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Freemasonry and the Occult

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posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 04:14 AM
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Dear Editor you can't discuss the article if you can't read it. If I had wanted to post a url (the article is on a number of websites, which you obviously did not know) I would have. If you want to edit some pointless posts then why don't you have the guts to "edit" some of the Freemasons repetitive boilerplate? Perhaps you are one yourself.


Freemasonry and the 20th Century Occult Revival

By David Carrico

www.freemasonrywatch.org...

Bandit: removed cut/paste text and added link to source.

[edit on 12-1-2005 by TheBandit795]




posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 04:40 AM
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TG...obviously you've done considerable homework prior to posting this report on the various contemporary occultists. There are many which could be added to this list as well (ie Robert Graves and Colin Wilson), because they too had a great impact on the revival of occultism in the last century.

Even great lights such as Carl Jung can be discussed in this context. My only regret is not having the time this morning to get into the discussion.

Altogether quite a read that should bring interesting responses.



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 06:04 AM
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I think that this is a case of "if you post enough bull#, you can hope people will believe you".

Nealy every one of the subjects posted below has been discussed before.
All have been refuted.

You've just gotta love the way that the guy posts "evidence" that concerns societies that aren't Freemasonry and tries to make it look like they are Freemasonry so he can strengthen his case.

My opinion? A lot of work has gone into writing this, but no actual thoght.



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 06:06 AM
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Freemasonry is an occult secret society and all Freemasons have aligned themselves with the occult. This is the obvious conclusion that people with just a casual knowledge of the lodge are forced to realize.

That’s the problem, a casual knowledge is not good enough. People with a casual knowledge of Christinity cwill conclude it is a contradictory faith used to control the masses with the illusion of an after life on the parables told by an occult leader that were then written down by others many years later and turned commercial.
The casually learned are very seldom correct.

the word occult means deliberately kept hidden: not revealed to others

Then Christianity is also an occult.


Freemasonry: The Devil's Playground

Anton LaVey, the High Priest of the Church of Satan states:

"...Masonic orders have contained the most influential men in many governments, and virtually every occult order has many Masonic roots. (3)

Meaning people have copied the way Freemasonry works for their own groups, organisations. Why try to think of a whole new way of making the wheel, if there is already a working model.


Freemasonry is not just an occult secret society. Freemasonry has served for over two hundred years as a fertile recruiting ground for other occult orders.

Not voluntarily though. Even masonries greatest critics acknowledge that this was done by infiltration not co-operation.

Men who have come together to practice Masonry have many times down through the years formed other organizations to plunge even deeper into the occult.

Many of the men who have set up occult organisations have only “claimed” to be Freemasons, and many have been proven fraudulent.



The Illuminati

According to our research, the first group that used the Masonic lodge for their evil designs was the infamous Bavarian Illuminati. This secret society was officially formed by Adam Weishaupt, professor of Canon Law at Ingolstadt University, on May 1, 1776. As the evil plans of the Illuminati began to leak out, brave men took a stand and raised their voices in protest.


What was the extent of Adam’s connection with Freemasonry? A quick search here will give you your answers
Many of the men who took a stand would have been Freemasons as the Illuminati were one of the organisations to Infiltrate Freemasonry.
To quote a well know critic Mr David Ike “the Illuminati infiltrated the ranks of Freemasonry to aid in the recruitment of members” www.davidicke.com




Helena Petrovna Blavatsky

The woman heralded as the 'Mother' of the modern New Age Movement is Helena Petrovna Blavatsky, 1831-1891. Blavatsky was born in Russia and was known for her violent temper and her ability to swear in several languages. This behavior was no doubt intensified as a result of her drug addiction to Hashish. She traveled all over the world lecturing and practicing the occult but her greatest impact by far was through her writings.

A drug addict always makes the most reliable source, though I was the only one who realised this.


Her most famous book, The Secret Doctrine, is one of the foundational occult works of all time. Her preeminently wicked book made no distinction between the serpent and the God of the Bible and taught that Satan was the one that made man into a god:

"Once that the key to Genesis is in our hands, the scientific and symbolical Kabalah unveils the secret. The Great Serpent of the garden of Eden and the Lord God are identical, . . .(6)
"Thus Satan, once he ceases to be viewed in the superstitious, dogmatic, unphilosophical spirit of the Churches, grows into the grandiose image of one who makes of a terrestrial, a divine Man; (7)

So because a women, who cannot be Freemason, who cannot know what Freemasonry is as it’s kept secret as you have previously mention, has mentioned the possibility that the God and Satan are the same equates to an argument that Freemasonry is an Occult





The Theosophical Society

Blavatsky's 'Secret Doctrine' and the organization she helped to found, the Theosophical Society, has certainly had an impact on our culture. 'Secret Doctrine' was the first book that Sirhan Sirhan requested after he was jailed for the murder of Robert Kennedy. Adolph Hitler kept a copy of The Secret Doctrine at his beside and was profoundly influenced by it. Adolf Hitler was a disciple of Madame Blavatsky, and was initiated into the meaning of her secret doctrines.

