CNC Programming, or Machining

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: randomtangentsrme

Fresh out of college.

Start at 20$ an hour. Uses the lathe and fixes the machines in the production areas.

I'm talking about higher end manufacturing and shops that are machine shops not just factories, or getting into aerospace.

But don't take my word for it go look on google at how many they are hiring anywhere in the Us.

Get Texas, SoCal, Pennsylvania, Washington, wherever.

Sorry dude. Right now you are at the reality. Computers cut wages.

Oh, and I do have in-laws in aerospace. It's talent- not education to make that wage.
You have a good paying job at 20. Good luck finding more.

a reply to: randomtangentsrme

According to glassdoor.com their CNC programmer makes 90k a year.

www.glassdoor.com...

a reply to: randomtangentsrme

You got it backwards. The machinist can do it without the Cnc machine. The programmer only knows how to talk to computers.

Every cnc programmer I ever worked with also knew how to operate the machinery and production line. Most of them would step in for the day when a machinist would call in sick.

But you're correct in saying that a machinist also knows how to shape a piece of metal the old school way that a programmer wouldn't have a clue on how to do.

Unfortunately, most machine shops operate by way of expensive computerized cnc machines nowadays... or at least the larger shops that can afford to pay the better wages. The smaller shops still do a lot of old school type of custom machining, but also can't afford to pay a higher wage either because they're a small scale operation.

a reply to: randomtangentsrme

According to glass door they make on average 60k a year.

Not bad and I'm sure there is a lot of potential for talent and for good managing skills.

www.glassdoor.com...

a reply to: onequestion

I'd rather work myself into an aerospace manufacturer and get involved in the design process.

It appeals to me creatively.

Sounds to me like you're wanting to get into something more along the lines of engineering or drafting.

As an engineer you design the part.

As a drafter you plug the engineer's specs into a CAD program and pump out something on paper showing the manufacturing specs that can then transfer to the shop to be manufactured.

And as a cnc programmer, you then take the CAD design and create the program that outlines the manufacturing specs that then gets plugged into the cnc machine to make the product... which is where the machinist comes into play.

OR... the drafter process is skipped entirely (which is more and more common these days because of computerization), and the cnc programmer takes the engineer's design directly, inputs it to CAD for the specs, and then produces the cnc program outlines.

UNLESS you work in a small custom machine shop... then everybody, including the machinists, may or may not play a part throughout the entire process.


If you want to partake more in the design process, then machinist is not the way to go. The machinist is the last step in the manufacturing process and doesn't partake in the design process... at least not in the large-scale industries.

a reply to: CranialSponge

Would it help if I took the two year programming course and got a job with a company a pursued an engineering degree related to the work I'm doing in order to really understand the manufacturing process better during my design phase?

I think it would help if I engineered a part and made the prototypes myself in my garage.

a reply to: onequestion

Would it help if I took the two year programming course and got a job with a company a pursued an engineering degree related to the work I'm doing in order to really understand the manufacturing process better during my design phase?

I think it would help if I engineered a part and made the prototypes myself in my garage.

Absolutely !

That's why the best route, in my opinion, would be to just take the basic cnc programming course just to get your foot in the door. But make sure that the course you take also involves hands on machining and operating of said machinery. Don't just jump into a cnc programming course that teaches you nothing but computer nerd stuff... take the more indepth course that gets your hands dirty. A 2-year trade college will offer something like that far better than a 4-year university course (which would concentrate more on the computer side of things).

Get the basic certificate and then once you're actually working in the field, you'll get a better idea of what road you want to go down... whilst at the same time gathering hands on work experience (not to mention collecting a paycheque so you can save up for more education).

a reply to: onequestion

The best and brightest engineers are the ones that started out as blue collar grunts, who then furthered their education and worked their way up the ladder into the design aspects of their chosen industry.

originally posted by: CranialSponge
a reply to: onequestion

The best and brightest engineers are the ones that started out as blue collar grunts, who then furthered their education and worked their way up the ladder into the design aspects of their chosen industry.

