Trump call to punish women for abortions

a reply to: tadaman

I'm a post-menopausal widow now, I can live the rest of my life celibate! and have every intention to do just that!

you cant pull out?

not an effective method of birth control

you cant take pill?

medically not recommended for some women with certain health issues..

you cant do oral?

what's the matter is the idea that women shouldn't be taught by the church to obey the husband IN ALL THINGS just to unimaginable to you? the idea that women should be able to say no more sex in a marriage for long prolonged periods of time too uncomfortable to you?? sorry, hubby would have to live without sex first!

in many cases you can get FREE BIRTH CONTROL from a plethora of groups worried about over population. There are so many options for both partners its a lie that all are not an option for health or financial reasons.

ya, really what kind, and where??? and I mean the good kind, with at least the same rate of effectiveness as the birth control bill and it can't be means tested, since some husbands might decide that they want another boat more than they want their wives to have the birth control.

or your church is really important in your bedroom.

lol, not anymore, I figured out a long time ago that the church's idea of the perfect marriage, with it's subservient women just can't be done in a loving manner. but it still doesn't change the fact that many who want abortion outlawed and are so quick to tell women not to have the sex often times start spouting those good ole christian values, of which, women running contrary to their husbands wishes is part of those christian values...
it's just rather hypocritical...

a reply to: dawnstar

You make no sense. now you dont even want to.

I made my case there are so many options to a modern person that if you have kids you dont want its because you are irresponsible.

Stop making humans with your genitals that a doctor has to kill for you.

I dont want to share my society with you the way people dont want to live in world with capital punishment.

This will not go away, and no one will stop fighting especially when obtuse arguments are given as retort.

your post made no sense and was full of contradictions.

either you are citing religious obedience like in Islam where you must obey, or you are against abortion for moral reasons.

I say ethically it is wrong since the end result is a dead person just so you can F without a condom.

By the way I have sex everyday, no birth control. No babies. Very fertile young couple. We just know the mechanics of REPRODUCTION. No need for abortions. If we mess up there is a pill for the morning after.

we dont mess up. we arent idiot children.

If we want the satisfaction of finishing inside we will get an operation and be done. its cheaper than the alternatives and BOTH of us can do it.

your husband couldnt get snipped after one? Yeah, that would be cheaper than a whole pair of more people you didnt want.

healthier too.

a reply to: tadaman

I'm not thinking about me, I am thinking about my future daughter in laws, and worrying about them and their real health problems being ignored to the point where their kids become motherless!

no, it's christian obedience... read your bible, and well, check out some of the religions out there. heck a decade or so I had a christian on a domestic abuse hotline going all out at it spouting his doctrine... heck one women was married to an abusive husband, who happened to be in a position of authority in the church even. she could find no other option other than to sit there and take his abuse, or leave and live in her car. since she didn't want her kids also living in the car, she left them with him, just to find out later that well, her husband started sexually abusing their daughter. they guy on the boards had the nerve to blame her for this happening, if she had been there, well, it would have been her he was forcing himself on instead of the girl!

by the way, I conceived son number two and three using condoms and spermicide... nope, no thank you!! you get what you pay for and when it comes to free condoms, well, their effectiveness is crappy!!

heck, got news for you, even if we are talking about tubals.... there's still a chance of pregnancy. far less chance than there is with condoms, but still a small chance. and all this still doesn't address those women who went into a pregnancy wanting a child, but well changed their minds later because HEALTH PROBLEMS POPPED UP THAT WERE TOO RISKY FOR THEM! and it most certainly doesn't explain why on earth, regardless on your view of abortion your would allow a law on the books, or a doctrine in a catholic hospital should be allowed to prevent a doctor from inducing labor in the middle of a miscarriage of a 17 week old fetus and risk sepsis in the mother!

a reply to: dawnstar

like I said there should be exceptions.

The whole process should be more serious.

it is not. its like going to the dentist now. As a human who opposes carefree murder I oppose it. Nothing here has given me credence that people even want to be honest about it.

so I will push on to reevaluate it. as others will. and this new law is off to a weak start. It may not make it beyond a century.

if you may die or were forced then fine. have an abortion.

all is good? welp, say good bye to a perfect figure, and hello to adoption services I say. Your good looks or possible contribution to society as an educated or well employed person dont trump anothers right to exist.

so sad. still the reason to treat sex as something serious. its human making. A penis shoots sperm and tend to make vaginas pop out people when they ejaculate inside. Surprise. welcome to the 21st century.

have better sex.

There is no way ALL options that are highly effective alone are not an option for you. wear a male or female condom, use spermicide, oral, anal, target practice, tubes tied yours or his, chemical sterilization, pills, injections, and so on

its such BS to say this is the 1950s and you only have abortion.