Again I do not see the relevance to Freemasonry, she is not one, I don’t believe Sirhan Sirhan was one, Hitler definitely wasn’t one as his regime he and his officers persecuted Freemasonry almost as bad as Jews. Although he did admire the fraternities achievements and tried to reproduce it in his Nazis parties.


This favorite book of Adolph Hitler's was also a favorite of 'Freemasonry's greatest Philosopher,' 33rd degree Mason Manly P. Hall

So because they read the same book… Puts me on the same level and grouping as the pope then. Cool.



Blavatsky's organization, The Theosophical Society, was founded in 1875. Freemason, Henry Steel Olcott was the president, with Freemason, George H. Felt as vice president, and high ranking American Mason, Charles Sothern as a member. Also among the early members was the most powerful American Mason of all time, Albert Pike, Grand Commander of the Scottish Rite.

Don’t forget Freemasonry isn’t only in America for one, and the actions of a few members of a fraternity containing millions does not denote the origins or intentions of said organistations.
If it did I would not of spent weeks defending the fact that religion was an organisation that helped child molesters get their hands on children.




Annie Besant and The Theosophical Society

In 1907, Annie Besant became the head of the Theosophical Society. Besant continued Blavatsky's love for Masonry by becoming a leader and earning the 33rd degree in Co-Masonry, an order with rites that admitted omen as well as men.

If it admits women it is not Freemasonry, which you even state your self with Co-Masonry, so any further info isn’t regarding Freemasonry



C.W. Leadbeater and The Theosophical Society

During the time Annie Besant was head of the Theosophical Society she labored to promote a young man from India, Jiddu Krishnamurti, as the Messiah. Her right hand man in this endeavor was 33rd degree Mason, C.W. Leadbeater. This Freemason had a passionate desire for the deeper workings of the occult. Some sources claim Leadbeater was a pedophile homosexual. (11)

Covered this already. Actions of one do not denote actions for all, else religion would be classed the same.


When the dark side of Freemasonry begins to be revealed and discussed, the question invariably arises: Does participation in Masonic rituals lead to demon invasion and control?

You would have to prove demon invasion and control first, I believe Exorcisms were outlawed by the church for a reason.

C.W. Leadbeater answers that question for us most decisively from an insiders point of view. Leadbeater does more than give an affirmative answer to our question. He proceeds to describe the demon spirits he received in the various degrees of Freemasonry:

"The 30th degree…

Rituals are of a parable nature, as is the scriptures of the bible. Interpretations are a personal thing, and there is no one correct answer.



Alice A. and Foster Bailey

Alice A. Bailey was the reigning 'queen' of The New Age movement until her death in the 1970's. She wrote over twenty books with the help of her spirit guide, the Tibetan master Dwjhal Khul. Mrs. Bailey spoke plainly and truthfully about the fact that the Masonic lodge was the training school for the leaders of the occult world. Alice A. Bailey said of Freemasonry:

"It is a far more occult organization than can be realized, and is intended to be the training school for the coming advanced occultists. (15)

I thought according to an earlier source that Freemasonry and New Age went hand in hand. Which source would you like to be considered the correct one.


Aleister Crowley: Father of Modern Satanism


Alister Crowley was not a Freemason. Do a search, just on ATS you will find a very information post by a member called Masonic Light that will give you the answer to exactly Alister was and why he was not a Freemason and was not initiated into Freemasonry.




Rosicrucian Society

As we continue our study of Freemasonry and the occult, we need to look at another secret order that has networked with Freemasonry for many years, the Rosicrucian Society. Much could be written about the various Rosicrucian orders and their relationship to the lodge, but for the purpose of our study we will be mentioning only one; the Rosicruciana in Anglia. One had to be at least a Master Mason to belong to this organization

Many organisations requested this so they themselves did not have to go through a vetting system, doesn’t mean Freemasonry was apart of it in reality. Many members or former members set up their own groups, or were involved in, a adopted some of the Masonic traits. Again doesn’t mean that are definitely linked and are working together.

It was not a Masonic Lodge but an esoteric society of Freemasons who were interested in occultism, the Kabbalah in particular, and Masonic symbolism.

So first it is masonry, now it isn’t. Now it is freemasons who have an interest in something a create a separate group of people with similar interests.



All three of the original founders of the Golden Dawn were Freemasons: Dr. William Wynn Westcott, Dr. William Woodman, and S.L. MacGregor Mathers.

