticize it, but it's actually hypocritical to do so and implies an agenda to provoke.


Here, doing it again. How is it hypocritical for him to criticise it? Because our society did it too in the past? BS.




I'm sure you won't see it that way, because you obvious bias won't allow you to.


No, a normal thought process won't allow me to.




Your example is flawed by the way, because by today's standards saying that is not acceptable, and you would be rightly castigated for doing so


Omg, and to think that you were commenting on my reading comprehension skills.....

That was the exact point I was making. Pedophilia is also not accepted by todays standards, but that didn't stop people from making excuses for it by saying that "we" did it too, in the past, just like "we" had racist laws in the past.

Using the same logic, it would be ok for me to be racist, because it was accepted practise not so long ago......

Jeez.


edit on 20-4-2016 by DutchMasterChief because: (no reason given)



new topics

top topics



 
31
<< 5  6  7    9  10 >>

log in

join