‘White Privilege’ training for teachers-Pacific Educational Group

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: Spider879

What s ridiculous anecdotal story to support another ridiculous notion.

I got my ass beat by the police and a gun held to my head by a white police officer and I'm white and he told me to shut the # up or he was going to put a bullet in my head while I was fully restrained and compliant.

See how I used an anecdotal story to support my position?

I agree there may be racism but white privlidge is a bunch of bull#. Ask any middle to lower class white person about their privilege and they will laugh at you.

Do you have a black friend you can take to Manhattan and run the Cab experiment?? racism is not exactly the same as white privilege although it can end up being such.

originally posted by: Spider879

originally posted by: aorAki
a reply to: BIGPoJo


Awareness is the beginning.
Understanding and comprehension are further steps.

I gave the same answer above..but I guess it won't take because it's all anecdotal.

I guess the difference is I'm white...

...some people get it, some people don't want to, and I understand that, when it challenges you and go right to the very core of one's perceived being.

a reply to: Spider879

So you have no actual desire to discuss the problem you instead want me to lower my head and say I am sorry...

sorry, you have no desire to actually discuss the true problem, and instead want to blame me because im white so good day, wallow in your hatred.

originally posted by: Elliot


Where did that 98% of power 'figure' come from?

Even in the last 50 years, who has been running India, China, Pakistan, Africa, Japan...........?

Look at the world's billionaire list..............I suspect the vast majority on there are not the fabled priviliged.

Lots of so called 'truths' turn out to be something else altogether.

Don't just focus on that 98% number because maybe, I'm wrong and it's only 90% or so, which is still an astronomically crazy number against the rest of the world. You bring up China, India, pakistan, all of africa and japan but you're missing my point. India has no world power, basically, the entire continent of AFrica has no world super powers, china only recently in the aftermath of ww2 started to gain power, but they still trail the western countries, pakistan has no world power. Look back over the past several decades and who had the power? That's important, because it set the stage for the power dynamic we have today.

Think of the British empire that spanned the globe, think of all the power in America, right now--how many presidents have been white males, and how many in congress are now, white males, how many CEOs of fortune 500 companies are white males, how many leaders of churches were and still are white males. Who were the Titans of industry at the turn of the last century who were the richest men in history? Rockefeller, Morgan, Carnagie...white males. Just last year in 2015 congress was 80 percent white and 80 percent male.

If you just but look, you'll see the truth.


IN summary, this is the point. The power structure in the last several centuries was put in place by and for white males, In most places. Now we have more equality and it's not that way, except that most of those in power are still white males, it's a slow change. Why should we care? only because if you are a white male, you have a headstart in life. Depending on where you are it could be really, really small, or it could be really really big. Being a Christian and heterosexual gives you added step ups in life.

originally posted by: Irishhaf
a reply to: Spider879

So you have no actual desire to discuss the problem you instead want me to lower my head and say I am sorry...

sorry, you have no desire to actually discuss the true problem, and instead want to blame me because im white so good day, wallow in your hatred.

Who said anything about being you being sorry or tagging at guilt, we are saying that white privilege ie positive bias for whites exist you were the one acting as if your family and other families like yours are the only ones that worked hard, Im just letting you know that yours are not special in that regard.

a reply to: Spider879

It doesn't prove white privileged what it proves is racism and it's not coming from white cab drivers.

What's the real issue?

a reply to: Spider879

Let me try putting it like this... if I told one of my black friends the only reason he got a scholarship was because of affirmative action.. not because he worked his butt off, got good grades and presented himself in the best light possible... they would want to kick my butt, and rightfully so.

But the media and many people pushing the white privilege angle seem to think its perfectly OK to do that to white people.

You immediately dismissed the hard work put in by my family and many others to insist there is a force out there to help us no matter what.

Why not focus on the fact the rich are getting richer and the middle class is getting poorer, color is irrelevant... all races should be outraged that the rich are rigging the game against anyone getting a bigger piece of the pie, instead we snipe at each other as they continue to buy politicians to rig the game for them and their families.

The race argument is a red herring..

a reply to: amazing
Many 'myths' are created to divide and conquer.

I suspect that if we were to be able to dig back into the mists of time we would find that the majority of 'world leaders' and powerful people were NOT white, since power is what you are focused on.

In recent times some powerful people have been white but the majority of white people have no power, money or privilige.

The most important word you should use is 'some'. There have been 'some' white people in a priviliged position the majority are in as much of a mess as the rest of the world.

Ever looked at Britain in the pre 1980's. I remember when few houses had bathrooms, running water or indoor lavatories?

Go back into ancient history and consider the Akkadians, Assyrians, lost tribes of Africa, ancient Chinese Emperors and Japanese emperors. How about Temujin, Genghis Kahn, the Maharajas of India etc? Did they suffer from that problem you feel concerned about that 'some' white people may have had 'some' privilige? Is it only 'bad' if it is 'white'?