Again the actions of the few do not make the norm for the Fraternity.

As we shall see, the ties between the Golden Dawn and the Masonic lodge go much deeper than the fact that all were Freemasons. Dr. William Wynn Westcott's interests were occultism and Freemasonry. In order to practice ritual magic he established an occult secret society called the Golden Dawn in London in 1888. Since its founding it has been one of the most secretive and influential of all occult orders.

Then the problem should be with them not Freemasonsry.


Madam Blavatsky was so excited about the existence of the Golden Dawn that she made an intriguing announcement calling the order 'The Hermetic Students of the G.D. in the Outer' in the June 1889 issue of her Theosophical periodical, Lucifer. (35)

Another group created by the inspiration of another, anyone else seeing a pattern here.


World renown witches, Janet and Stewart Farrar, authors of A Witches Bible Compleat, give credit to the Freemasons of the Golden Dawn for the modern cult explosion that we are experiencing today. They state:…

The credit is given to the Golden Dawn group, not Freemasons. It concludes that the group was set up by Freemasons, not Freemasonry. Talk about read what you wanna read.


Dr. William Wynn Westcott

William Wynn Westcott was a London coroner who was forced to choose between his job and the Golden Dawn

Again this is Golden Dawn not Freemasonry.


Westcott also worked closely with Theodor Reuss, the head of the O.T.O.. Since their early existence, the O.T.O. and the Golden Dawn have maintained close ties. The father of modern Satanism, Aleister Crowley, was a member of both organizations.

Quite possible true but not of interest as it doesn’t include Freemasonry and as mentioned before Alister was not a legitimate Freemason, but an impostor.






S.L. MacGregor Mathers

The last of the original founders of the Golden Dawn that we will be discussing is S.L. MacGregor Mathers, who was heralded at the turn of the last century as the most powerful and gifted occult practitioner in the world. Mathers was initiated into Freemasonry on Oct. 4, 1877 and became a Master Mason on January 30, 1878.

Mathers took Aleister Crowley and taught him what he needed to know to go on to become the father of modern Satanism. All did not remain peaceful between Mathers and Crowley and as the rivalry increased they actually engaged in a war of Black Magic. Mathers would receive instructions from 'Secret Chiefs' whom Mathers claimed were human beings with superhuman powers.

Again Golden Dawn, Alister Crowley and to spice things up a bit of black magic. Freemasonry doesn’t teach Magic, it teaches ethics and morality through geometry and parables of the working tools and workers of ancient times, ie masons.



Mathers wrote what was called Mathers Manifesto , a pledge of blind obedience to these 'Secret Chiefs'. The Manifesto stated:

That’s lovely, but there are no secret chiefs in Freemasonry.


[ mainfesto continued
"he must further pledge himself to obey in everything the commands of the aforesaid Secret Chief's 'perinde ac cadaver', body and soul, without question and without argument whether their commands related to magical action in the external world, or to psychic world, military action in the external world, or to psychic action in other worlds and planes, whether Angelic, spiritual or demonic

Is nothing AGAIN to do with Freemasonry, seeing as the constitutions that ALL masons must abide by to be masons states that a man should obey, first his god, then his crown, then the law of his land, then his wife/family and then Freemasonry.


Arthur Edward Waite

Another man who was initiated into the Golden Dawn at Mathers' home was Arthur Edward Waite. Waite proceeded to become a major force, not only in the occult world, but also in Freemasonry. Waite was praised by one of the greatest Masonic authorities of all time in one of the most popular Masonic books ever written, The Builders, by Joseph Fort Newton. The following is an excerpt of the tribute to A.E. Waite in The Builders:

"Perhaps the greatest student in this field of esoteric teaching and method, certainly the greatest now living, is Arthur Edward Waite, to whom it is a pleasure to pay tribute. (40)
Waite was more than a Freemason; he was an authority on Freemasonry and was the author of A New Encyclopedia of Freemasonry. Waite is also the author of such occult titles as, The Book of Black Magic, and Devil Worship in France. The Book of Black Magic by Waite contains terrible conjurations given in the name of Satan and has spells to conjure Lucifer.
Another of Waite's book is called, The Holy Kabbalah, which states in its introduction, "For the Kabbalist the ultimate sacrament is the sexual act, carefully organized and sustained as the most perfect mystical trance. (41)

So am I to presume because this gentleman has written books on two topics, the two topics are actually working together and are linked without doubt.


Perhaps you are beginning to realize the connections between the Golden Dawn and Freemasonry are many.

More like stretched to be honest.

The Golden Dawn was not only founded by Freemasons

Well that definitely means that the global fraternity of Freemasonry, containing millions of members, with commanding lodges in every state and country is in agreement with a few members who probably only 0.000001% of the then fraternity knew and of the now fraternity less have even heard of. Guess I was wrong to defend Christianity as a paedophilic organisations then was I?

but we can also document that in the early stages of the Golden Dawn it had a helping hand from the lodge….

