This is in reponse to all of the unfounded criticism and misconceptions on Sanksrit and ancient Indian atomic theory. I will also discuss even further
proofs that support my proposition that there is absolute proof of an advanced ancient Indian civilization.
Will Durant - “India is the mother of our race and Sanskrit the mother of European languages. Sanskrit was the mother of our modern philosophy.
Sankrit is not a secret, alien, language. That is simply not the case, and if this was not true, there would not be thousands of sanskrit scholars in
the world. Sasnkrit is actually an easy language to learn and there exists several dictionaries for it. Further, Sanskrit was not lost, and nor were
the treaties on science and physics. If they were lost, I would not be able to produce them. Ancient Indians have been able to preserve their culture,
sciences and heritage against all odds, despite repeated invasions, internal corrosion, looting and pillaging by greeks, romans, arabs and europeans
for centuries. However, in this process, knowledge of them were lost. It is fortunate that there still exists enough records to re-learn them.
Further, Sankrit texts have suffered at the hands of white-supremist, racists translators who have only deliberately mistranslated the texts.
In the vedic times, knowledge was dictated in oral form, not written form. It was only the Maharishis that penned their knowledge. It was not that
writing did not exist, it's just that ancient Indian schooling was so advanced that they could remember their lessons by memory. This may sound like
a seemingly impossible feat of human intelligence. However, it is known, that memory can be trained and certain people have the ability to completely
memorize entire books. I recall the case of a 7 year old who had commited to memory the entire Koran and could recall any verse.
Sanskrit is recognized as the mother language of all Indo-European languages. It is the most advanced ancient language in existence, some even
say(forbes) the most advanced language today. In 700 BC Yasaka wrote on book on etymology and in 500BC, Panini compiled a treatise on grammer. They
both attribute their sources to vedic times.
You can see how English words can be traced to their sankrit roots:
Manu the first person gives us man, manual, manhood.
Pitru gives rise to pater, father
Matru to mother;
Bhratru to brother
Dohitru to daughter.
Devapitru - the godfather becomes Zeuspater and then Jupiter.
Timir the darkness is to be feared and gives rise to timid and timorous. Janma, Janani are birth and mother who gives birth and from it stem gene,
Mrut, Mrutyu are dead and death and hence mortis, mortal, mortality. Sarpa is to slide or slither like a snake, so serpent and serpentine.
Madhu, Madhur are honey and sweet and from them we get mead and mellitus.
Gnana is the basis of spelling knowledge with a K, and hence gnosis, Gnostic and ignorant.
Agni is fire and hence the English words ignite, ignition, igneous.
Raaj is rule and from it come regis, reign, royal, regina, regal, ragnar.
Sthaan, Sthit, Sthiti meaning position, stable and condition, give rise to stand, stance, state, static.
Vijaya becomes vici and then victory and invincible.
Yoga, Yukta give yoke
Bandha, Bandhan are the root of bind, bound, boundary, bond and binding.
Pada gives root to podia, podiatry, peddle, pedlar.
Surya - Sun
Akasha - Air
Naas is to Nose and Nasal
Danta is to teeth/tooth and the origin of dental, dentine and dent
Rudra is red and from it comes rubro, ruby and ultimately red
BARBARA, "barbarian, one with long hair" (BARBER)
The Sankrit numbers(2-10) Dwi, Tri, Chatur, Pancha, Shat, Sapta, Ashta, Nava, Dasha
The numbers in other language, there is only some interchangability:
The Hindi numbers: Ek, Do, Tin, Char, Panja, che, sat, aat, nuo, das
The French numbers: Une, Deux, Trois, Quatre(catre), cinq, six, sept, huit, neuf, dix
The German numbers: eins, zwei, drei, vier, fünf, sechs, sieben, acht, neun, zehn
The Latin numbers: unus, duo, tres, quattuor, quinque, sex, septem, octo, novem
Hindi is the first descendent of Sanskrit and English is a much later one:
Manu - Manav - Man
Pitha - Pitah - Pither - Father
Mutra - Matra - Mother
Gnana - Gyana - Gnosis
Agni - Aag - Ignite
Vijaya - Vijay - Victory
Surya - Suraj - Sun
Bhratu - Bhai - Brother
So, all sankrit words can be translated by comparing it to other Indo-European languages, especially Hindi and comparing it to known Sankrit docments.