You need to consider 'timescale' and that pesky little word 'some'.

If you do that you will find that there is also a lot of 'non-white privilige'. That doesn't seem to concern you as you focus on the audacity of 'some' white people having had 'some' privilige?

originally posted by: BIGPoJo
]originally posted by: Spider879
[]originally posted by: BIGPoJo
[]originally posted by: [post=20413233]Spider879[/

" Thirdly this bias exists for a reason, it has nothing to do with skin color and more to do with perceived cultural bias. "

This is the correct answer

I've been trying to explain this simple fact for years, but people would rather throw in this whole " white privilege " bs. Maybe if blacks would stop glamorizing thugs and a culture of nothing but violence, disrespect, crime, etc etc instead of embracing, coddling, and defending it and calling anyone who rightfully hates that culture a racist, rather than denouncing it, then and only then maybe finally this "privilege" crap would stop.
Secondly
Too much money is made from "thug culture" and that is why this debate won't end any time soon. It's also why the real people behind these "white privilege" accusations against every white person in existence will never admit to this nugget of common sense.

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: Spider879

Do you think a white person who looks like an outlaw biker can walk around without being stereo typed?

What about a redneck... Or a hippy... Or someone who's ghetto....?

What about living in bad neighborhoods....?

You don't think racism against white people exist... Ever try walking around Watts, or Compton as a white person or The badlands in Philly?

I've lived in horrible dangerous ghettos and thank god I'm a fighter because it's saved my ass a few times.... Just for being a "white boy"

Aye I never said racism against white don't exist, but it's not the same as white privilege and again it doesn't have to do with your dress although not having your pants hanging off one's ass does help, a well dressed Black may get mistaken for the help at certain upper crusty parties,but his white counter part never do, because of assumptions made, I suggest you take a peek at aorAki's link

If you read through the rest of the list, you can see how white people and people of color experience the world in two very different ways. BUT LISTEN: This is not said to make white people feel guilty about their privilege. It's not your fault you were born with white skin and experience these privileges. BUT, whether you realize it or not, you DO benefit from it, and it IS your fault if you don't maintain awareness of that fact
occupywallstreet.net...
.

Now one can be dismissive of this white guy in the link that originally scoffed at any such thing because he is dirt poor or we can learn from his experience.

a reply to: Elliot

Ah, but here's the main point. We're talking about white privilege today. Because today, the present is what matters. There is white privilege today in our modern society in most places in the UK, Canada, Australia, USA and many other western countries. I'm American and I have British relatives so those are the two countries I'm most familiar with.

Power goes in cycles. Sometimes those cycles last centuries. You are correct in that in the past, if you lived at the height of the Roman Empire, there would be roman privilege, or Summerian privilage or if you lived in southern Africa you might have had black privilege at the height of the Zulu nation. But that's in the past.

My point was that English colonialism and the rise of the United states, with those two factors in the last couple of centuries, white males had most power in the world stage. That power structure has trickled down and carried onto todays societies. Where if you are white, you have at least a small head start in life. That's white privilelige and it's real. Deny ignoranc.e

and it's not just "some" it's if you are a white male you have an advantage. It doesn't mean you should feel guilty, it doesn't mean you can't overcome it with hard work, it doesn't mean that somewhere there can't be a white guy who is having a tough time, it's just a thing. This little privilege can be so small as to be basically unnoticable or barely an advantage at all, but in other cases it can be huge.

a reply to: amazing
So your argument in a nutshell is this: because a few white men have been powerful all white people are priviliged and have a head start in life. You really believe that?

originally posted by: Wookiep

originally posted by: BIGPoJo
]originally posted by: Spider879
[]originally posted by: BIGPoJo
[]originally posted by: [post=20413233]Spider879[/

" Thirdly this bias exists for a reason, it has nothing to do with skin color and more to do with perceived cultural bias. "

This is the correct answer

I've been trying to explain this simple fact for years, but people would rather throw in this whole " white privilege " bs. Maybe if blacks would stop glamorizing thugs and a culture of nothing but violence, disrespect, crime, etc etc instead of embracing, coddling, and defending and calling anyone who rightfully hates that culture a racist, instead of denouncing it, then and only then maybe finally this "privilege" crap would stop.
Secondly
Too much money is made from "thug culture" and that is why this debate won't end any time soon. It's also why the real people behind these "white privilege" accusations against every white person in existance will never admit to this nugget of common sense.

Listen to your self as if whats called Thug culture wasn't a glamorous thing past and present am sure you love you some Al Capone exploits, Whitey Bulger and others, even before so called thug life was truly a thing in the poor Black communities,
Btw Many took to heart the old phrase Free White and 21 the ultimate statement in privilege.

originally posted by: Irishhaf
a reply to: THEatsking

why doesn't someone find me something more than anecdotal evidence of this white privilege?

================
The rest is not directed at theatsking

My family came from Ireland during the potato famine, my father worked 2 jobs while going to school full time to provide for his family.. I joined the military to give me the best options going forward so my dad wouldn't feel obligated to help me while my sister need his support.