Seems to me the problem is still with Golden Dawn and you just reel Freemasonry into the same due to some connections. That kind of thought would bring back racial segregation you know.


One of the early members of the Golden Dawn, Maud Gonne MacBride, left the organization after finding out about the Masonic Connections of the order.

This doesn’t state she left because of the link with Freemasonry, it just say she was summond to Free-masons hall. Talk about twisting the paragraphs.


It is indeed hard to disagree with the conclusion of our witch experts, Janet and Stewart Farrar, when they stated that the biggest influence in the modern occult explosion has been the Freemasons of the Golden Dawn. The foundational works for Ritual Magic and Satanism are found in the writings of the men involved in the Golden Dawn.

I am glad you do not disagree, Freemasonry is not included in this, only a few of it’s members

Anton Szandor LaVey, high priest of the Church of Satan gives credit to the Golden Dawn as the source of his satanic invocations found in the Satanic Bible. LaVey tells about his translations:
"I have presented my translation of the following calls with an archaic but Satanically correct unvarnishing of the translation employed by the Order of the Golden Dawn in the late Nineteenth Century....the Enochian Calls are the Satanic paeans of faith.

Again no Freemasonry here. There is a good thread regarding LaVey and CofS already on ATS. Maybe you should of searched abit before posting hey!


What about the Farrars' own special field of expertise witchcraft? By now you can probably guess the answer. They definitely give credit to Freemasonry as one of the sources for the rituals of witchcraft. Doreen Valiente, in particular contributed much to the final version of Gardner's Book of Shadows, the unpublished body of rituals and Craft lore traditionally copied out by hand by every new Witch from his or her initiator's version.

So they openly admit copying bit’s of ritual etc from Freemasonry. And, Christianity copied and engulfed pagan ritual and ceremony for one but I bet you wont say they are linked.

I think maybe you really should research this and check the sources you quote and what you are actually saying. It appears to me that it is not Freemasonry that you have the problem with, but some of the organisations that members of Freemasonry, and not Freemasonry, have developed and been involved in.



Summary

Freemasonry is truly an organization that deceives good men. Many honorable men who are in the lodge actually believe that they belong to a Christian fraternal organization

If you knew anything about Freemasonry you would know that is actually impossible. Freemasonry claims no affiliation with any religion and states that a lodge and the fraternity will contain followers of all faiths.

As we have shown, All Freemasons are in the occult

By your definition and explination of how Freemasonry is an occult so is Christianity. If you believe the bible testaments.

and down through the years, time after time, Masons have come together to organize other occult groups.

Freemason does not mean Freemasonry, the same as Priest, Vicar, Bishop does not mean the entire Christian, Catholic faith.
One is a member, one is the organisation.

There is most assuredly more to Freemasonry than most Freemasons realize.

And most assuredly less to Freemasonry than most non-freemasons claim.


We have documented the connections between Freemasons and the Illuminati, the New Age movement, the Theosophical Society, Satanism, the O.T.O., the Rosicrucian Society, the Golden Dawn, Witchcraft, the Egyptian Mystery Religions, many history making key people, and many famous Freemasons who were involved with these groups.

If we are to be correct you haven't actually documented anything merely documented some one else’s documents without showing how you have concluded and proved that the information claimed by these people is correct.

Much more could have been said on this subject

Wish you had said something about the subject used ofr the title I spent ages reading this which majoritly has already been covered in other threads so a quick search could of saved the need to post this. And it seems to be more about other organisation who have members who are masons, instead you should of called it that
“faults of 101 organisation and the 1 scapegoat that we linked due to a few of it’s members.”

but we believe what has been presented is sufficient enough to show the fact that Freemasons have played the leading roles in the 20th Century occult explosion.

Because a few occultists have admitted nicking ideas, ritual etc from Freemasonry. Not one thing quoted here actually proves that Freemasonry IS anything to do with any of the groups mentioned.


This is a side of the Lodge that Masons don't like to talk about.

More like are fed up with talking about.

