Religious Freedom Bills: giving the freedom to discriminate!

Many red states have been passing so called "religious freedom bills" Tennessee being the latest.

www.msnbc.com...

What I am wondering. Is how does baking a cake for someone who happens to be attracted to someone of the same sex interfere with the way one practices their faith?

Personally I see it as nothing more than giving evangelical Christians the ability to discriminate without having to worry about the possibility of lawsuits.

The same logic could be used to say that someone should be allowed to refuse service to Christians or Muslims because that is what my religious beliefs tell me. This is a big step backwards in treating all people with equality and basic human rights. Nobody should be refused rights of service because of the way they are born. Science has shown us that sexual preference is not a choice. However treating all humans as equals is a choice.

a reply to: Joecanada11

how does baking a cake for someone who happens to be attracted to someone of the same sex interfere with the way one practices their faith?

I suppose one answer is that by making a wedding cake and topping it off with a groom and groom in many ways makes/forces the baker essentially take an active part in a ceremony that goes counter to his/her beliefs. Personally, if I had a business I would be more concerned with making sales than worrying about what others are doing (with some limits I suppose), but I can understand if a devout Catholic/Muslim/Whatever does not want to be part of certain kinds of services.

Now, if we are talking about denying essential services (medical care, housing, utilities) then it's a whole different ball game.

Because dear one, we have free will. And no one has the right to force someone in a private business, (this is opposite of a health or education mandatory job) to go against their belief.

Government is not your boss, you are the employer, they stand under you. Their jobs are to uphold your freedom, equality, and rights, abundance and sovereignity or its TREASON.

There are many Homosexuals who can run their own businesses. There is not just one cake shop. Stop trying to dominate to others.

Whether that persons faith is rigid or not, you don't have the right to dominate them.

They have the right to say NO.

Also, this is all arranged by the PTB and Gov.

There was no accident that the bakery was sued, it was a setup by the Gov people, by Obama, who is operating illegally and rogue, as are our big bankers and corporations, so called elite, true evil.

They actually hate us all.

The job they do, which is illegal and unlawful as it violates the constitution and their Employers rights, seems to be all about CREATING DIVISION.

Managing DIVISION.

Because otherwise they'd all be gone.

a reply to: Joecanada11

It was never about a baker not baking a cake. It's about a baker's right to legally project disdain and judgement while refusing service to groups of people who they disapprove of, under the guise of "Christian love".

It is actually about Basic Respect for others and Freedom/Sovereignity.

In a world where you respect others, you don't walk in with rainbow shirts, kissing your same sex lover, and flaunting it in front of an avid Christian who is programmed by the very same elite who are making this issue, to shove it in their face.

Life is not about getting what you want all the time in a selfish manner.

It's about respecting others, and understanding them, and not expanding into a room and by doing so walking on others who aren't on the same level, grade or understanding.

It's just people hiding behind their religion to hate people, no where in the bible or koran or any religious book does it say you cant bake a cake cause the person is gay.

a reply to: Unity_99

Government is not your boss, you are the employer, they stand under you. Their jobs are to uphold your freedom, equality, and rights, abundance and sovereignity or its TREASON.

Not under these laws. Under these laws a county clerk could refuse to issue a marriage license to a gay couple based on their religious beliefs. A social worker to choose to disallow adoption or foster care to gay couples, based on their personal beliefs, rather than a fair standard.

Really just what the hell does someones business have to do with their belief in ignorant fairytales any way.

Stupid dumb ass morans(sic) just want to be bigoted piles of crap under color of law.

I suppose the only silver lining to these asinine attempts at reinstating institutionalized bigotry is the feel of desperation about them.

Maybe if these fainting Fatimas can't get along in modern society they should look for some place else to live.
Then they can be free to wallow in their hate all they want without bothering decent society.

K~

originally posted by: dukeofjive696969
It's just people hiding behind their religion to hate people, no where in the bible or koran or any religious book does it say you cant bake a cake cause the person is gay.

Careful doing that because there are some 'out there' that will throw scripture at You and then say "What Jesus meant was...." like they were there, all the while they are wearing a cotton shirt w/polyester pants and some lycra to boot while eating a pork sandwich on a Friday during Ramadan...

a reply to: aethertek

I suppose the only silver lining to these asinine attempts at reinstating institutionalized bigotry is the feel of desperation about them.

Actually, I'm filled with giddy anticipation to see just what kinds of creative backlash LGBTQ communities and atheist, Satanist, Wiccan communities, etc., will be coming up with to throw this nonsense back in their ignorant faces!

Here's an idea. How about some transgender bathroom displays. Get a bunch of really beautiful trans women to choose and visit certain bathrooms in really conservative areas, where the men would feel uncomfortable in their presence. DO the same with trans men in ladies rooms. Maybe people will begin to see what nonsense this all is!

There's an ongoing thread over on the other side that has been discussing the implications and backlash of these bills and they types of problems they cause.