As I said Sankrit is not an unknown language. It is the master language in fact.
Ancient Indian atomic theory
There is no wrong way to catagorize elements. Not all cultures in the universe would catagorize them by their atomic number in a periodic table like
mendeleevs. To only accept this kind of catagorization is fundamentalism, and oh, it's more intellectual arrogance. Moreover, it is maybe our own
elemental theory that is lesser developed than the Indian one. If only matter is an element, then what is light and energy? Modern science has
propounded many theories on light and energy, where they are either waves, particles, or a particle-wave duality. However, according to quantum
mechanics, energy is comprised of discreet multiples, or photons, tiny packets of quanta, or particles of light. We cannot observe them, but that does
not mean that they do not exist. If light was not made of particles then certain quantum mechanical effects would not exist, like the photoelectric
n the end the physical universe is physical, all that exists within it, has physicality. We assume that energy has no mass, because we cannot observe
it, however if energy has no mass, why does it have finite speed. If energy has no mass, why does it condense to form mass? There is no explanation of
this, other than a magic higgs field that turns on and matter forms.
In multidimensional QM theory, such as superstring, the universe is not 3D. Relativity only works in the 3D universe. QM effects like quantum
entanglement does not occur in the 3D universe and henceforth have infinite speed. Perhaps, relative to a higher dimensional universe, QE is finite
speed. So all of the physical universe is duality.
This is the crux of ancient Indian metaphysics which accords with modern quantum mechanics, in particular the holographic theory of the universe. That
is that the physical universe is is a dual-existence, and therefore an illusion of the absolute existence or the absolute reality, the Brahman. In
ancient India all technology was called "maya" which means "illusion" so while ancient Indians were an advanced scientific civilization, they were
also a spiritual one. Unlike our western civilization, technology was not an imperative, end all and be all of life. It was used as a means, not an
end, to their spiritual growth.
Today, we are experiencing the same transformation from physical to the metaphysical thought - from NM and GR to QM. Further showing that relative to
Ancient Indian civilization, we are a developing civilization.
I actually think the Indian catagorization of the elements is a far more advanced view of the physical universe. It accounts for the main states of
matter, solid, liquids and gas, as well as energy and light and the vacuum field. The western view of only saying matter is that which only has mass,
thus only matter is an element, is very lopsided and also inaccurate. Matter is that, that occupies space-time. Does light and energy not occupy space
Ancient Indian atomic theory was an empirical science, not just a theoretical science. Kanada simply systematized the knowledge from the vedic times
in his vaisheShika sUtras in 600BC(2600 years ago) Here is a detailed and complete look at his postulations.
All elements that comprise the physical universe, except ether, are made up of atoms
All substances are a combination of atoms
Force is that which displaces, holds together or moves things apart.
In the absence of a force, a particle of matter experiences no change.
The forces to be considered are an external force, gravity, that with causes attraction of particles, that which causes repulsion of particles and the
internal movements of them in matter.
Action is opposed by an equivalent opposite reaction
The diversities of the movement of an arrow are due to the consecutive changes in the components of the acting forces. The stored energy provides the
propulsion to the arrow and this causes it move further to a high point. This component keeps reducing while that of gravity increases resulting in
The force on a body is the resultant of gravity and the work done against it.
Once the work against gravity ceases then the body reaches an energy-less state falling under gravity.
In the absence of all forces the Samyoga binding(gravity) still exists.
The guna(direction of force) prevents the magnitude from being obtained.
The nature of air is formed of the collision of gases.
Despite of being made of atoms and occupying space, air fails to show orderly movement, so it's form cannot be perceived.
Solid's occupy space and assume form because of a coglomeration of constituent particles.
In a liquid the particles possess energy, the heat bearing rays provide the particles the energy to form and rise into gas.
Some substances, like tin, gold, wax and ghee are in reality liquids conjoined by "heat" once they are supplied with heat energy they are disordered
and they become liquid.
A substance cannot arise from nothing, it is formed from other substances and it's properties change.
A Dwinuka(binary molecule) retains the propeties/individuality of it's parent atoms.
Any fundamental entity can be a constituent of multiple substances.
Any substance comprising of two or more particle types requires a chemical reaction to generate it - the conjoining or breaking of pre-existing
Forces are necessary to combine atoms or break bonds.