The Scripture

Yes every good church goers answer to everything. Shame you didn’t explain what it means for the heathens as well.
To also quote yourself and scripture if I may

Travelling Gentlememthe word occult means deliberately kept hidden: not revealed to others


The infallible, truthful, factual scripture
“The secret of the kingdom of God has been given to you. But to those on the outside everything is said in parables so that, 'they may be ever seeing but never perceiving, and ever hearing but never understanding…’” (Mark 4:11-12)

"He replied, "The knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them. Whoever has will be given more, and he will have an abundance." (Matt. 13:11-12)

"We do, however, speak a message of wisdom among the mature, but not the wisdom of this age or of the rulers of this age, who are coming to nothing. No, we speak of God's secret wisdom, a wisdom that has been hidden and that God destined for our glory before time began." (1 Cor. 2:6-8)

"So then, men ought to regard us as servants of Christ and as those entrusted with the secret things of God." (1 Cor. 4:1)

"At that time Jesus said, "I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children. Yes, Father, for this was your good pleasure." (Matt. 11:25-26)



[edit on 12/1/2005 by Bondi]



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 06:10 AM
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That was a very interesting article on Freemasonry Watch Travelling Gentlemen. I got my Entered Apprentice degree last night. It was an interesting evening to say the least. I'm looking forward to going farther.



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 06:37 AM
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Originally posted by TgSoe
That was a very interesting article on Freemasonry Watch Travelling Gentlemen. I got my Entered Apprentice degree last night. It was an interesting evening to say the least. I'm looking forward to going farther.



Well done, TgSoe. I hope you enjoy your masonry.

As for the article being interesting? Well, I guess you could say that anything is interesting. But this isn't exactly informative.

As you can see, Bondi has pointed out that in each individual case, the article hasn't referred to Freemasonry. He's discussing groups that have nothing whatsoever to do with the Order that you joined last night and groups which we don't recognise and don't encourage. In fact, groups like Golden Dawn and OTO are postively frowned upon by Freemasons. We see them as corruptions of the Truth. It's quite amazing when somebody comes along and says that they are Freemasonry when we have done nothing but distance ourselves from these people. They care nothing for the relationship that we have with them if it serves to prove their point - albeit falsely.
It's like saying that somebody who burgled your house and stole your invention is then your best friend. Doesn't quite make sense does it?

And as Bondi has already pointed out, two of the main characters in the opening post are women!!! We get enough stick from the anti-masons for not accepting women. It's therefore amazing how they claim that there are women in Freemasonry and then link them to the founding of occultism within, isn't it?

I'm also sorry (or bored) to see that this guy has just posted the same misinformation that has dogged this board for years, a la the "Lucifer equals Satan" claim. It does bulk the article out though.




And the real irony of all of this?

It's just a cut and paste from FreemasonryWatch.com.

www.freemasonrywatch.org...

Not only is this totally misinformed trash, but it's plagiarised trash too!!!


[edit on 12-1-2005 by Leveller]



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 07:53 AM
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The article has NEVER been refuted by Freemasonry. The important point is that Freemasonry is the center of the Occult, all leading important occult organizations of the twentieth century have been founded by Freemasons, based on Freemasonry, and recruited from Freemasonry. All of these Satanic Masonic Lodges hold their regular meetings inside regular Masonic Temples under the approval and authority of Grand Masters who have never ruled their members may not join or participate. All most the entire membership of these side rites are regular Grand Lodge Freemasons.

I've been monitoring the fourth rate spam, that passes off for posts by this M.A.S.O.N.IC group, and I have noticed that it seldom goes beyond posting url to various Masonic Hate, Libel, and Disinformation sites.

Tell me MASONS do you deny that the Grand Master of your Grand Lodge has never forbid you to join, propagate, or recruit to these Appendent Rites of Freemasonry, these utterly Satanic and Blasphemous Orders? Do you deny that these Lodges do not hold all of their Stated Meetings inside Official Masonic Temples, just like they permitted the Ku Klux Klan and the Black Legion the same "privledge".


Find another hole to hide in Masons, this one is now closed.




posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 08:00 AM
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Originally posted by Travelling Gentleman
Find another hole to hide in Masons, this one is now closed.



You didn't even dig the hole, let alone close it.
Anyone can cut and paste a load of crap from a hate website.

And for the record? I would not be allowed to join a Satanic Order as you state. Freemasonry does not recognise Satan as a Supreme Being and it therefore cannot and does not recruit Satanists.

Freemasonry is about Brotherly Love. Satanism is about Selfishness. They're two complete poles apart.

As for the argument you plagiarised never being refuted by Masonry? Bull#. I just refuted it. Maybe our Grand Lodges have never refuted it because it is so easily dismissed. They don't waste their time swatting flies, you know.
Anyone with half a brain see that it has been refuted by others within Freemasonry.

www.masonicinfo.com...

www.masonicinfo.com...

www.masonicinfo.com...

Nice to see the Taxil lie still alive and well. Not.
And just to counter the claim that you are bound to make of this website being biased (there is a difference between bias and truth you know), here's another that's not aligned to Freemasonry.

www.factoftheday.com...





Go troll another couple of hate sites and let's see what else you can come up with. But this time, don't be so lazy. Try doing your own work and your own research and use you own words.