Whatever

have better sex like adults, instead of like idiot man childs and women children....or deal with it like adults.

stop using your genitals to make humans you dont want that a doctor has to later kill inside you

51% of women having abortions used a contraceptive method during the month they became pregnant.

Here you go guys.

Why don't you volunteer for Clinical Trials of Male Contraceptives.

malecontraceptives.org...

Here you go guys.

Fill out the survey: Prove that there is demand for new male contraceptives

The Male Contraception Coalition sends results from this survey and your letters on a quarterly basis to key policymakers and pharmaceutical company decision makers who have the power to speed the development of new male contraceptives. The information collected in this survey is not linked to individuals; read more about this in our privacy policy. malecontraceptives.org...

originally posted by: tadaman

By the way I have sex everyday, no birth control. No babies. Very fertile young couple. We just know the mechanics of REPRODUCTION. No need for abortions. If we mess up there is a pill for the morning after.

You're advocating birth control. Great!! I'm totally with you there. If you take care of things with birth control then there is no need for so many abortions. I fully support your thinking.

The problem is that a bunch of the Pro-Lifers are against that too. Mostly the Religious Pro-Lifers obviously but there is a significant number of them and they have a large voice in this.

They like to push Abstinence Only and no Sex Education and No Birth Control. That's not going to work and never has.

People like yourself, who are against Abortion should try and get them to support your way of thinking on the birth control thing. Why so many of them are against Abortion while also being against Birth Control has always seemed like a conflicting position for them to have. If they really want to have less Abortions happening they should be the loudest ones supporting Birth Control.

a reply to: Annee

The best Male birth control method I've heard of so far is the one where they inject some kind of gel into the vas defrans (sp?). They've had really good and lasting results so far on rabbits and I believe have started testing on humans now, again with great results.

Sticking a needle in to your sack is not a very comfortable idea obviously and I don't know the details on the procedure but the up side is that it only needs to be done once for effects of up to a year or more.

I think this is a great option once it's been tested and approved. It might be a bit of a hard sell because of how it's done for some. But it's nothing a really good Marketing Campaign couldn't solve IMO.

It would also take some of the weight of who's responsible from women and put it on men which is how it should be. As it is now, too many people view it as all the woman's fault and problem while totally excusing their male counterpart.

originally posted by: olaru12

originally posted by: Teikiatsu

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: InTheLight
a reply to: UKTruth

I wonder if the medical/scientific community could research if removing the embryo from the womb of a woman and having it complete its gestation period either in a test tube or a human surrogate, for people (biological father? grandparents? potential adoptive parents?) wanting to take on the responsibility?

Sounds like a promising development.

There are enough unwanted, unloved, uncared for LIVING CHILDREN in this world.

We don't need to grow more.

Kids need to be taught the consequences of having sex when they are not prepared for the inevitable outcome. Unfortunately they live in a sex-saturated society.

If we can as a culture start treating pre-marital sex the same as the transition of cigarette smoking from 'hip and cool' in the 50's to the anethema it has become today, it might be possible.

Right....

Social and cultural manipulation of Youth with raging testosterone, hormones, estrogen, and a myriad of other physical changes during puberty....


Good luck with that....!

You're right. Assuming the worst of kids and ignoring the problem is much better.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: Teikiatsu

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: LifeisGrand
a reply to: mOjOm

None of it is play. It is all real. You may brush it away, in your mind. But I will stand firm. And so will science.

Frankly, your opinion on the matter - - can blow in the wind. That's how much I care about you trying to take some moral high ground.

If its not OK with you, don't do it.

Just stay out of my way.

You sound like Trump. Bravo.

I am woman, hear me roar.

In a real life decision I had to make the choice.

The unborn women haven't been given the opportunity to roar, let alone cry for their mother.

Just sayin'

Your belief.

As long as your belief does not infringe on my legal right of choice, I don't care.

Belief? Try biology. It really doesn't care about your opinions.

Of course you have a choice. Don't have sex if you aren't ready to get pregnant. I'm not sure what the problem is. Does your reproductive system somehow go out looking for a loaded penis when you aren't paying attention?

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: tadaman
a reply to: Annee

Who decides when they are living?

Thats the freaking problem

Use birth control and dont have sex like it is not HUMAN MAKING!

If its healthy, there is no risk to a mothers health....there is no excuse to kill a human.

Abortion is legal.

Question answered.

So was slavery, at one time. There are quite a few parallels. Treating humans as property, legalization and dehumanization... heck there was even a SCOTUS ruling to keep them both legal.

originally posted by: mOjOm
a reply to: Annee

The best Male birth control method I've heard of so far is the one where they inject some kind of gel into the vas defrans (sp?). They've had really good and lasting results so far on rabbits and I believe have started testing on humans now, again with great results.