The combinations of particles that form Dwinukas results in substances that have very different states of matter from the original.
The mind can only be explained as being made of particles
Space and time are only a frame within which matter exists.
Space and time is particular in nature, like gas, and is also made up of constituents particles.
An unseen force adR^isShTam is responsible for the movement of a needle or bead(magentism)
Matter and energy are two forms of the same substance and are therefore interchangable
Ancient Indians from 5000 to 10,000 years ago, understood atomic theory, relativity, magnetism, newtonian mechanics and quantum mechanics that even
surpasses our own understanding. It seems evident that at least at an abstract level they understood sub-atomic physics. We know, that as soon as man
conceptualized the atom and understood chemical and atomic theory, it was not long before he split the atom and discovered nuclear energy. All those
prerequisites are present in ancient Indian science.
Further, calculating the exact speed of light(a process which itself requires lasers and modern measuring equipment) discovering the nature of atoms
and chemistry was obviously not an abstract form of thought. It was an empirical science that they utilised.
We have evidence in terms of the records describing advanded technology in a practical and empirical manner and the general anecdotes from all the
world of advanced technology. We have evidence of modern scientists designing new technology and materials using ancient Indian texts. There is even
evidence of irradiated cities, vitrified rocks and gobules of glass that suggest nuclear weapons.
Finally, there actually existing structures from thousands of years ago that prove advanced atomic and chemical knowledge. A case in point: The
corrision proof Iron pillar of Delhi more than 1,600 years ago. There was no corrosion proof metallurgical technology until stainless steel in the
One of the criticism raised that because Indian elemental theory called water an element and Kanada said that all elements could subdivided, that it
was not understood that water is a molecule of hydrogen and oxygen. It has already been shown from Kanada postulates that he understood the nature of
air to be formed of a mixture of gases and that liquid become a gas when provided enough energy. He also understood that substances can be made of
other substances and have different properties from the original.
The major appehension was Kanada's postulate that a dwinuka will take on the properties/individuality of the parent particles. This suggests that
Kanada understood chemical bonding and resultant properties beyond modern chemistry. However, it is very easy to prove: a different combinaton(that is
possible) would give a different substance with different properties. For example H20 is neutral and H2SO4 is acidic. CO2(carbon dixoide) is non
poisonous, but CO is poisonous. Just the addition of a single oxygen atom makes CO non toxic. So, there is an inherentlproperty from each atom that
forms the emergent properties of the combined molecule.
So chemistry is very much like human reproduction, which in itself is bio-chemistry. Where the parents genes are passed on to the offspring and from
which the characteristics are determined.
Now to further prove that ancient Indians did indeed know that water was indeed made UP of Hydrogen Oxygen and knew how to apply it. We can consult
i]Agastya Samhita from the vedic times. The Agatya Samhita is another sanskrit treatise on flying aircraft and energy generation. However, this
time, it does not discuss advanced flying machines. It discusses a hydrogen balloon, called "chchatra" (umbrella or balloon) to be filled with
hydrogen by extracting hydrogen from water with electrolysis. It describes it as a very primitive vimana to be used to escape from a city.
The process of extracting the Hydrogen, as well as the construction of a dry-cell batttery is described very elaborately:
Place a well-cleaned copper plate in an earthenware vessel.
Cover it first by copper sulfate and then moist sawdust.
After that put a mercury-amalgamated-zinc sheet on top of
an energy known by the twin name of Mitra-Varuna. Water will
be split by this current into Pranavayu and Udanavayu. A
chain of one hundred jars is said to give a very active
and effective force."
ÄÄ Agastya Samhita
(Indian Princes' Library)
Pranavayu = oxygen air
Udanayayu = Hydrogen air(upwards air)
Mitra-Varuna = Cathode and Anode(friends of water)
An actual dry-cell battery was found in Baghdad 2000 years old. It is clay jar with a stopper made of asphalt. Sticking through the asphalt is an iron
rod surrounded by a copper cylinder. When filled with vinegar - or any other electrolytic solution - the jar produces about 1.1 volts. Scientists
believe it was used for electroplating.