And by the way:

All of these Satanic Masonic Lodges hold their regular meetings inside regular Masonic Temples under the approval and authority of Grand Masters

Complete and utter rubbish. OTO and Golden Dawn are not recognised as regular Freemasonry. They meet in their own buildings, under their own Constitution. You may as well state that The Disney Club meets in regular Masonic Temples and is approved by Grand Lodge as Freemasonry for all the truth in the above.

I've been monitoring the fourth rate spam, that passes off for posts by this M.A.S.O.N.IC group, and I have noticed that it seldom goes beyond posting url to various Masonic Hate, Libel, and Disinformation sites.

You're kidding me, right? Your entire post was stolen word for word from a Hate, Libel and Disinformation site.










[edit on 12-1-2005 by Leveller]



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 08:23 AM
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Originally posted by Travelling Gentleman
The article has NEVER been refuted by Freemasonry.


Why would it be. Freemasonry see's no need to defend it, it's not exactly factual, and like I have already said, has more of a problem with other groups than Freemasonry.


The important point is that Freemasonry is the center of the Occult,


This article does not prove it, and you have provided nothing else.


all leading important occult organizations of the twentieth century have been founded by Freemasons, based on Freemasonry, and recruited from Freemasonry.


All of them, or just the couple you mention, oh sorry copied from. Are they the only organisation are they, and who classes them as important? I certainly don't.


All of these Satanic Masonic Lodges hold their regular meetings inside regular Masonic Temples


A Satanic Masonic lodge would have to hold there meetings in a Satanic Masonic Lodge surely. If it was in a Freemasonry Lodge it would not be welcome, and would not be compatible. Maybe you should actually find out what a Satanist is and does and believes in.


under the approval and authority of Grand Masters


Each lodge is under the control of the Worshipful Master, who in turn answers to provincial, who in turn answers to grand lodge. Come on now at least find out if you are quoting fact rather than talking crap.

You are dicreditting yourself by not checking first.


who have never ruled their members may not join or participate.


If you are talking about Satanism and all that again, there is no need to be told individually, it is part of the consitutions that you cannot be involved in something non-masonic and be a mason.


All most the entire membership of these side rites are regular Grand Lodge Freemasons.


Check your terminology first, because the total members of grand lodges is not a large amount of freemasons compared to the membership on a whole. What side rites are talking about, the organisations you mentioned are not rites of freemasonry, or acknolewdged as being masonic by any Grand, Provincial or Local Lodge.


I've been monitoring the fourth rate spam, that passes off for posts by this M.A.S.O.N.IC group, and I have noticed that it seldom goes beyond posting url to various Masonic Hate, Libel, and Disinformation sites.


Like the one you copied the article from LMAO


Find another hole to hide in Masons, this one is now closed.



Think you need the hole friend. Or at least the sense to research yourself.



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 09:02 AM
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First you say it was refuted, now you say you freemasonry didn't refute it because it didn't feel like it. Uh huh.

Every Mason is under the authority of the Grand Master of the Grand Lodge, every Masonic building is also under his authority. The Grand Master is the only authority of what is and what is not Freemasonry. Certainly not a simple Lodge Worshipful Master. The fact that these "side" orders, like Witchcraft, the Golden Dawn, Theosophy, etc, etc. are chock a block with "regular" freemasons, with the full permission of their Grand Master, the fact that most of these bodies hold their meetings inside "regular" Masonic Temples, with the approval of the "regular' Grand Master is all the "proof" that is needed.

Aside from the fact that all Masonic Lodges are Satanic Masonic Lodges, I would like to draw attention to a particular piece of nonsense you just stated, That is Satanism is non-masonic. All that is required is for a Mason to profess a belief in a higher being, any higher being. A Mason may request any book to be placed on the altar, any book.

Of course "regular' Masonic initiation and ritual is strewn with cunningly veiled references to the Devil. From the slipshod, to the setting maul, to the apron.

Anyone who knows that the password of a Master Mason is Tubal-Cain, the son of Murderer and Liar from the beginning, knows enough.

There are no secrets in Freemasonry, they have all been exposed by Christ and his Vicars.

Demit Mason and submit yourself to the rite of exorcism. You have caused enough damage and embarrassment to to your family, God, and country.



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 09:06 AM
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I wonder if TG would be so defensive of David Carraco (the author of the diatribe) if he knew just what a nutbar he actually is.

Carraco is a member of a cult called The Followers of Jesus Christ Ministries.
To be fair to him, he doesn't just hate Freemasonry - he hates all othe religions too!!!

www.ritualabusefree.org...


I guess we can't accuse him of just singling out Freemasonry, can we? He has enough hate to share with everyone!!!!


Demit Mason and submit yourself to the rite of exorcism. You have caused enough damage and embarrassment to to your family, God, and country.

