McDonald's Says its Wage Hikes Are Improving Service

a reply to: Dfairlite

They are fighting for a higher wage isn't that clear?

a reply to: Dfairlite

I'm afraid, though, that we're rapidly approaching a time (if we're not there already) when we have more people than we need to run or do anything for any wage. At more than one place where I've worked in the past, there were people who literally seemed to thwart efficiency at every turn as a matter of job security.

Only so many people are required to keep the lights on and the fridge filled for the owners. The truth of the matter is, there are many talented, educated people out there. Many more have every potential to become educated and develop talents given half the chance.

In a neo-feudal system many of us, however talented, become "excess". The old model just doesn't look like something that will work. As we get more efficient, there's less need for people and even less need to pay them...worse yet, there's no real reason (from a materialistic perspective) to bother having the "extra" to begin with... Swift's Modest Proposal springs to mind...



The way it appears, we need to switch to a system where we value and develop people not out of necessity, but out of a common humanity. Or, we descend into a system that is a technologically advanced version of some Dickensian hell.

My bet is it will probably take a lot of bad things happening because of stupidity before anyone learns. And even then, we'll only learn for a moment and revert back to bad things as soon as one generation up and forgets all the hard lessons...

a reply to: SisterDelirium

Yes, things are going to have to get a whole lot worse before they can ever get better.

You see, people like you and me? People in the literate democracies of the world? We're in the top 10% of the world in terms of food, income, energy consumption, creature-comforts, ect...We're the furthest away from the bad news.

Things are going to have to really hit home to the 1st world middle classes people before positive change will ever happen.

originally posted by: carewemust
According to the Fortune article, 1 out of 10 McDonald workers in the U.S. got an 89 cents-per-hour raise, before taxes. How can any broad conclusions be drawn from this?

That is an extra 150 bucks a month, if working full time.

The broad conclusion is they can CERTAINLY feel better from it.

Let's move everyone up to the executive level, they can all sit behind desks in their own extravagant offices doing mostly nothing all day while earning 7 and 8 figure salaries, with 6 and 7 figure annual bonuses.

Yeah, that could work.

a reply to: ausername

We don't need worthless cashiers or cooks they don't even do the bulk of the work.

a reply to: MystikMushroom

As I was typing this, I was picturing in my mind the things I've heard recounted by missionaries working in the slums of India.

Yeah, the worst anyone can have it in the US is several hundred factors of ten better than the worst a person can have it in the poorest places in the world.



The only way I can see it getting better is for people to come to a general understanding that "no human being should be treated like/live like this" and a general belief that every human life represents something meaningful/valuable...that life overall, is valuable and to be tended with care.

It's my personal opinion that scientific rationalism won't get us there. In a cold, purely rational world it would make logical sense to trim the excess of "have nots" in the minds of the "haves". Instant environmental improvement for the wealthy, problem solved.

I'm just really hoping that the people who have the means, motive and opportunity to make that a reality haven't come to that conclusion. I'm not convinced they haven't, to be honest, and I can't help but wonder what the smartest among them might dream up to "fix" things.

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: Dfairlite

They are fighting for a higher wage isn't that clear?

I fought for a higher wage and keep on fighting.
Part of that "fight" included:
1. Hanging out and helping at a beach stand in the 80s so I could eventually scoop a job giving surfing lessons making $100+ cash a day. The thought of making minimum wage back then was ridiculous.
2. Joining and completing a union construction trade apprenticeship. That was a real fight. Getting up every morning at 4-5am learning from my journeymen and attending class every single Saturday. Sweating my ass off while tossing sheets of sheetrock around eventually getting two spinal surgeries from the "fight">
3. All busted up going back to school at 46 years old to earn my degree. This fight went on a little more than 4 years while working.
4. I'm out performing my peers. I actively seek out better employment and now a company I want to work for is working for the company I currently work for all set up by me so I can jump ship for more $. Thing is my current company knows this and the bidding war has started.
The "fight" should be about bettering ones self not demanding someone pay more for not bettering yourself.

a reply to: MrNeo

I don't want to hear your perspective on what you had to do in the 80's and 90's when the economy was thriving to work hard and get s jobs

To get an apprenticeship today your uncle has had to be working a union job for 30 years to even get a shot or you can show up on job sites everyday with the 15 other journeyman trying to do he same thing as you.

Totally different world we live in right now.

a reply to: onequestion

To get an apprenticeship today your uncle has had to be working a union job for 30 years

False.

Most new masons receive their training through an apprenticeship. Apprenticeship programs are offered by technical and community colleges, professional mason’s and builder’s associations, and masonry unions. In most cases, to enter an apprenticeship you must be at least 18 years old and have a high school diploma or GED. Prospective apprentices may also be required to pass an aptitude test.

www.howtobecome.com...


www.cementmasons600.org...

Of course, there is no guarantee that you'll get work. That would depend on how many apprentices are ahead of you on the bench.

originally posted by: Abysha
a reply to: onequestion

Well duh... you get what you pay for.