Ancient Indian cosmology
Ancient Indian cosmology is the most advanced of all ancient cultures, and some of the theories even foreshadow modern cosmological theories. Some
aspects of ancient Indian cosmology is even new for modern science, such as the cyclical or oscillating universe and the many worlds hypothesis. In
western civilization as late as 19th century scientists could not think of the age of the universe/earth multiple powers of tens. When western
scientists were thinking of the universe as 6000 years old and finite and the earth as flat. Indians were dividing time into eons and ages and the
universe into galaxies and mapping out the solar system. Yet, thousands of years ago, Indians were measuring time and distances in billions and
trillions and even understood creation, evolution and microbiology. The following illustrates this:
Evolution and microbiology:
The first germ of life was developed by water and heat. Man will traverse the universe, gradually ascending and passing through the rocks, the plants,
the worms, insects, fish, serpents, tortoises, wild animals, cattle, and higher animals. These are the transformations declared, from the plant to
Brahma, which have to take place in the world."
' (Manusmriti - Book I, sloka 8,9)
' Water ascends towards the sky in vapors; from the sun it descends in rain, from the rains are born the plants, and from the plants, animals.'
(Manusmriti - Book III, sloka 76)
Man has passed through 84 lakhs (8,400,000) of birth as plants, animals, as an "inferior species of man" and then as the ancestor of the developed
type existing to-day - a thought held in ancient India and also propounded by Sikh Gurus.
The Heliocentric model of the solar system
Ancient Indians had none of the absurdities in early western scientific civilization, like; flat earth; humans being the centre of the universe and
the sun revolving around the earth. From as early as the beginning of Indian civilization in recorded history. Indians knew that the earth was an
imperfect sphere, that revolved around the sun due to gravity, and the sun itself was a star. Not only that they, they also knew that about the
The Sun does never set nor rise. When people think the Sun is setting (it is not so). For after having arrived at the end of the day it makes itself
produce two opposite effects, making night to what is below and day to what is on the other side…Having reached the end of the night, it makes
itself produce two opposite effects, making day to what is below and night to what is on the other side. In fact, the Sun never sets….” Aitareya
Markandeya Purana (54.12) speaks of Earth as being flattened at the poles and bulging at the equator, that is, not perfectly spherical.
Again, as was the case with atomic theory, this is not just theoretical or philosophical thought. While, Kanada systematized the science of atomic
theory in the vedic times. Gravitational theory was systematized under science of astronomy and gravitation in Surya Siddhantha in 400AD(1600 years
An ancient Sanskrit couplet also contemplates the idea of multiple suns:
"Sarva Dishanaam, Suryaham Suryaha, Surya."
"There are suns in all directions, the night sky being full of them,"
The Laya Yoga Samhita stated that just as the beams of sunlight entering a room reveal the presence of innumberable motes, so infinite space is filled
with countless brahmandas (universes).
The word "Brahmandas" is interesting. It means universe, however the individual constituents of the word, Brah and Andas, mean expanding egg. So the
the universes in the superverse are expanding eggs. The expanding universe was only discovered when Hubble measured the red-shift in the universe.
Ancient Indian Mathematics
The concept of infinite sets of rational numbers was understood by Jain 2600 years ago. Algebra, geometry, logarithims, trigonometry, and calculus
were all originated in India."Bakhshali manuscript", 70 leaves of bark dating back 500AD reveals fractions, simultaneous equations, quadratic
equations, geometric progressions.
The Sulba Sutras, composed between 800 and 500 B.C foreshadow pythagoras theorem and shows the square root of 2 has two solutions - correct to five
decimal system. The Kerala mathematician Nilakantha wrote sophisticated explanations of the irrationality of "pi" before the West had heard of the
Ancient Indian Computer Science
We know that binary numbers are the essential mathematics for the digital age and the computer. The Pingala's "Chandahshastra" was a treatise
written on music. Pingala constructs a "Prastara" or a matrix of binary number. The treatise also describes how to convert decimal numbers to their
binary equivalent. This was discovered by B van Nooten of the university of California. Ancient Indians had also found mathematical techniques to
present text as binary numbers.
It was noted by forbes magazine that Panini is the most suitable language for computers. It described the rules of grammar as described in the Panini
Sutra to be as advanced(if not more) as Backus-Naur Form in Syntax of Formal Languages". Bakus was developed in 1970's by IBM. An article was also
published by AI magazine in 1985 where a NASA scientist proposed Panini should be used to develop high-level languages for computers and robots.
Here is the article: www.aaai.org...
