Any music producers here at ATS

I need some assistance concerning the music industry. My son has been making his own music since he was 13 years old. Now he is 31 and starting to put a dent in the music charts. Now my son wants me to be his manager but I told him I have little experience with music but he needs someone he can trust and he has decided it to be me.....yet I have not decided. Both Spinnin records and Columbia records are interested in his music and in him. Both want a couple of songs he has completed and I had these questions:

From what I have read the standard music contract for musicians/artist is called the 360 contract. I have read through a standard one and it appears the music label has all the rights and the artist very little. Is there another known music contract out that better protects the artist?

Any such thing as a signing bonus?

Columbia wants to buy actually two of his songs.... out right buy it...... on sound cloud alone he has over 3.5 million listeners within 30 days who love his tunes..... all online music sites he has over 20 million listeners....so how much money should he receive for each song. I believe these two songs will easily be in the Top 50 real quick and I have heard horror stories concerning how "gangsta" the music labels are.

If you had a hit how much money would you want if the label wanted to outright buy it?

Any and all help is appreciated.

Thanks

Hey Dad...be smart and get a entertainment lawyer...slogging your way through a cut throat business is the first step to failure...and you are doing your son a miss service.
You would be betraying his trust in you as a father and manager...this is not a DIY deal.
Cheers

originally posted by: JaMeDoIt
Hey Dad...be smart and get a entertainment lawyer...slogging your way through a cut throat business is the first step to failure...and you are doing your son a miss service.
You would be betraying his trust in you as a father and manager...this is not a DIY deal.
Cheers

I thought about that as well BUT these entertainment lawyers are just as bad as the music labels. It seems everyone wants a large piece of the pie but does little for the service. I have heard many want a percentage of sales....

I have spoken to my son about this issue as well and we have spoken to a couple of entertainment lawyers and were not impressed at all. Everything they spoke about we found on the internet. One of them pulled out a 360 contract and attempted to sell us on this idea....

Go for an independent label and not a major one.
Stay as far away from California as possible... If your son wants to be an Artists then stay independent, If he wants to be famous then go major.

In the long run by keeping as much control as possible will give him a more happy life and more longevity.

Do you have any contacts in the music industry currently? I ask because, as your sons manager, you're his advocate when it comes to ...everything. Getting gigs, approving producers, making sure your son stays on track and working within his contract, etc. etc. And as your sons career grows, your job gets exponentially bigger, too.

I would suggest you find the local music scenes industry people and make some contacts, talk through the ropes a little bit.

A big thanks to all so far.......much to think over.....

We know selling on ITunes and other online music sources is OK but we don't know anyone who is selling online that is making some real cash. I know he is my son but this guy is a real prodigy. I wish I could reveal his stage name but it will lead back to me and I kinda want to keep my identity here at ATS.

originally posted by: Atsbhct
Do you have any contacts in the music industry currently? I ask because, as your sons manager, you're his advocate when it comes to ...everything. Getting gigs, approving producers, making sure your son stays on track and working within his contract, etc. etc. And as your sons career grows, your job gets exponentially bigger, too.

I would suggest you find the local music scenes industry people and make some contacts, talk through the ropes a little bit.

HI

Good points...thanks.

I have two contracts on my desk.......one from Columbia records and one from Spinnin records based out of Netherlands .... neither contract signed and both over 100 pages!! Since we are waiting for a release date for two of his songs we have time to ponder. Trying to talk to the record label company execs is a waste of time ..... they don't talk and when they do, they send some arrogant wannabe with his polished language and clothes to us trying to wine and dine us into signing a contract. I feel like it is one of those deals you make with the devil.....

Something inside is telling me .......something is not right. They offer only 10 per cent to the artist meanwhile they keep 90% and my son is not only the musician but also the producer!

You are right I need to discuss this with other people in the music industry. Do you by the way have the phone number to the Rollin Stones or maybe Aerosmith? ...... just kidding....

