Chicago and Guns: One Website All the Stats: 15 Shot in the Junk so Far: Much more:

a reply to: snowspirit

They're insanely expensive, perhaps as much as 5x in 15 years. .50 cents to a dollar a round is insane, go fish.

a reply to: snowspirit

originally posted by: jimmyx

originally posted by: mikell
One thing you need to remember whether these people are shot in the back or front they will be on disability the rest of their lives. That's how the system works. Free room and board for the rest of their lives. This little town getting hit by a car is big. generally $25 k from the insurance company just because then disability for life. It's big business.

right....because getting injured for life by being shot is so financially rewarding for blacks that it's the new welfare model....uh huh.....right...got it.

Not just blacks but anybody you don't need to be such a racist!

originally posted by: Spruce
a reply to: Subaeruginosa

You are in denial. Have you looked at the violence in Africa at all? It's a madhouse.

So because violence is more prevalent in both the poorest parts of the US and some of the most poverty stricken 3rd world countries on earth, you've concluded that black people must have a predisposition to violent acts?

That's quite a complex intellectual & evidence based conclusion you've established.

a reply to: Subaeruginosa

Poverty is an excuse not a cause.

There is complete and utter denial on the left in regards to base level statistics of gun violence.

Until there is truthful and honest discussion about the complete social dysfunction in the black community, there will never be any real solutions for gun violence.

I've posted these statistics before. Even had a thread deleted the other day because I dared to bring up 21 people being shot in Chicago over 20 hours last Tuesday.

What's amazing is the fact that all these gang related big money drug sales happen in "poor" neighborhoods.

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa

originally posted by: Spruce
a reply to: Subaeruginosa

You are in denial. Have you looked at the violence in Africa at all? It's a madhouse.

So because violence is more prevalent in both the poorest parts of the US and some of the most poverty stricken 3rd world countries on earth, you've concluded that black people must have a predisposition to violent acts?

That's quite a complex intellectual & evidence based conclusion you've established.

If poverty were the cause of gun violence, why aren't people being killed in Appalachia at the same rate?

Poverty is certainly correlated, but hardly a causal factor.

Black people have always had high poverty rates, but we haven't always had the same level of community violence. No one is going to argue that black people are poorer today than we were 50 or 60 years ago at the height of the civil rights movement and earlier. If poverty were the cause, then we would have seen similar levels of violence then.

a reply to: Edumakated

Black people have always had high poverty rates, but we haven't always had the same level of community violence.

Which just proves my whole point that black people aren't predisposed to violence.

No one is going to argue that black people are poorer today than we were 50 or 60 years ago at the height of the civil rights movement and earlier.

It could be argued that America was a more prosperous place back then, where an unskilled minimum wage worker could earn a decent living... that's what caused black people to flood the inner cities in the first place, since there was plenty of good paying unskilled factory jobs in these inner city regions at that time... then the factories all closed down or moved away and these inner city regions became slums.

But you don't need me educating you about the history and events, which created the inner city slums in your own country, right?

a reply to: Edumakated

You have very valid points, and I think you're right - there are many poor communities in the world, and not all are violent. Why? I live in a poor rural area, there is basically zero crime here and everyone has a gun.

People have to start being responsible for their actions. This issue has a lot to do with culture.

originally posted by: Edumakated
There is complete and utter denial on the left in regards to base level statistics of gun violence.

Until there is truthful and honest discussion about the complete social dysfunction in the black community, there will never be any real solutions for gun violence.

I've posted these statistics before. Even had a thread deleted the other day because I dared to bring up 21 people being shot in Chicago over 20 hours last Tuesday.

Speaking of that, check your U2U.

When 75% of black babies are born to single mothers, we, as a society, need to address the social decline in the black community with honesty. When fear to examine closely the crux of the problem, we cannot solve it.

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa
a reply to: Edumakated

Black people have always had high poverty rates, but we haven't always had the same level of community violence.

Which just proves my whole point that black people aren't predisposed to violence.

No one is going to argue that black people are poorer today than we were 50 or 60 years ago at the height of the civil rights movement and earlier.

It could be argued that America was a more prosperous place back then, where an unskilled minimum wage worker could earn a decent living... that's what caused black people to flood the inner cities in the first place, since there was plenty of good paying unskilled factory jobs in these inner city regions at that time... then the factories all closed down or moved away and these inner city regions became slums.

But you don't need me educating you about the history and events, which created the inner city slums in your own country, right?

1) I've never argued blacks are more predisposed to violence.

2) We didn't have nearly the same economic opportunity. Even if one could argue that America was more prosperous as a whole, it did not extend to the black community as we were openly discriminated against during that time. We didn't really start moving into the mainstream employment across all industries until the 70s and 80s.

Here is what did change. The black out of wedlock birth rate went from being less than 25% in the early 60s to nearly 75% today. In some of these communities it is close to 100%. In other words, despite the racism and oppression, black families were largely intact with a father and a mother. There was no welfare or government assistance.