Note: Requires Adobe Acrobat Reader
So if Sankrit is indeed the most advanced language for computers and systems to represent texts with binary numbers existed. And as we have learnt
that principles of atomic thoery was known. Then all prerequisites for developing a computer exist. So are there any records of computers in ancient
Yes, as a matter of fact there is. Not just computers, but aritifial intelligence:
Artificial intelligence was known as a yantra-purusa, which means machine-man. A machine man was described as human-like. There are many accounts of
artifiicial intelligence in sankrit documents. As usual, they belonged to the elite or acharyas and maharihsis, however they were also used in the
military. Some accounts:
In the Buddhistic Bhaisajya-vastu, in which a painter went to the Yavana country and visited the home of a yantracarya, or teacher of mechanical
engineering. There he met a machine-girl who washed his feet and seemed human, until he found that she could not speak.
A robot palace guard stands at the gate with a sword, ready to "quickly and quietly kill thieves who break into the palace at night.
A complete city of mechanical people, presided over by a human being who manipulates them from a control center in his palace.
All the divya(celestial) aastras in the Mahabharata worked on the basis of artificial intelligence and psychotronic means. The weapons could be
summoned by thought and a "mantra" a sort of password was recited and they would materialise. They would be then directed at the target and then
fired and they would seek out their target and unleash the effects they are associated with.
In the often quoted battle between Salva. Krishna deploys a special weapon that seeks out sound(the weapon has it's own intelligence) While Salva
Vimana was cloaked, it had not blocked out the transmission of sound from the two Danava soliders that were piloting the air craft and screaming
taunts and insults. Krsna then dealt with them as follows: "I quickly laid on an arrow, which killed by seeking out sound, to kill them, and the
screeching subsided. All the Danavas who had been screeching lay dead, killed by the blazing sunlike arrows that were triggered by sound."
Now, it is fairly obvious the weapon had it's own intelligence and is not just a weapon with sensors. In a battlefield there would be sound
everywhere. So how does the missile distinguish between the sound of Salva's Vimanas and the sound of everything else? It would have to be
Ancient India was certainly a very advanced and sophiticated civilization. It is normally believed that technological development is a linear
progression. However, the truth seems to the opposite. Everything begins to degrade from the Indian civilization of 10,000+ years ago. We can see from
how IE languages devolved from the original master language.
A summary of the facts raised in this post and others.
A scientific understanding of atomic theory, relativity, newtonian mechanics and quantum theory
An understanding of binary nunbers and hashing algorithms for converting text to binary
An understanding of cyclic universe, multiple world theory, holograhic universe and the expanding universe(red shifts)
An understanding of the heliocentric model of the universe
An understanding of evolution and microbiology
An understanding of the exact speed of light and light as a particle
An understanding of the exact age of the Earth
An understanding of algerba, calculus, trigonometry, quadratic and simultaneous equations, geometric progressions etc
A practical knowledge of electricity, electrolysis and hydrogen airships
A practical knowledge of corrosion proof metallurgy
A practical knowledge of medicine and advanced surgery(including cataracts, plastic and brain surgery)
A language with such advanced grammar and syntax that it is suitable as a computer language for artificial intelligence.
A language that is the mother of Indo-European languages.
All the prerequisite understanding for advanced technology like computers, nuclear weapons, flight and lasers is present. Is there any reason why
they could not progress that far? It took western civilization only a century to go from horse-driven carriages to space rockets. I reiterate that
there is no doubt that this is a very advanced civilization. This advanced and sophisticated civilization calls the Ramayana and Mahabharata history,
and we know that the Mahabharata does indeed have basis in history.
We can further corrobortate that the kind of technology described in the Mahabharat is described in other sankrit texts too.
The flying aircraft and wonderos technology becomes a natural progression allowed by the advanced state of ancient Indian science. Finally, we can
refer back to the VS that describes all the yantras and materials in a high level of technical depth. The fact that Indian scientists have been able
to fabricate technology from directions in the VS, and considering again, the fact that Indian science was advanced enough to progress to this
technology, I submit that this is absolute proof that a more advanced Indian civilization existed.
I asked in another thread recently "Will Humanity become a Myth?" Well, yes, if the future inhabitants of this planet are as ignorant and arrogant
[edit on 15-1-2005 by Indigo_Child]