EDIT LATER: My son has also done some remix work for a new and upcoming band in USA called the Ultimate Candidates. Lead singer might be going to AC/DC as lead singer......check em out.

a reply to: DeathSlayer

Another thing to remember is that in the entertainment industry, 99% of the time, you need to spend money to make money.

If your son is a prodigy, advise him to sign to a tiny record label and watch him blow up like Adele, Hozier, Mac Demarco, etc.

Or register your own label, a la (no room for what you think about the artist here) now multi platinum multi millionaires, Macklemore and Ryan Lewis. If he all ready has the sales to back it up, take out a loan, produce a well done indie video, blow up on YouTube and start booking.

Does he have media skills? This can be make or break when it comes down to it.

a reply to: DeathSlayer

I can't find anything from the Ultimate Candidates. Blame the U.S. election. Do you have a link?

originally posted by: Atsbhct
a reply to: DeathSlayer

Another thing to remember is that in the entertainment industry, 99% of the time, you need to spend money to make money.

If your son is a prodigy, advise him to sign to a tiny record label and watch him blow up like Adele, Hozier, Mac Demarco, etc.

Or register your own label, a la (no room for what you think about the artist here) now multi platinum multi millionaires, Macklemore and Ryan Lewis. If he all ready has the sales to back it up, take out a loan, produce a well done indie video, blow up on YouTube and start booking.

Does he have media skills? This can be make or break when it comes down to it.

We don't have the funds ......

I have been thinking of a small record label like Spinnin records in the Netherlands and we do have our own record label for tax reasons and it is unknown of course......only one client.......my son.


My kid has media skills out the yang-yang and fears nothing. Good kid ..... easy going ..... easy to talk to..... exactly the opposite of me.


You have given me something to think about.......

a reply to: DeathSlayer

There is a management group in nashville called thirty tigers. They are not a label. You keep the rights, they do all the work. They work for some big independent names. Like sturgill simpson,

Keep in mind as well that you want to lean towards a label who knows how to market the type of music your son makes. Columbia would have in house teams that could market almost any genre. Spinnin Records deals mostly in Electronic/Dance and Remixes. Thirty Tigers is really good at promoting Country/Indie and American Roots music.

Make a good match.

originally posted by: DeathSlayer

Do you by the way have the phone number to the Rollin Stones or maybe Aerosmith? ...... just kidding....

My son has also done some remix work for a new and upcoming band in USA called the Ultimate Candidates. Lead singer might be going to AC/DC as lead singer......check em out.

Will Axl Rose be AC/DC's new lead singer

So we have two references to: Axl Rose.

''Oh What A Tangled Web We Weave"

a reply to: DeathSlayer

I know Spinnin records, they're not an evil company, not like Sony or Universal, can't speak for Colombia though.

You have to think what he'll get from being signed, it's not just money, Spinnin will promote the tracks for him, send it off to DJ's for radio shows, add it to promo lists, etc etc basically they will do all the boring work that comes with being a musician and that's the price you pay for their "cut" of the music.

The reality is most artists don't make much money for their music in terms of sales from singles, all the artists I've ever known and spoke to have all told me that singles is just to get noticed and keep the hype around you as an artist. It's touring where you make the money, concerts and gigs (if you're a DJ who produces it's getting DJ sets), merchandise etc

It's why so many of the top artists are constantly on tour, because it's really where the money is

Are they signing him on as an artist or just signing his singles ?

originally posted by: Discotech
a reply to: DeathSlayer

I know Spinnin records, they're not an evil company, not like Sony or Universal, can't speak for Colombia though.

You have to think what he'll get from being signed, it's not just money, Spinnin will promote the tracks for him, send it off to DJ's for radio shows, add it to promo lists, etc etc basically they will do all the boring work that comes with being a musician and that's the price you pay for their "cut" of the music.

The reality is most artists don't make much money for their music in terms of sales from singles, all the artists I've ever known and spoke to have all told me that singles is just to get noticed and keep the hype around you as an artist. It's touring where you make the money, concerts and gigs (if you're a DJ who produces it's getting DJ sets), merchandise etc

It's why so many of the top artists are constantly on tour, because it's really where the money is

Are they signing him on as an artist or just signing his singles ?

