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The United States: Is the Problem Really Guns?

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posted on Apr, 14 2016 @ 07:25 PM
a reply to: Dumbass

But it's not the criminals per se that cause the crime…

"Not Guilty your honor"?

posted on Apr, 14 2016 @ 08:19 PM
a reply to: MystikMushroom

Few people, who've given is any real thought at all, actually think that.

Is it part of the problem, I suspect so. It's far too easy to get prescription meds in hopes of medicating the problem away, rather than treatment in conjunction with medicine. That simple solution you mentioned?

No. There are a myriad of problems involved in this, and the sooner more of us realize that, the better off we'll all be.

/no sarcasm.

posted on Apr, 14 2016 @ 08:19 PM
Poverty is the cause of the majority of crime, regulating symptoms does nothing to solve the issue.

Also, it would be more enlightening to know how many of those deaths are suicide, justified, etc.

The rates of other violent crime tend to be considerably higher in other OECD nations.

posted on Apr, 14 2016 @ 11:02 PM
a reply to: Eilasvaleleyn
I suspect the problem with firearms is the disconnect between the perpetrator and the action. When you have access to an easy, impersonal method of dispatch, it is more enticing than using, for instance, a knife.

The biggest issue is handgun proliferation. They are far less capable instruments than rifles, but they are more concealable and find greater employment in murders. They are useful solely for killing human beings and are more deserving of regulation.

I am a WWII collector, if that gives my opinion more weight.

posted on Apr, 14 2016 @ 11:24 PM
In the big cities where you have gangs and street corner drug dealing you have major numbers of shootings and gun crime.

Go to rural America and you have few gun crimes and almost no gang and drug related shootings.

You do have a more self defense and homeowners shooting criminals in rural areas. but not high numbers.

this is one of the reason gun laws in cities and gun laws in rural area have to be much differant or the laws will never work and many rural people will not stand for being disarmed where the cops are 30 mins to a hour away where in the city where the cops are seldom more then 10 mins away.

posted on Apr, 15 2016 @ 02:56 AM
In America according to The Law there isn't much difference between killing one person and killing 20 - either way you will face 25 to Life in prison.

In Australia 25 to Life is reserved only for the extreme cases of violence or where a person cannot be rehabilitated and would endanger the community by being released. If you kill one person in Australia you'd either go into hiding or you'd hand yourself in at the nearest CopShop. The more people you kill in Aus the longer and more severe your punishment is.

I think that many people in the US panic after they accidentally/intentionally kill someone, go on the run. Are chased by live action news helicopters (making them more desperate) and shoot down anyone that comes in their way.

Maybe a revision of punishment is in order? *

*(But not to the extent of Australia where pedophiles, wife beaters, criminals are given slap on the wrist sentences and are often let out on bail and serve no time for horrible crimes)
edit on 15-4-2016 by Kalixi because: Typoo

posted on Apr, 15 2016 @ 03:42 AM
Right, here is my expansion upon the three causes I mentioned. While there are more causes you could talk about, these three in particular seem to support each other in an unholy triangle of negative feedback.

Number One: the awful police force.
In America, cops are feared.
In America, cops are killers.
In America, cops are military lite.
In America, cops are higher class citizens.
In America, cops shoot first and never bother asking questions.

Now, while in many ways these statements might be somewhat exaggerated, it's quite undeniable that when it comes to the police force, America has problems. Big problems. Whether it's corruption or brutality, it's all over the place in spades. Why is this such a big problem? Well, aside from the obvious ramifications, it reinforces the culture of fear and violence that the United States seems to have fallen into.

How to fix it? While there are a few ways to otherwise alleviate the problem (cop cams, holding police responsible for their actions) the root causes will still persist. Doing a hard system reboot (the nuclear option) and firing all police officers, chiefs, so on and so forth, may actually do a fair bit of good. But while there are still so many guns in the country, and more importantly, still so many people who will use them in nefarious ways, even a force full of good cops will continue to be forced to shoot many people. However, the citizenry would no longer fear them or distrust them and that would hopefully spread throughout the populace.


Number Two: A Culture of Fear.

While there are other cultural issues (like a vague undertone of might makes right) the United States suffers from a severe ailment in that - ever since 9/11 - all decisions it makes have been plagued by far. One major political party (Republicans) tends to add fuel to the fire, and feed off of it (though the other party is also not averse to feeding and feasting from that flame.) Sadly ironically, despite its common moniker as Land of the Free, Home of the Brave, in this day and age it is seemingly more accurately Land of the Exploited and Enslaved, Home of the Fearful. Citizens have to fear their police. They fear terrorists. Fear is involved with the enormous proliferation of guns (and while as I have stated guns are not the disease, they are still the blood frenzying the sharks.) Fear fear fear, everywhere. Fear of Government becoming Dictatorship, fear of guns being taken away, fear of other people with guns.

