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Pink Floyd star on why his fellow musicians are terrified to speak out against Israel

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posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 12:30 PM
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BDS(boycott, divestment and sanctions against Israel) has recently been prohibited in France. Peaceful activism is not accepted in France anymore, the "land of the human rights and of liberté, fraternité, égalité".

France’s highest court of appeals confirmed earlier rulings that found promoters of a boycott against Israel guilty of inciting hate or discrimination. The rulings passed on Tuesday by the Paris-based Court of Cassation confirmed the Nov. 27 convictions of 12 individuals by the Colmar Court of Appeals in connection with their 2009 and 2010 actions in supermarkets near the eastern city of Mulhouse. The individuals arrived at the supermarket wearing shirts emblazoned with the words: “Long live Palestine, boycott Israel.” They also handed out fliers that said that “buying Israeli products means legitimizing crimes in Gaza.” The court in Colmar imposed fines to the collective tune of $14,500 and court expenses on Laila Assakali, Yahya Assakali, Assya Ben Lakbir, Habiba Assakali, Sylviane Mure, Farida Sarr, Aline Parmentier, Mohammad Akbar, Jean-Michel Baldassi, Maxime Roll, Jacques Ballouey and Henry Eichholtzer. They appealed the ruling citing their freedom to express their opinion.

In confirming the sentences, the Court of Cassation cited the French republic’s law on Freedom of the Press, which prescribes imprisonment or a fine of up to $50,000 for parties that “provoke discrimination, hatred or violence toward a person or group of people on grounds of their origin, their belonging or their not belonging to an ethnic group, a nation, a race or a certain religion.”

France Court Upholds 'BDS Is Discrimination' Ruling

For a country that celebrated freedom of speech just after the events of charlie hebdo..

The post-Charlie Hebdo “free speech” march in Paris was a fraud for multiple reasons, as I wrote at the time. It was led by dozens of world leaders, many of whom imprison or even kill people for expressing prohibited views. It was cheered by many Westerners who feign upset only when free speech abridgments are perpetrated by Muslims, but not — as is far more common — by their own governments against Muslims. Worst of all, the march took place in a country that is one of the most hostile to free speech rights in the West, as France quickly demonstrated in the days after the march by rounding up and prosecuting Muslims and other anti-Israel activists for the political views they expressed. A great, best-selling book by French philosopher Emmanuel Todd released this year argues that these “free speech” marches were a “sham,” driven by many political sentiments — nativism, nationalism, anti-Muslim bigotry — that had nothing to do with free speech. The absurdity of France’s celebrating itself for free expression was vividly highlighted by this week’s decision from that nation’s highest court, one that is a direct assault on basic free speech rights. The French high court upheld the criminal conviction of 12 political activists for the “crime” of advocating sanctions and a boycott against Israel as a means of ending the decadeslong military occupation of Palestine. What did these French criminals do? This:

The individuals arrived at the supermarket wearing shirts emblazoned with the words: “Long live Palestine, boycott Israel.” They also handed out fliers that said that “buying Israeli products means legitimizing crimes in Gaza.”

Anti-Israel Activism Criminalized in the Land of Charlie Hebdo and “Free Speech”

Roger Waters (of the Pink Floyd band) has sent a letter to BDS France to tell them how he feels about that.

Mes Cher Citoyens,

Along with most thinking, feeling and compassionate members of global civil society, I deplore the occupation of Palestine and the subjugation of all of its non-Jewish peoples. The State of Israel’s anti-Palestinian discrimination since 1947/8 is unacceptable.

I am anti-racist, anti-colonialist, anti-war, anti-oppression, and anti- discrimination.

We the peoples of the rest of global civil society have always tipped our hat to you the French, for your embracing of the “Declaration des Droits des L’Hommes” in 1789. There always resided, we believed, in your collective beating heart, devoted as you were to the principles of Fraternity, Equality and Liberty, an attachment to the defense of the oppressed everywhere, meme hors de France!

Today I read to my horror that a court in your land has declared illegal a peaceful protest by BDS supporters against the policies of the current government of Israel, which are racist, oppressive and discriminatory, claiming that the protest itself is discrimination and imposing fines upon the peaceful protesters.

This is a sad day for France and for the French judiciary. To take such a stand against BDS (Boycott Divestment and Sanctions) for employing the same nonviolent tools that were used in India against the oppression of British rule in the mid-20th century, and by American protesters, both black and white, in the Jim Crow South of the USA, and also by both black and white protesters from all over the world in the struggle against apartheid in South Africa is a stain on the good name of The French Republic.