Along comes the great white saviors seeking to save us from poverty through LBJ's War on Poverty. Since the benefits were setup so that you couldn't qualify if the father was in the home, government created a culture in which black men were marginalized and government took over taking care of the family. Now it is culturally accepted to have baby mamas and no father in the home.

This is the root cause. You will not see the same concentration of these kinds of broken families in middle class areas. There are no father figures around in these communities and the ones that are also gang banging losers. As such, we have entire communities which have basically descended in to chaos with feral young black men who are literally living out Lord of the Flies.

The left does not want to bring this up because to do so exposes the failure of their policies.

originally posted by: JustAnObservation
a reply to: Edumakated

I live in a poor rural area, there is basically zero crime here and everyone has a gun.

Get a heap of those "poor rural" communities (you speak of) together, put them all in a densely populated concrete urban jungle, with no jobs and lots of drugs, then see what happens!

Your comparing apples to oranges.

a reply to: queenofswords

You are correct. This is the race issue we are not allowed to talk about.

Really? O.K.., so now I'm officially confused. This is black v. black crime; its not white v. black shootings, its not black v. white shootings. So............how is this a "race" issue? By saying its a race issue, to me it seems people are saying that because it appears blacks don't like blacks? Or that not enough whites are being shot so we need to level the dying field?

Definitely unclear on the concept.

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa

originally posted by: JustAnObservation
a reply to: Edumakated

I live in a poor rural area, there is basically zero crime here and everyone has a gun.

Get a heap of those "poor rural" communities (you speak of) together, put them all in a densely populated concrete urban jungle, with no jobs and lots of drugs, then see what happens!

Your comparing apples to oranges.

So being poor in the sticks with no jobs and a lot of drugs doesn't cause violence, but being poor in the city with no jobs and a lot of drugs causes violence? Of course, to believe this means you have to ignore that other ethnic groups are also poor and live in Chicago as well. Hispanics are just as poor as blacks, yet their per capita violence rate is not nearly as bad. Asians? Rarely ever hear of Asian violence in Chicago.

While we can argue if hip hop music is imitating life or is life imitating hip hop music, one cannot deny that culturally, this form of entertainment is damaging the black community. I say this as a huge hip hop fan. The sheer level of coonery and promotion of senseless violence that passes for hip hop nowadays is just out of control.

Combine the music brainwashing with the lack of parental guidance at home and in public schools, i think you have the recipe for the violence we see today. There is a feedback loop that has been created that will take some serious force to be broken.

The black out of wedlock birth rate went from being less than 25% in the early 60s to nearly 75% today.

If we blame guns for the gun death rate should we not blame babies for the out of wedlock birth rate?

a reply to: Subaeruginosa

The argument made was that the crime is due to poverty. I pointed out that there are many poverty stricken areas with close to zero crime. That aside, I still think that the moral upbringing in my community differ from those in cities. Period. I have lived in terrible areas as well - the difference has a lot to do with the culture of the community, the people who live there. As another poster mentioned, the fact that so many children are born who have no fathers is a HUGE problem in and of itself. Ever heard the phrase "daddy issues"? It is a thing! People need positive role models and father figures. It isnt just in the making of the child where it is necessary, it is also in raising the child. Families have been torn apart in urban areas, both white and black though I think it affects the latter more so as a percentage. This is due to terrible government policies that have now influenced the culture of the area! These are real issues and they are things that can be fixed but not if people turn a blind eye and dont care! I care, I am very lucky to have an unbroken family. Many people I know are not so lucky. And it has affected them terribly.

There's a problem with black culture. Statistics make that clear. They'll blame everything but themselves. The trouble is their violence isn't contained to their areas and we all have to suffer the consequences.

a reply to: Edumakated

So being poor in the sticks with no jobs and a lot of drugs doesn't cause violence, but being poor in the city with no jobs and a lot of drugs causes violence?

Never said that... obviously (imo) the poster is full of it, if the community he referred to is as poor as he says and he's claiming there's no crime there.

But anyway, if you significantly raise the population density, it becomes a epidemic, competition becomes intensified and profits from black markets become huge and worth violently fighting for control over.

Hispanics are just as poor as blacks, yet their per capita violence rate is not nearly as bad. Asians? Rarely ever hear of Asian violence in Chicago.

More black people are probably just involved in the drug trade on the street level, if that's actually the case.

The Vietnamese used to run the smack business where I grew up and they'd chop you up just for knowing someone who messed with them.

While we can argue if hip hop music is imitating life or is life imitating hip hop music, one cannot deny that culturally, this form of entertainment is damaging the black community.

I disagree, I have loved Eminem since I was 17... but I haven't gone out and murdered my ex girlfriend.

These urban black communities are a product of generations of poverty without any chance of a better life, unless they are prepared to violently fight for a piece of the highly lucrative inner city drug trade... its as simple as that, imho.