Baptized

originally posted by: Heresiarch
a reply to: newnature1

I think believing and being baptized is a pretty fair deal and not asking a lot of the followers of Christ.

It's benefits of salvation and the gift of the Holy Spirit far outweigh any negativity one would attempt to attach to it. Calling it a work of law or not in line with the doctrine of grace is a fallacy and deprives one of the benefits of the Holy Spirit

I don't know if that is in line with what you believe or not. But that is what I believe.

The 12 apostles preached the reality of the resurrection of Jesus ‘the messiah’. The 12 apostles had preached the necessity of Jesus ‘the messiah’ being raised from among the dead, in order to sit on the throne of David in the promised kingdom.  Acts 1:4 - That promise had to do with being baptized with Yahweh’s energizing power from on high. This is not John the Baptizer’s baptism, this is a special identification of Yahweh’s power for the purpose of empowering those kingdom saints for the tribulation period at their doorstep and the millennial reign to come. Yahweh was in a very real sense giving Israel a taste of their promised earthly kingdom. Seven years stood between Israel and them gaining their earthly Kingdom. Paul taught what that resurrection meant to the Gentiles.

a reply to: newnature1

Jesus was baptized by John. He said believe and be baptized. If we follow his example and believe AND be baptized, with water AND the Spirit, yes it is the same baptism. There is baptism and not baptism. There are no special new baptism's other than water, the Spirit and fire. In that order. And they are all the same baptism.

a reply to: newnature1

What you are preaching is anti-scriptural, not what Jesus said or taught. I don't follow Paul, but even he said that baptism is a part of the plan.

Trying to re-define what Jesus meant and taught by re-defining baptism to suit your fancy is not going to fly with anyone who examines scripture. Baptism is water, Spirit and fire. All part of one baptism and if you take one out of the equation you lose all three.

originally posted by: Heresiarch
a reply to: newnature1

Jesus was baptized by John. He said believe and be baptized. If we follow his example and believe AND be baptized, with water AND the Spirit, yes it is the same baptism. There is baptism and not baptism. There are no special new baptism's other than water, the Spirit and fire. In that order. And they are all the same baptism.

This is the age of grace, what a ludicrous way for us to be thinking, placing ourselves back under the law for righteousness before God. The lunacy of desiring to be under the law, in order to perfect our righteousness in God’s sight.

originally posted by: Heresiarch
a reply to: newnature1

What you are preaching is anti-scriptural, not what Jesus said or taught. I don't follow Paul, but even he said that baptism is a part of the plan.

Trying to re-define what Jesus meant and taught by re-defining baptism to suit your fancy is not going to fly with anyone who examines scripture. Baptism is water, Spirit and fire. All part of one baptism and if you take one out of the equation you lose all three.

Is God requiring that we add our righteous works to Christ’s righteousness that we might become righteous indeed or is Christ’s righteousness the only righteousness from God’s perspective his saints will ever need. Pride insists upon attributing success to self, we are either under the jurisdiction of the law which requires performance for righteousness or we are under the jurisdiction of Jesus Christ and our identity in him is our righteousness, we can not have it both ways.

originally posted by: newnature1

originally posted by: Heresiarch
a reply to: newnature1

What you are preaching is anti-scriptural, not what Jesus said or taught. I don't follow Paul, but even he said that baptism is a part of the plan.

Trying to re-define what Jesus meant and taught by re-defining baptism to suit your fancy is not going to fly with anyone who examines scripture. Baptism is water, Spirit and fire. All part of one baptism and if you take one out of the equation you lose all three.

Is God requiring that we add our righteous works to Christ’s righteousness that we might become righteous indeed or is Christ’s righteousness the only righteousness from God’s perspective his saints will ever need. Pride insists upon attributing success to self, we are either under the jurisdiction of the law which requires performance for righteousness or we are under the jurisdiction of Jesus Christ and our identity in him is our righteousness, we can not have it both ways.

I don't know about any of the gibberish you spew. I know that being baptized is of water, Spirit and fire, and that Jesus himself taught it as necessary to salvation.

You sound like you're trying to keep others from receiving the Spirit. If you tell people that baptism is not a part of salvation, you are contradicting Jesus.

Unless one believes AND is baptized...

Doesn't mean: "unless one believes in the doctrine of grace"

By saying that baptism is somehow not a part of Jesus' plan is as good as redacting whole sections of scripture.

If Jesus didn't want people to get baptized, he would not have said " be baptized" but he did.

But if you don't want the Holy Spirit that is fine with me.

a reply to: newnature1

If one claims to be a follower of Christ, yet is unwilling to do an act of the utmost simplicity such as " believe AND be baptized", which is not asking much and comes with the benefits of salvation and wisdom, I find it of the utmost hypocrisy to call yourself a Christian. All Jesus is asking is not much when it comes down to it, simply, believe and be baptized. Receive the Holy Spirit.

But I guess that's asking too much.

a reply to: Heresiarch

Why are you posing as a disciple of Christ, Metatron???
Why is it so important that you attack the Bible from every possible angle? Do you think we're too stupid to see through your fake account.

Baptism seems to be a totally misunderstood tradition. Before John the Baptist, it was a daily purity ritual of the Qumran Nazarenes and Zadikkim. After Jesus it became the method of transmission of the Holy Spirit upon the recipient of the baptism.

This is what it means to be born again. Gone is the ignorance and darkness and you are now in the light. The Truth is yours to discover if you have faith in God and not in any man. Your teacher is the Holy Spirit now.