Hi

Both Colombia and Spinnin want to sign him as an artist and since my son already has a couple of possible hits completed Colombia wants to buy them out right. In the Spinnin contract it does go into detail about DJ work, promotions and tours. Both want a five year commitment which I think is too much. I was thinking 12 month contract with renewal options. I submitted the proposal and have not heard back from either one. Not sure how this happened but Colombia knows about Spinnin contract......??

originally posted by: Woodcarver
a reply to: DeathSlayer

There is a management group in nashville called thirty tigers. They are not a label. You keep the rights, they do all the work. They work for some big independent names. Like sturgill simpson,

I will check into this ASAP

Thanks!

originally posted by: Hex1an

originally posted by: DeathSlayer

Do you by the way have the phone number to the Rollin Stones or maybe Aerosmith? ...... just kidding....

My son has also done some remix work for a new and upcoming band in USA called the Ultimate Candidates. Lead singer might be going to AC/DC as lead singer......check em out.

Will Axl Rose be AC/DC's new lead singer

So we have two references to: Axl Rose.

''Oh What A Tangled Web We Weave"

I heard guns and roses are coming back? Isn't Axel Rose going back to them?

I heard the rumor that Axel was one of the contenders for AC/DC but that is all I know.

a reply to: DeathSlayer

I am a sound engineer.

The best thing you can do is a get reputable lawyer.

With any label bit especially Columbia. They will be able to see what the contract really says as well as negotiate the terms you want. Royalties and things like that.

For those saying hold out for a smaller label . .well what Columbia is doing is offering to pay for songs. He isn't signing to the label.

Another important factor of getting a lawyer though is making sure your son stays a free agent meaning he doesn't have to only sell his songs to Columbia. If they do want exclusive rights to his songs they should have to pay extra and that should include royalties.

If they ask your son to be a so g writer you definitely want a lawyer. You can retain a lawyer or you can pay bases on reading the contract, reading and negotiating etc.

You may not trust lawyers but don't trust the label either.

a reply to: DeathSlayer

You've opened a huge can of worms. I received $20,000 for use of 1 song in the Sopranos...additional $$ for 3 movies....same song...Trains, planes and Automobiles and Tommy Boy.

Royalties quarterly are based on International sales...anywhere for a few thousand to nothing...lots to little.

Too many variables in your request. Is he a performer to? Own the complete copy and performance rights etc etc etc.

Advice? Do not represent him. Go with Columbia. Find a good music attorney, publisher and distributor. Sign nothing till you do.

Do not represent him. Any other info would take too long here and I wouldn't divulge it here anyway. I hesitate to have you contact me privately...but you can.

Good luck to him and yourself....

a reply to: DeathSlayer

It's pretty standard for 5 years really, they're investing in him also so why would they do it for 12 months on the chance he'll just leave to somebody else ?

They'll probably get back and tell you 12 months isn't acceptable for them, in which case you should go for 2 years with the expectation of negotiating it down to 3 years at best, BUT if you're not happy with the deal do not sign, because once you've signed that's it you're locked in with no way out so you need to make sure it's the right fit for you.

But as a company Spinnin are pretty good regards promoting and contacts so if it were me I'd push for 3 year contract, probably take a 4 year contract and really take advantage of what they'll offer, he'll honestly be in a better position than if you turn it down and try to go the route of a smaller label with a better contract because they won't have the resources like Spinnin.

As I say though I have no idea about Colombia, however bear in mind that Colombia's parent company is Sony, as for them knowing about the Spinnin contract, everybody knows each other in the music industry when it comes to A&R, promotions etc so don't worry too much, if anything it's a benefit if you choose to go the Colombia route because they know you have other options so if they really want him you'll have a bit more sway with negotiating a better deal which you should do, the first offer is them trying to get as much as they can, you should always try to negotiate a better deal for yourself

Ultimately it's all down to what you want from the contract vs the benefits you'll get from being signed to whichever company and if you're out of your depth and have absolutely no clue what is best in terms of contract, DO get some advice from a contract lawyer.