That's way more complicated than just keeping your pants on.

originally posted by: Teikiatsu
Of course you have a choice. Don't have sex if you aren't ready to get pregnant. I'm not sure what the problem is.

Really??? No recreational sex or sex simply for enjoyment is your brilliant advice???

I speak for probably every guy, ever, in saying what horrible advice that is. Because a planet full of women who only would have sex for procreation is a good idea???

I can't imagine or more stressed out world than that would create. Male aggression would skyrocket out of frustration.

originally posted by: Teikiatsu
That's way more complicated than just keeping your pants on.

Actually, you'd still have to take your pants off for this one. Unless you want them to just try and hit their target through your jeans. Personally, I'd rather them have a clear line of site when stabbing my sack with a needle to avoid repeated attempts.

It's not really to complicated either. It's done by a doctor not something you'd do yourself at home or anything.

Also, keeping your pants on isn't always that easy. What if you're in a relationship with someone you're attracted to??? Sex is a bonding thing for people. Sex for pleasure and especially in relationships is extremely important. It's also important psychologically in a social civil world. Men and Women are biologically driven by their sexual desires. Why would you want to repress that to the point of total abstinence other than procreation??? That's madness and totally unrealistic.

originally posted by: mOjOm
...Abstinence Only and no Sex Education and No Birth Control. That's not going to work and never has.

People like yourself, who are against Abortion should try and get them to support your way of thinking on the birth control thing. Why so many of them are against Abortion while also being against Birth Control has always seemed like a conflicting position for them to have. If they really want to have less Abortions happening they should be the loudest ones supporting Birth Control.

I'm not opposed to pro-active birth control or the morning after pill to prevent implantation.

But please tell me, when has abstinence ever not worked for humans, to avoid pregnancy?

Honestly, the best sex ed class I ever had was College Prep Biology. Our teacher spent an excessively long amount of time showing us genetic defects in newborns and side effects of pregnancy on women who were not ready for a kid.

originally posted by: mOjOm

originally posted by: Teikiatsu
Of course you have a choice. Don't have sex if you aren't ready to get pregnant. I'm not sure what the problem is.

Really??? No recreational sex or sex simply for enjoyment is your brilliant advice???

I speak for probably every guy, ever, in saying what horrible advice that is. Because a planet full of women who only would have sex for procreation is a good idea???

I can't imagine or more stressed out world than that would create. Male aggression would skyrocket out of frustration.

I think you have an incredibly low opinion of men.

But I did over-simplify.

Don't have sex irresponsibly if you aren't ready to get pregnant. But if you do get pregnant, abortion should not be treated as birth control. If you think you are mature enough to have sex, then you should be mature enough to accept the consequences of engaging in an activity designed to reproduce.

The idea of recreational sex is just... stupid. That's a massive problem with society.

a reply to: Teikiatsu

it might work great for avoiding pregnancy, but I have a feeling that it might not be that great for marriage and tranquility in some homes.

originally posted by: Teikiatsu
I'm not opposed to pro-active birth control or the morning after pill to prevent implantation.

Then that should be your primary argument. It's certainly the most likely to succeed in achieving your goal of less abortion.

But please tell me, when has abstinence ever not worked for humans, to avoid pregnancy?

Of course it works. I'm not denying that abstinence works. So does masturbation. But everyone already knows that. You don't have to tell anyone that or suggest it as an alternative. Because anyone can choose that for themselves anytime already.

But that excludes most people who actually want sex in their lives to some degree. If you want abstinence then you're not having that problem.

Honestly, the best sex ed class I ever had was College Prep Biology. Our teacher spent an excessively long amount of time showing us genetic defects in newborns and side effects of pregnancy on women who were not ready for a kid.

Yeah. I know what you mean. That does work. I've seen those medical pictures myself. In fact most medical pictures can be a strong argument for not doing certain things in life. It's a bit of a brutal method but for those that want some radical incentive that might be a way to go.

originally posted by: mOjOm
Also, keeping your pants on isn't always that easy. What if you're in a relationship with someone you're attracted to??? Sex is a bonding thing for people. Sex for pleasure and especially in relationships is extremely important. It's also important psychologically in a social civil world. Men and Women are biologically driven by their sexual desires. Why would you want to repress that to the point of total abstinence other than procreation??? That's madness and totally unrealistic.

Attitudes like that are what discourages teens from trying. "Don't bother, you're a slave to your hormones! You want to have sex, it's normal, don't fight it!"

Oddly, I never had premarital sex. And I've only ever had sex with one woman. How the heck is that possible?