BDS, BOYCOTT DIVESTMENT AND SANCTIONS, IS, SO FAR, THE ONLY EFFECTIVE PATH TO THE POSSIBILITY OF PEACE IN THE HOLY LAND BASED ON THE WELL BEING OF BOTH PALESTINIANS AND ISRAELIS SHARING FREEDOM, JUSTICE AND EQUALITY.

Why would your judiciary oppose it? A public outcry in your great country should demand a public inquiry into the legal grounds for bringing these complaints against BDS supporters. In any event, on a personal note, I should declare an interest. The supporters of BDS, who have been attacked by your judiciary, have my unequivocal support, respect and love.

Any man or woman who mans the barricades in support of our oppressed brothers and sisters in Palestine and Israel for that matter is my brother and sister.

This issue is not complicated, it is a matter of right and wrong, it is a matter of the correct or incorrect application of the law. The law should serve the oppressed not the oppressors. If your law protects the oppressors, the racists and the discriminators, and punishes the men and women of good heart who man the barricades of freedom, wherever those barricades may exist in our small planet, then your law is an ass.

With love and respect. Chers Citoyens

Roger Waters

link (There seems to be a problem with this link, if a mod can tell me why..)




posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 12:31 PM
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Waters also gave an interview recently saying that musicians and artists in general feared to lose their career if they spoke about boycotting Israel.

“My industry has been particularly recalcitrant in even raising a voice [against Israel]. There’s me and Elvis Costello, Brian Eno, Manic Street Preachers, one or two others, but there’s nobody in the United States where I live. I’ve talked to a lot of them, and they are scared s***less.

“If they say something in public they will no longer have a career. They will be destroyed. I’m hoping to encourage some of them to stop being frightened and to stand up and be counted, because we need them. We need them desperately in this conversation in the same way we needed musicians to join protesters over Vietnam.”

“[The Israeli lobby] is determined not to let that conversation develop into one that people can listen to and that is why they accuse us of being Nazis. This idea that BDS is the thin end of some kind of genocidal Nazi wedge that ends up in another Holocaust – well it isn’t.”


link

In France, you can't even say publicly that there exists an Israeli lobby, if you do you're instantly labeled as antisemitic by the government officials and the media, etc.. Some call it "the lobby that doesn't exist". Israeli lobbyists in France are effectively exploiting the culpability of what happened when France was under German rule during WW2. They make sure that this culpability never runs dry by talking over and over again about antisemitism. They see antisemitism everywhere. If for example a personality (government minister, singer, actor, etc..) is accused of something that has nothing to do with judaism and if this personality has jewish ancestry, they bring antisemitism. There are many examples of that, but the best example is Laurent Fabius, who was until very recently minister of foreign affairs. In the 90s he was caught up in the contamined blood scandal, and recently, Bernard Henry Levy, a very well known zionist, said with a straight face on television that this scandal had antisemitism all over it.

So the question is, am I antisemitic for posting all this information ?

edit on 22-2-2016 by gosseyn because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 12:46 PM
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There's two Israels....why does no one mention it.....makes me curious about a certain somethin


+10 more 
posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 12:48 PM
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a reply to: gosseyn
Saw this the other day.



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 12:51 PM
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a reply to: gosseyn



So the question is, am I antisemitic for posting all this information ?

There are many Israeli firsters that will think so because Israel is above all laws and above reproach. It's no real surprise that France has done this to the BDS members because France kisses Israels butt almost as much as America.



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 12:55 PM
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originally posted by: GBP/JPY
There's two Israels....why does no one mention it.....makes me curious about a certain somethin


Could you elaborate, please? I think I know what you mean. Not sure. Interested, tho...



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 12:58 PM
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a reply to: gosseyn


In confirming the sentences, the Court of Cassation cited the French republic’s law on Freedom of the Press, which prescribes imprisonment or a fine of up to $50,000 for parties that “provoke discrimination, hatred or violence toward a person or group of people on grounds of their origin, their belonging or their not belonging to an ethnic group, a nation, a race or a certain religion.


Yet it's perfectly acceptable to impose sanctions on the likes of Russia, Iran, Syria, North Korea etc where those sanctions go against what is apparently illegal when it comes to Israel.

If anyone need any proof that the legal system is as corrupt as the political system then you need look no further than these kangaroo court decisions whose results are based not on justice or fairness but agenda from the higher echelons.