North Carolina Loses 400 Jobs as PayPal Pulls Facility over ‘Bathroom Bill’

a reply to: Unity_99

What makes people think that all lgbtq people are all wearing rainbows and making out while looking at cakes. That is ridiculous.

And these laws aren't just about cakes and wedding dresses. They are allowing counsellors and therapists not to treat people based on their beliefs.

And again this could also allow people to refuse the rights to service of Christians, or Muslims , or even people of a different race because my religion says that "my race is superior"

I fear for the young gay man who's struggling with depression and gets turned away by a therapist based on this law only for the young man to commit suicide. It's bad enough that people have to deal with bullying and prejudice let alone making it legal to show prejudice.

The funny thing is is that if an atheist baker refused Christians service Christians would be up in arms about it saying they are bigoted. They will dish it out all day but they won't take it. If that were to actually happen I would have no issue with it because fair is fair. If Christians can do it then so should any other faith/non-faith.

originally posted by: eluryh22
a reply to: Joecanada11

how does baking a cake for someone who happens to be attracted to someone of the same sex interfere with the way one practices their faith?

I suppose one answer is that by making a wedding cake and topping it off with a groom and groom in many ways makes/forces the baker essentially take an active part in a ceremony that goes counter to his/her beliefs. Personally, if I had a business I would be more concerned with making sales than worrying about what others are doing (with some limits I suppose), but I can understand if a devout Catholic/Muslim/Whatever does not want to be part of certain kinds of services.

Now, if we are talking about denying essential services (medical care, housing, utilities) then it's a whole different ball game.

Some of these bills do allow people to refuse renting or selling property based on religious beliefs. They also allow therapists to refuse counselling services. This is about more than cakes and dresses and marriage licenses. Then again I'm not that surprised because there are still people wearing white ghost costumes burning crosses in the south.

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
The funny thing is is that if an atheist baker refused Christians service Christians would be up in arms about it saying they are bigoted. They will dish it out all day but they won't take it. If that were to actually happen I would have no issue with it because fair is fair. If Christians can do it then so should any other faith/non-faith.

I think the scenario you described would likely be incredibly accurate. That being said, in my gut I'm still not comfortable with forcing any private business that provides non-essential services with doing business with anyone. As distasteful as I may find it, I believe that someone should have the right to service whomever they please and not go into business with anyone they don't.

Let me take this away from the homosexual-wedding-cake thing for a moment to make my point. Let's say I'm a photographer that does the usual stuff. Weddings (gay and straight), graduation parties, school pictures, all that jazz.

Then one day I have someone call to hire me to take some glamour shots of their 4 year old daughter for those obscene (in my opinion) kiddie beauty pageants. Sorry, there is no way in heck that I would want to play any part in taking an innocent 4 year old girl and taking pictures of her while she is scantily clad and essentially being made into some sort of prepubescent sex object. In that scenario, should I be forced to do the photo shoot?

I understand that we live in a society that has a lot of people that hate for the sake of hating or people that hate because of ignorance or hate because of __________. That being said, all of that is relative because what disgusts one person may delight another.

They used to have a sign that businesses would hang that read:

"We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone"

But this was back when folks weren't so important, now if You don't bend at the knee You are a turd and the exact opposite of that important person's agenda..

"No Shirt, No Shoes, No Dice learn it, know it, live it..." Brad Hamilton Ridgemont High Class of 82

a reply to: windword

LOL, yes actually the Satanist of late have been having a field day with the religulous & their pious displays.
What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

Get a bunch of really beautiful trans women to choose and visit certain bathrooms in really conservative areas, where the men would feel uncomfortable in their presence.

Only if the ladies are armed or have an armed escort.
You just know that any man that has a problem with a female watching him pee already has issues, add the fact that they're TS Ladies & those goobers would probably pop a gasket.

K~

a reply to: Joecanada11

Some of these bills do allow people to refuse renting or selling property based on religious beliefs.

I'm not saying you are incorrect. I just haven't heard of this before so I'll have to take a look when I have a chance. As a side note, I've seen many articles about the opposite were entities (building management companies) are being forced to meet certain quotas to promote diversity.

They also allow therapists to refuse counselling services.

Again, I haven't heard about this before but I'll take a look. Since I know nothing about it please take this with a grain of salt but I can envision some scenarios where I could understand a counselor not wanting to service certain potential clientele based on some extremist (in my opinion) religious beliefs. If a parent brings a kid to a therapist because the child is gay and the father wants the counselor to "fix" it, should the counselor be compelled to do so? Same applies to a Muslim parent bringing in a daughter because she does not want to be subservient to men. You know, all that kind of stuff. Again, I know little about it so I have to do some research before I can speak more about it.

a reply to: eluryh22

Those are good points. I would hope the therapist would let the parent know that their child's preference isn't a problem to be fixed. It's just sad that given what we know about the brain and chemistry/hormones etc that this is even an issue.