I look at my family and whether you mean to or not its highly insulting to us that we only got to our position because we had a leg up on the competition.

You want to talk about societal stero types and how to fight it fine I'm with you, but don't tell me my family didn't earn every penny we have made through effort hard work and occasionally some luck. That will just piss me off and close down any possible useful communication we might have.

White privilege is a reality. The onus falls on you and other deniers of it to get the evidence. I've played this game and it all gets dismissed.

Research it, unbiased, and you will get the truth. And that truth is it exists everywhere

originally posted by: Elliot
a reply to: amazing
So your argument in a nutshell is this: because a few white men have been powerful all white people are priviliged and have a head start in life. You really believe that?

But it was more than a few. And it's more than a few now. Just take a look at the USA congress 80% White and 80% Men. It used to be even more skewed. Not even 1% of Fortune 500 Companies have minority CEOs. It's a real thing. You just have to do the research to see for yourself.

a reply to: THEatsking

Maybe you aren't aware of this, but we're not in the 20's anymore. Everyone knows what a thug is today, not almost a century ago. Btw, anyone cam be a thug, but blacks glamorize it, sell it and constantly cry racism when people don't want to be anywhere near that garbage culture.

a reply to: THEatsking

I disagree... if you want to tell me there is still racism out there, yup I agree 100%, we as the human species are a fairly stupid breed of animal.

But having been in countries where I was looked down upon, or preyed upon because I was a white guy.. yea sorry if I dont buy the whoa is me story, racism flows in every direction.

The only thing we can absolutely 100% have an effect on is how we ourselves treat people, I have had people beat me out for promotion I didnt cry affirmative action, I took a look at what they did in the time leading up to the choice and saw the things they did that I didnt... me not getting the promotion had nothing to do with race, it had to do with them working harder and putting themselves forward in the best light possible.

I learned from that and moved on, and the next time a promotion opportunity came up I was ready.

originally posted by: Wookiep
a reply to: THEatsking

Maybe you aren't aware of this, but we're not in the 20's anymore. Everyone knows what a thug is today, not almost a century ago. Btw, anyone cam be a thug, but blacks glamorize it, sell it and constantly cry racism when people don't want to be anywhere near that garbage culture.

I think you meant to respond to me, in any case Thug culture was every bit as glamorous as Bunny and Clyde , but just as that didn't define all white folks back then, you are saying that thug culture define Blacks all over..only in your own truism, and in a funny way goes on to make my point, criminal under world and their sub culture exists, but Blacks all over are responsible but white folks are not responsible for whatever thug they produce as everyone is viewed as an individual or a bunch of individuals.

originally posted by: amazing
But it was more than a few. And it's more than a few now. Just take a look at the USA congress 80% White and 80% Men. It used to be even more skewed. Not even 1% of Fortune 500 Companies have minority CEOs. It's a real thing. You just have to do the research to see for yourself.

No, that is not a real thing.

That is a heavily biased approach, utilizing an extreme position to justify the norm.

If you want to see how a policy is modifying something, you check the applicable areas with the highest turn over. Those are the areas that will have responded to the changes the fastest.

Picking an area with extremely slow turn over (like CEO's and Congresspersons) is no different than a person using the hottest day in a desert to proclaim global warming, and another using the coldest day in the arctic to refute it. Neither give you an accurate picture.

originally posted by: peck420

originally posted by: amazing
But it was more than a few. And it's more than a few now. Just take a look at the USA congress 80% White and 80% Men. It used to be even more skewed. Not even 1% of Fortune 500 Companies have minority CEOs. It's a real thing. You just have to do the research to see for yourself.

No, that is not a real thing.

That is a heavily biased approach, utilizing an extreme position to justify the norm.

If you want to see how a policy is modifying something, you check the applicable areas with the highest turn over. Those are the areas that will have responded to the changes the fastest.

Picking an area with extremely slow turn over (like CEO's and Congresspersons) is no different than a person using the hottest day in a desert to proclaim global warming, and another using the coldest day in the arctic to refute it. Neither give you an accurate picture.

Not quite, take the long view like over the past 2 centuries. Congress should have had significant turnover and intigration of minorities, and other religions and females, but it has not. Fortune 500 companies were not called furtune 500 companies but you can still look up what would have been similar and you will still see that over the last couple of centuries ( of course give or take, I'm just using that as a general number and reference) that CEOs of big companies should have seen similar turnover and intigegration but have not. Why is that?

and I wanted to add....The positions of power do seem to have the slowest turnover. Does that make them less relevant or more relevant to our conversation. Because I'm saying that white, male power has changed slowly and is changing slowly. Just like the church used to have significantly more power than it does now, but it took centuries for that power to wain. I'm saying White, male power in western countries such as England and USA is also changing slowly. It could be another century before those in power reflect the actual demographics of the country they represent.