Yeah it makes sense to really know the production process as well as he design process especially if your going to be involved creating your own supply line. Process design and managing your own shop will be important if your patent something.

a reply to: onequestion

Yep.

There's nothing worse than working with an engineer who's never gotten their hands dirty on the production lines...

Those guys are a nightmare to try to work with because they actually think they know more than the blue collar guy who's been working the production line for 30 years and has direct hands-on experience with all of the nuances of the actual manufacturing process and machine operating.

It turns into one big pissing match that, we as management, then have to referee and stomp out the fires.



LOL... don't get me started on engineer nightmare stories.

a reply to: CranialSponge

I'm kind of excited to get into the industry. I have a special talent for identifying problems and correcting them I did it for this company I worked for in Santa Barbara and improved their entire operations processes so the company could do 30% more business without adding any people.

The problem was I didn't get along with one of the managers there and he made he used that leverage against me and I let it control my actions.

I was way to young and cocky. Now I just master the process and keep my mouth shut until an opportunity arises.

I figure if I'm involved with creating parts I might catch on to some design flaws and fix them.

a reply to: onequestion

Sounds like you have an analytical type of mind.

We analytical types tend to be better at the 'Sherlock Holmes' detective type of stuff and can more easily spot the finer details and/or problems that normally fly right over other people.


Edit to add:

But it's also a curse because we tend to have to analyze everything to death to the point that we hum and haw over stuff 6000 times before we finally jump into something.

LOL

a reply to: CranialSponge

Yea exactly.

It's my curious nature I just always think there's got to be a better way.

I get these weird frustrations where I feel like there's a better way to do this and I start problem solving it and work on solutions automatically.

If you go through my thread history you will notice bat trend of problem solving at work.

I'm trying to make it profitable.

It's part of my OS apparently.

In all honesty it sounds like you should get a degree in engineer (i.e. Mechanical Engineering or Industrial Engineering). You will be much happier and doing the types of things that you talk about (design, inventing, etc.).

originally posted by: CranialSponge
a reply to: onequestion

The best and brightest engineers are the ones that started out as blue collar grunts, who then furthered their education and worked their way up the ladder into the design aspects of their chosen industry.

Agreed. I grew up on a farm working on machinery, and also worked at a local DPW as an equipment operator before and while I was in college studying engineering. I believe that this really set me above the rest of the engineering students. My fellow pupils were very book smart, but had no mechanical abilities whatsoever (most were "city boys" if you will).

a reply to: randomtangentsrme

neither makes good money? Define "good" money! I made 18 an hour as an operator,as a programmer /operator I made 25.Now,if you live in a high rent district,it may not be good,but in Phoenix,thats really good money.

As a mechanical engineer, the salaries you are talking about of $50k+ and $100k+ for senior positions usually require a degree in mechanical engineering since we actually are the ones that can take responsibility (risks) for the design. A CNC programmer or in a better word "drafter" without a degree in engineering can only work under the direction of a licensed engineer. Also, in some places running a machine shop for custom work (not automotive related) requires you to be a licensed engineer.

There does exist cases that the CNC drafter make those salaries but it is in some exceptional cases where the worker has significant and specific experience in a certain area, for example medical devices. Also I might add that industrial engineers don't actually design, they generally work with the optimization of the product line.

As a final thought, consider that experience with CNC equipment doesn't mean that you'll know the calculations and physics within the design. Ergo, designing parts by yourself for some invention might be difficult.

The high end of cutting metal is the field of medical devices.

Even the US Air Force doesn't pay as much for screws as the doctors do.

A watchmakers lathe can fit on a kitchen table and work to the finest tolerance.

Get your degree and network the kind of doctors who buy metalwork.

Best wishes....

a reply to: draoicht

Good to know thanks.

Oh I got it I just realized what the future of manufacturing is I'm going to set the stage for manufacturing products related to a specific market on the horizon and try and get a few contracts with companies like DARPA.