Another cultural issue is the red vs. blue mindset, the Liberal vs. Conservative. Many liberals seem to view conservatives as gun obsessed drooling bible-toting idiots, and many conservatives seem to view liberals as freedom poaching right infringing bleeding hearts. While there are undoubtedly examples of both of these types of people in each part of the spectrum, tragically and far too often many individuals fail to realise that while their opinions on certain matters differ, they are all hoping for, trying to fight for, trying to obtain, the same thing. A better tomorrow, a better country for themselves and for their children.


Number Three: Economic Issues.

Or more specifically, the poverty or duress placed on the poor, the stress on the dying middle class, and the insane gap between the wealthy elite and everyone else. In a country like Australia, my own, or the UK, while there are a few super super rich people, and a decent amount of the rich and the poor, it is by and large formed by the middle class. America is... Somewhat different. Many ultra-rich, extreme amounts of very poor, and only a few of the middle class. This huge wealth disparity, like hot and cold winds, form tornadoes that tear through the country. The numerous poor, either through lack of options or simply crushing despair, ultimately turn to crime. Where they clash with the police and the government, whom they (in many cases correctly) believe to be screwing them.

Now, I haven't written these out as well as I potentially could have and there are things I have left out, but it will hopefully make more clear why I think these three bits in particular contribute to a large portion of the problems the United States faces.
edit on 15/4/2016 by Eilasvaleleyn because: Reasons

posted on Apr, 15 2016 @ 11:06 AM
Wow, now the police are being blamed for killings they didn't even commit.

I think I have now heard it all.

edit on 15-4-2016 by TorqueyThePig because: (no reason given)

edit on 15-4-2016 by TorqueyThePig because: (no reason given)

posted on Apr, 15 2016 @ 12:44 PM
a reply to: TorqueyThePig

Why would I blame them for killings they didn't commit? They murder plenty of people on their own, but that is a topic for another time.

Perhaps it would have been better to say that people in the impoverished neighborhoods where many homicides take place don't trust the police, and those do not call the police, which leads to deaths that could have been prevented had the police been notified.

There, is that police-friendly enough for you?

posted on Apr, 15 2016 @ 04:29 PM
a reply to: Eilasvaleleyn

Your thread title: "The United States: Is the Problem Really Guns?"

You surmise that even if gun deaths were removed from statistics "non-gun homicides alone are higher than the total of the other three countries on the list."

So please correct me if I am wrong, you are looking at the total number of murders committed in the USA by its citizens right?

Per you, the number one root cause is

"1) Awful police force"

How is that not blaming police for killings they didn't commit?

posted on Apr, 15 2016 @ 05:01 PM
a reply to: TorqueyThePig

Perhaps I should have specified that the list was not in any particular order. The issues with the police force are most likely the least impactful of the three, with the most impactful being economic issues. It is not "this is the 1st biggest problem this is the 2nd biggest problem, etc" it's "this is my 1st point, this is my 2nd point, etc."

The statistics list homicides. I would presume that police killings are indeed included within those statistics, but the direct affect would be roughly 0.3785 deaths per 100,000. (Using the 2015 statistics, however.) Noticeable, but proportionally minor.

However, the reason why the police have such an effect is due to the other two issues. Economics and Culture, though it's also the amplification via gun that they're forced to kill so many. As a totally unfounded guess, I'd say that around 5-7% of police killings were unjustified. But that's being optimistic, that's what I want to believe, and that's part of the issue. Many people don't really trust the police anymore. They want to think the police have their best interests at heart, and are good and not-corrupted people, but the question persists... "Are they really?"

Despite my fairly strong words, I like to believe that a reasonable majority of the force are good people who take their work seriously, and I have a large amount of respect for the officers that do. But who can really know? And even if that's the case, there's reasonable cause to believe that even if the corruption doesn't run wide, it runs deep. (And there is corruption, of course. Just like every other organisation on this planet with a degree of power. It's not a question of "if" it's a question of "how much". In the case of the United States, it's looking like that's "more than you should be comfortable with.")

edit on 15/4/2016 by Eilasvaleleyn because: Reasons

posted on Apr, 16 2016 @ 12:17 PM
a reply to: seagull

Not at all suggesting there's only one problem. As stated in my post, I say there are a myriad of reasons likened to an algebra problem with a ton of variables.

That last sentence was more or less a wrap-up/ think about your situation personally and maybe what you could do to help better yourself, to in turn better us all.

I know I'm trying, and it sounds like you are too based on your post below mine. That's most of all we can do is help ourselves. After that, help others but only if they specifically ask for it. You can't force help on someone but we all already knew that..

posted on Jun, 10 2016 @ 02:18 AM
The US is far more ethnically diverse than the other Anglophone nations given in the OP's chart.

The areas of the USA that look like UK, Canada and Australia demographically, have similar crime statistics.

Not hatin'. Just statin'

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