Errr.... if you don't mind, I'll pass on that one.











[edit on 12-1-2005 by Leveller]



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 09:18 AM
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Ben Franklin, George Washington, freemasons, and heroes



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 09:25 AM
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Originally posted by Travelling Gentleman
Every Mason is under the authority of the Grand Master of the Grand Lodge, every Masonic building is also under his authority.


Your lack of knowledge for a subject you continue to post about is bewildering.

There is no one voice of Freemasonry, there is no one grand lodge that presides over freemasonry and there is no one grand lodge that controls everything.

Learn about Freemasonry before quoting truths about it, don't just eb a troll.



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 09:43 AM
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Every Grand Lodge had a Grand Master. Your Grand Lodge has a Grand Master. Not a single "regular' Grand Lodge, Grand Master has forbidden his members from participating in or recruiting to these appalling rites, including holding the meetings inside the Masonic Buildings to which they hold full authority.

Not surprising really, since the KKK recruited exclusively from Masonic Lodges, and held their meetings inside same. But then you didn't respond to that little tidbit did you MASON?

Say, why is the Grand Wizard of the KKK, the Chief 'Justice' of the KKK, and the leader of the terrorist Knights of the Golden Circle buried under the main foyer steps in the Supreme Council 33rd Degree, Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite of Freemasonry, located 13 blocks directly north of the White House in Washington DC?

You know the fellow I am referring to don't you, the one who wrote Lucifer is God...



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 09:49 AM
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I would guess Albert Pike? KKK founder, is that who you mean? If so, his statue still stands to this day as far as I know, and many who know his name do not know his KKK association.
Did you know that Dallas TX is on the 33 degree latitude? So then do suppose masons did in the President? You are seeing too many tenous connections, to my way of looking at it.



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 09:55 AM
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Originally posted by Travelling Gentleman
Every Grand Lodge had a Grand Master. Your Grand Lodge has a Grand Master. Not a single "regular' Grand Lodge, Grand Master has forbidden his members from participating in or recruiting to these appalling rites, including holding the meetings inside the Masonic Buildings to which they hold full authority.


If you are reading from FW again, which it seems you are, there are numerous Grand Lodges, each of which control their own countries/states. What you keep failing to realise, and even FW states this, there is no one singular voice that controls Freemasonry. ie no pyramid of power leading up to an overseer of all.


Not surprising really, since the KKK recruited exclusively from Masonic Lodges, and held their meetings inside same. But then you didn't respond to that little tidbit did you MASON?


The reason for no response is that you are not talking about the same KKK of today. The original KKK was a lot different and if you bothered to check your info you would of realised the original KKK is not the organisation of today and was not a bad org to be associated with. And yet again has been discussed on here already. You wonder why people just post urls, what do you expect when feeble minded people keep turning up posting the same poison that has already been answered 100 times over.


Say, why is the Grand Wizard of the KKK, the Chief 'Justice' of the KKK, and the leader of the terrorist Knights of the Golden Circle buried under the main foyer steps in the Supreme Council 33rd Degree, Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite of Freemasonry
Which ones and in what era were they buried and what was the purpose of the KKK at that time, try looking into that bit first


, located 13 blocks directly north of the White House in Washington DC?


What's your point.


You know the fellow I am referring to don't you, the one who wrote Lucifer is God...


That will probably be due to the fact that Lucifer is a mistrnalsation. It means the Morning Star which is waht Jesus was called in the bible, who is god, hence in that essence God is Lucifer. Again been discussed over and over again.

Will you PLEASE search the forum prior to posting what has been covered already.



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 10:08 AM
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You have made the MOST elementary error of fact.

It seems you are out of your depth. ALL references to Jesus Christ were removed from Masonic Ritual when the Ancients and Moderns merged in 1717. All.

Therefore the phrase refering to LUCIFER in Masonic Ritual is not a reference to Jesus Christ, but a reference to the Devil. As is the meaning of the Apron, Slipshod, and Maul - all are refernces to the Devil right out of the book of Genesis. There are many more as well as you go through the degree's. But the word LUCIFER in Masonic Ritual is the most damning.

Masonic Ritual was COMPLETELY de-christianized in 1717.

And as for your laughable suggestion that I cease making points that MASONS have "refuted", well sunshine welcome to reality.

Did Christ accept the Devils lies?

You're in quicksand, factually, and theologically.



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 10:21 AM
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Originally posted by Travelling Gentleman
You have made the MOST elementary error of fact.

It seems you are out of your depth. ALL references to Jesus Christ were removed from Masonic Ritual when the Ancients and Moderns merged in 1717. All.


Can you read, the referral was to the meaning of Lucifer and a reason as to the claim.


Masonic Ritual was COMPLETELY de-christianized in 1717.