What's worse is sanctions are forced upon a populace, they have no choice whether they wish to boycott products and services from the country the sanction is imposed upon, no that freedom is removed because the government thinks it knows better than the population. Yet a portion of a population CHOOSES out of freewill to boycott and protest a country who is in bed with their own country it suddenly becomes illegal, I'm certain that if these protesters were boycotting any nation not in bed with the West then there would be no legal proceedings and it would be open season on those nations.

It makes me sick to see such hypocrisy from those we entrust with the power to rule and it makes me even sicker that the majority of people are happy to sit idly by while freedoms become eroded and innocent people with a moral backbone are branded as criminals simply for not sticking to the status quo.
edit on 22/2/16 by Discotech because: (no reason given)


+2 more 
posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 01:01 PM
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a reply to: gosseyn


So the question is, am I antisemitic for posting all this information ?


No but people are pretty silly for somehow believe that there is a world wide conspiracy of a Jewish conglomerate that works together for nefarious purposes..

There are lobby groups for everything. Including war mongers, pharmaceutical companies, oil companies the list goes on and on and on. The CFR, hundreds of think tanks and organizations like FRC, all lobby groups.

And you don't see people boycotting that do you? Even when you do, it's not done with that same level of hate is it?

There are legitimate reasons to dislike Israel for how it chooses to act within it's own borders and on the world stage. pretending like a boycott is going to help is crazy talk if you ask me.

~Tenth



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 01:09 PM
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a reply to: gosseyn

Well, you see how someone is already insinuating you are silly?

Says it all.

Then you'll get called the obvious.

Brilliant thread. Like I said in earlier threads though, there's no denying ignorance on this subject in these forums.

Long live the truth. Long live the righteous Jews. Long live open and honest discussion without feeling scared.



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 01:28 PM
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originally posted by: buster2010
a reply to: gosseyn



So the question is, am I antisemitic for posting all this information ?

There are many Israeli firsters that will think so because Israel is above all laws and above reproach. It's no real surprise that France has done this to the BDS members because France kisses Israels butt almost as much as America.


with all due respect to you buster (I agree with you close to 100% of the time)...Israel is a special case...why do I say that?...they are surrounded by Islamic rulers, that would love to see Israel and the Jewish people burn to the ground. Let's also remember that Israel allows Muslims to work in their country, something where reciprocation is lacking in most of the Muslim world. even after the holocaust, there are still large groups of Europeans that do not like Jewish people and the hatred can be seen in political rallies in various parts of Europe to this day....having said this.....maybe France (or those in the know) might have good reasons to try and stop this. I think there should be more in-depth research done into both parties involved, to properly assess this decision wisely.



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 01:35 PM
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When you are labelled for speaking out against atrocities inflicted by a nation, I think we can safely deduce who is pulling all the strings.

If I am labelled an anti-Semite for speaking out against the atrocities the Israeli Government have dealt out in Palestine, so be it.

I do not have any beef with the Jewish religion or its people, what I do have a beef about is the land stealing and the boots being continuously stomped down on the heads of the indigenous people.

But the majority know there is a vast difference between the Jewish faith and the faith of the Zionists, I just wish the remainder understood.



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 02:16 PM
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I hope they make BDS illegal in the UK aswell...

It'll be another law I'll happily break daily.
edit on 22-2-2016 by CharlieSpeirs because: Spelling.



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 02:17 PM
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a reply to: gosseyn


In confirming the sentences, the Court of Cassation cited the French republic’s law on Freedom of the Press, which prescribes imprisonment or a fine of up to $50,000 for parties that “provoke discrimination, hatred or violence toward a person or group of people on grounds of their origin, their belonging or their not belonging to an ethnic group, a nation, a race or a certain religion.”

Meanwhile the French are embedded in the whole contrived War on Islam-- I mean Terror.



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 02:36 PM
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originally posted by: jimmyx

originally posted by: buster2010
a reply to: gosseyn



So the question is, am I antisemitic for posting all this information ?

There are many Israeli firsters that will think so because Israel is above all laws and above reproach. It's no real surprise that France has done this to the BDS members because France kisses Israels butt almost as much as America.


with all due respect to you buster (I agree with you close to 100% of the time)...Israel is a special case...why do I say that?...they are surrounded by Islamic rulers, that would love to see Israel and the Jewish people burn to the ground. Let's also remember that Israel allows Muslims to work in their country, something where reciprocation is lacking in most of the Muslim world. even after the holocaust, there are still large groups of Europeans that do not like Jewish people and the hatred can be seen in political rallies in various parts of Europe to this day....having said this.....maybe France (or those in the know) might have good reasons to try and stop this. I think there should be more in-depth research done into both parties involved, to properly assess this decision wisely.