Here's what pisses me off. When I cave and get fast food somewhere, I'm often greeted by rather grumpy people who may or may not have spit in my food. This wouldn't be so bad if I wasn't fully aware that I am also subsidizing their wages because their pay isn't enough for them to live off of therefore they need government assistance. So... not only am I paying part of their wages but I'm also paying their bosses and getting sketchy service.

If the companies themselves paid the wages instead of the taxpayers, the employees would be happier, I could trust what's in my veggie burrito, and my taxes might go to something more worthy like universal healthcare or for providing education for the next generation.

This is so true. People don't realize that the CORPORATIONS are being subsidized by our taxes because they don't pay their employees enough to live on. If the corporations paid their employees enough to live on, then we wouldn't have to pay for their food and welfare.

And people who work full-time deserve a living wage. Not only that, if they aren't paid one, how are they supposed to be consumers? How can businesses sell things to people who have no money?

a reply to: darkbake

And people who work full-time deserve a living wage.

Why?
A high school dropout, living with his parents, "deserves" a "living wage?" Why?

Not only that, if they aren't paid one, how are they supposed to be consumers?

Easy. Living at home, not paying rent, not paying a mortgage, means you can buy all kinds of cool stuff.

a reply to: onequestion

The first thing I thought about when reading this thread title was, "Wait, their service is supposed to be better?!?!?" Seriously, wage issues aside, we completely quit going there because of the bad service. used to be decent, then they altered all the stores, so they look more like a tire store than a restaurant, and changed the service, from a model that worked very well to one that was ticking customers off left and right. Haven't been back in ages, and don't plan to go. No one even mentions them as an option, interestingly enough.

As for what they pay, a good company can easily choose to pay a decent wage, to draw in better employees. I am not sure though, that a higher wage alone would make any and all better at their jobs. I worked in fast food at times, and there were people working there who weren't worth minimum, much less any 10-15 an hour, or whatever. A good employee does a good job, regardless of wage.

a reply to: onequestion

Excuse me?
I work for a union general contractor as a project superintendent. The same union I completed my apprenticeship in decades ago.
Where do you get your information from?
Union apprenticeships are in cooperation with the state which has guidelines and quotas.
My uncle had nothing to do with my union apprenticeship neither does the uncles of the 25+ apprentices on my job site.
There is a guarantee that you get the required hours to journeyman out as long as you don't wash out.
There is a building boom in my state and we have a severe man power shortage. You can join the laborers union, go through a week of training and get sent to work for $30+ an hour.
Please. I live this stuff - today - everyday.

It's that same defeatist mindset that says, "no, it can't be done" so you HAVE to pay me "living wages" for little effort and responsibility.
That's the fight. Getting up and telling yourself, "I'm worth more than minimum wage and if I have to I'll show up at the job site everyday until I get a job".

a reply to: Phage

Every fast food place I've been to half the people working there were adults. My mom worked fast food for years before she stopped working. The only teenagers work and should work at fast food died years and years and years ago. That hasn't been true for pretty much ever. Neither has the dropout thing.

Normally your pretty grounded, but at the moment you clearly live in a fantasy world if you think that situation is even remotely representative of most fast food workers.

a reply to: Phage

My friend lost both of his parents when he was a kid. He's had barely any support since then and lives through hell everyday. I'd like to see you say that to him

The local nuke plant has classes that cost $5k and nearly everyone gets a job. People are complaining that it ought to be free. $5k is about 3 weeks pay when you get in and you can make payments !!

originally posted by: feedmemore
a reply to: Phage

My friend lost both of his parents when he was a kid. He's had barely any support since then and lives through hell everyday. I'd like to see you say that to him

Why would I? He's not living in his parents' home, is he?

And in case anyone hasn't pointed this out, a minimum wage increase doesn't mean everyone working at McDonalds will automatically get a raise. Less then 4% of the USA workforce earns minimum wage. At most places of employment this just means the entry level worker who starts at minimum wage gets a little more per hour than previously. Once you've been employed there and establish you can show up on time and are a capable worker you are making more than min. wage.

www.bls.gov...

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: Wide-Eyes

And it makes for health happier communities.

And no matter what you say...if you pay employees too much (ie. more than you can afford based upon your income) you will eventually go out of business. And...if you give people a pay raise for no reason, you WILL see an increase in productivity. A temporary one.

There is a thing called balance. If $8 per hour is paid to an employee and a burger costs a customer $2...and you double the pay to the employee, eventually you will have to raise the price of a burger to $4. At $4, some people will stop buying from you and go somewhere else. Screw them! Just raise the price to $6 to make up for those who left. And when no one will by a $6 burger...start firing people and demand more work for the $16 per hour pay. Then employees start quitting and eventually...you close the doors and go out of business. Everyone looses their job, the customers go elsewhere and the owner and company loose money.

But hey! For a time you paid people $16 per hour. Ain't that freaking great of you?