It couldn't exaclty claim Christianity and non-segregation by religion could it. Freemasonry affiliates with no set religion.


And as for your laughable suggestion that I cease making points that MASONS have "refuted", well sunshine welcome to reality.


Don't you think if you read the other articles on here you may get some other knowledge which would actually stop you posting some fo the crap. No one is bothered if you have a problem with Freemasonry, as long as you are not continuely quoting form the same site, nothing of your own and if it hasn't already been covered. Search your subject material and if it is already in discussion join that thread. It is people like you that stop this board working to it true potential. As for reality, I wish you'd come back to it.



Did Christ accept the Devils lies?


No but he taught to teach only those worthy, according to the bible anyway.


You're in quicksand, factually, and theologically.



Sez you quoting from an opinion site, not factual. And claiming to no more than anyone else about a subject that your posts, and use of a discussion forum, show you obviously don't.

Comical, completely comical.

I don't claim to be right about everything, I am at least open to the fact that if some one can prove it wrong so be it, but you can't even accept it if a rational answer is given that throws your current perspective out the water.



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 12:18 PM
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But Dear Mason it is you and your flock of brotherly parrots who have been posting completely refuted claims without first checking website's and books of the Correctors of Masonic Myth and Disinformation. Get it?

I am here to rectify that ommission on your parts.

This is just one board of many where WORK is being applied.



[edit on 12-1-2005 by Travelling Gentleman]



posted on Jan, 12 2005 @ 02:34 PM
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The assertions of "Travelling Gentleman" concerning Freemasonry, Albert Pike, Ku Klux Klan, etc., have been shown to be false ad infinitum, and therefore, I won't waste time on those subjects at present. Interested parties may find the subjects in the archives via the search function.

Bondi said:


Alister Crowley was not a Freemason. Do a search, just on ATS you will find a very information post by a member called Masonic Light that will give you the answer to exactly Alister was and why he was not a Freemason and was not initiated into Freemasonry.


The question of the relationship between Aleister Crowley and Freemasonry is open to interpretation. But the claim (apparently made by TG) that Crowley was some sort of satanist is indeed pure bunk. Anyone who has ever read Crowley knows that he did not believe in any of Christianity: he didn't believe in the Christian's God, their devil, their angels, nor even in their scriptural history or authenticity. Simply put, Aleister Crowley believed that Christianity itself was a sham, invented by the early Church in order to climb to political power, and that it's legends were re-hashings of Egyptian and Greek mythology.

So Crowley did what all good heretics do: he formed his own religion. This religion, called Thelema, is based on Kabalah, Buddhism, esoteric Hinduism, with strong doses of ancient mythologies also. The difference is that Crowley freely admitted to using mythology in order to teach lessons, while he accused Christianity of literally believing in those kinds of fairy tales.

Crowley was initiated, passed, and raised in Anglo-Saxon Lodge (an English-speaking Lodge just outside Paris), under the Grand Lodge of France, in 1904. The Grand Lodge of France is considered clandestine (the National Grand Loge de France is the regular one). Therefore, he was considered irregular.

Nevertheless, I'll take Crowley any day over the snake oil that TG is trying to selling us.

Speaking of which, TG says:



But the word LUCIFER in Masonic Ritual is the most damning.


The word "Lucifer" is, of course, not found in any Masonic ritual. But that's sort of beside the point. I do not have to get TG's approval for anything I do. If I want to worship a tree, I'll worship a tree. If I want to worship Lucifer, I'll worship Lucifer. If I want to worship my '67 Chevy, then I'll do so. If TG doesn't like it, too bad. He'll just have to get over it.

Black Guard said:



If so, his statue still stands to this day as far as I know, and many who know his name do not know his KKK association


Pike was never associated with the Ku Klux Klan in any way, shape, or form. This is one of the many instances of disinformation propaganda used by today's Internet anti-Masons. But when pressed, they can provide no eveidence at all to back up this false charge. And that's because it's a lie.

Which brings us back to TG:



Say, why is the Grand Wizard of the KKK, the Chief 'Justice' of the KKK, and the leader of the terrorist Knights of the Golden Circle buried under the main foyer steps in the Supreme Council 33rd Degree, Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite of Freemasonry, located 13 blocks directly north of the White House in Washington DC?


There are no such people buried there. But of course, you already knew that.

For those interested, two men are buried in vaults at the House of the Temple, behind the Pillars of Charity. These are Albert Pike and John Cowles, both Past Grand Commanders of the Supreme Council. Neither of these men were ever members of the KKK or Golden Circle.

TG then tells the Masons on the forum:



Demit Mason and submit yourself to the rite of exorcism.


I don't have a follow-up to this one, I just wanted to quote it.




[edit on 12-1-2005 by Masonic Light]




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