What I bolded is not true at all. Mostly in respect to the current religious extremists in charge of the Israeli government. Dont you remember Nuttyahoo remarks during the last election? "The muslims are running to vote in troves, hurry up we need to beat them" - I was paraphrasing there. Then there is the little gem about Israel attempting to bribe Iranian jews to leave Iran and move to Israel, many of whom refused.

And you bring up Israel being surrounded by those that want to destroy her. Israel attacked her neighbors first and claimed that they were going to attack so thats why they did it.

Then there is the Jewish religious symbol as their national flag....

Dont act like Israel is passive or warm welcoming. That government is a religious extemist terrorist nation. Not the only but the worst and most direct.



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 02:38 PM
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originally posted by: Cobaltic1978

But the majority know there is a vast difference between the Jewish faith and the faith of the Zionists, I just wish the remainder understood.


I think likewise, that too though has it's problems, there are those who simply do not believe that to be an honest statement, a deceit. You can't win, and there is no answer.



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 02:42 PM
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a reply to: jimmyx



they are surrounded by Islamic rulers, that would love to see Israel and the Jewish people burn to the ground.

They hate Israel because Israel has done nothing but wage war on one nation after another since it's creation. Also it isn't Jews they hate but rather Zionist. Muslims and Jews got along fine until Zionist moved in and messed everything up.


Let's also remember that Israel allows Muslims to work in their country, something where reciprocation is lacking in most of the Muslim world.

Of course they let Muslims work in Israel who doesn't love cheap labor.



even after the holocaust, there are still large groups of Europeans that do not like Jewish people and the hatred can be seen in political rallies in various parts of Europe to this day....having said this.....maybe France (or those in the know) might have good reasons to try and stop this. I think there should be more in-depth research done into both parties involved, to properly assess this decision wisely.

Sorry but the holocaust doesn't give Israel a free pass to commit numerous crimes and not be held accountable for them. Also the old they don't like Israels policies so they hate Jews cry is pretty lame what about Jews the don't like Israel because of it's policies? Are they just a bunch of self hating Jews?



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 02:50 PM
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originally posted by: smurfy

originally posted by: Cobaltic1978

But the majority know there is a vast difference between the Jewish faith and the faith of the Zionists, I just wish the remainder understood.


I think likewise, that too though has it's problems, there are those who simply do not believe that to be an honest statement, a deceit. You can't win, and there is no answer.

The problem is that zionists themselves are happy to feed and maintain the confusion between judaism and zionism, that way afterwards it becomes easy for them to accuse any anti-zionist of anti-semitism. They create the confusion to exploit it later. It's like a muslim extremist group that tries to create a confusion between muslims in general and extremists. It's exactly what daesh is trying to do : they make the anti-islam sentiment grow in the population of the world because they want muslims in Europe or elsewhere to feel victimized and join their ranks. And in the 2 cases, there are religious personalities screaming that zionism is not judaism and that daesh is not islam.



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 02:59 PM
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The reason that anti-semitic thoughts and actions are so incredibly harshly punished, and all thoughts along those lines stamped out as quickly as possible is because of the slippery slope effect.

Sounds trivial I know, and I absolutely can not stand what the state of Israel has been doing politically since more or less its inception, but the holocaust was such an enormous insult to humanity, not only by those who actually did it, but also by those who let it happen.

We as civilized nations were guilty of that, and we as civilized nations can not even perceive of it ever happening again in our so called civilized societies. So we do in fact overcompensate and I understand why, even if I disagree with it.

Some peoples in Europe, at the present time, may appreciate the sacrifice made during the holocaust in the not too distant future, if only because history will most probably save them from the same, horrific and shameful fate.



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 02:59 PM
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BDS is having an effect and I support it wholeheartedly. I have Jewish friends, students and business associates. Great people. However, it's the government of Israel and the hard liners that steal the palestinian land, don't want peace, discriminate against the Palestinian people.

Just the fact that BDS is being targeted by the French Government shows you that it is having an effect. It is bringing attention to what's really going on there.

When you treat someone badly, they will often retaliate against you. When you stop someone from having a platform to speak from, you force them to get attention in other ways. Why are those two truths so hard to understand?



posted on Feb, 22 2016 @ 03:01 PM
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a reply to: gosseyn

Saw the title and the first name that came to mind was Roger Waters.

This issue is not complicated, it is a matter of right and wrong, it is a matter of the correct or incorrect application of the law. The law should serve the oppressed not the oppressors.


Great letter.




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