UK Referendum 23 June 2016 - Will it be an EU BREXIT or Not?

originally posted by: 83Liberty
I was just looking on the government website and noticed that they have a sub-heading box on all the pages that gives a link to more information about the EU referendum...
www.gov.uk...

When you click that link you come to this page...
www.eureferendum.gov.uk...

And it's basically just a page of propaganda. Even their EU quiz is propaganda...
www.eureferendum.gov.uk...

Have a go at the quiz, it only takes 1 minute.

I bet even Kim Jong-un is blushing at the level of propaganda going on here.

The quiz is pure propaganda and crafty way to push it because with it being a quiz the answers must be correct!

a reply to: RP2SticksOfDynamite

Latest polls showing Remain being 8 points ahead. Mind you, we all know how accurate pollsters are! (actually though, pollsters should be a bit more accurate this time round as they had lots of meetings after the General Election to try and make sure they aren't so wrong in future - time will tell!).

originally posted by: Flavian
a reply to: RP2SticksOfDynamite

Latest polls showing Remain being 8 points ahead. Mind you, we all know how accurate pollsters are! (actually though, pollsters should be a bit more accurate this time round as they had lots of meetings after the General Election to try and make sure they aren't so wrong in future - time will tell!).

It sure will!

More from Vote Leave:


We send £350 million a week to the EU – enough to build a new hospital a week

250,000 EU migrants a year come to the UK – it’s out of control and damages the NHS

It’s safer to take back control and spend our money on our priorities

Imagine if we Vote Leave in 58 days’ time… We can stop sending £350m to the EU every week and give the NHS the funding it needs.



EU referendum will shape Labour party as well as Europe

Former Minister Frank Field today www.voteleavetakecontrol.org... m_medium=email&utm_source=voteleave delivered a speech in which he warned that the Labour party’s pro-EU stance threatens to undermine the already strained relationship between the parliamentary party and traditional Labour voters. He said that many Labour supporters would join UKIP as a result of Jeremy Corbyn’s decision to back the IN campaign.

The Labour MP stated that the level of migration is a major issue for traditional Labour supporters, especially those in lower paid jobs, and acknowledged that the UK’s ‘open door’ immigration policy has pushed wages down. He added that it had put greater pressure on the NHS, housing supply and school places.

The debate over the UK’s membership of the EU is one that transcends party political divides. Choosing to Vote Leave in this referendum isn’t a ‘right wing’ or a ‘left wing’ issue - it’s about taking back control on 23 June.



Home Secretary acknowledges EU membership is dangerous for UK

Theresa May yesterday questioned whether it is right to allow Albania, Macedonia, Montenegro, Serbia and Turkey to join the EU. She argued that they were ‘countries with poor populations and serious problems with organised crime, corruption, and sometimes even terrorism’.



Giving these countries EU membership and access to the open border system will only add to the pressure on our NHS, schools and housing. It will also vastly increase the risk of crime and terrorism on British streets.

Voting to stay in the EU will not only see more power and money handed to Brussels, it will also result in millions more EU citizens gaining the right to come to the UK. Our public services are already under severe pressure, and this will only add to the strain. The safer choice is to Vote Leave on 23 June.



Money saved from EU contributions could stop NHS strikes

The British Medical Association states that one of the main causes of today’s junior doctors’ strike is the end of automatic annual pay progression. However, this dispute could be settled with just over two weeks’ www.voteleavetakecontrol.org... _news&utm_medium=email&utm_source=voteleave worth of our EU contributions. The money at the heart of the current doctors dispute is just 5% of our overall annual contribution.

We should spend the £350 million the UK sends to the EU every week on supporting our NHS and helping it to deal with its current challenges. The only way to do this is to take control and Vote Leave on 23 June.



Today’s must-reads:

Corbyn must address working-class EU concerns, warns Frank Field - Guardian
www.theguardian.com...

Cabinet split over Brexit cash for striking doctors - Times
www.thetimes.co.uk...

Britain must quit Europe's human rights court, says May - Mail
www.dailymail.co.uk... ants-kick-terrorists-foreign-criminals.html

Brexit is only way to control immigration, campaigners claim - Guardian
www.theguardian.com...

After 40 years of being lied to, it's time to leave the EU - Michael Ancram, Telegraph
www.telegraph.co.uk...

See latest from www.pollstation.uk... Now 80% leave after 30059 votes. I know that some are readily dismissing this poll but with such a huge leave vote even a 30% adjustment means we leave the EU.

a reply to: RP2SticksOfDynamite

Pollstation 30059 voters is: Stay 15% Leave 80% Undec 5%

Other Sample Polls:

Financial Times: ig.ft.com...

Stay 47 Leave 40

The Guardian: www.theguardian.com...

Stay 39 Leave 43

Nasdaq: www.nasdaq.com...

Stay 42 Leave 58

Telegraph: www.telegraph.co.uk...

Stay 51 Leave 49


Sample Stay Average = 15+47+39+42+51 / 5 = approx. 39%

Sample Leave Average = 80+40+43+58+49 / 5 = approx. 52%

There you have it. This is what will happen on 23 June just as I previously predicted.

But they are only polls are they not.

Must see and share from Vote Leave:


Dear Friend,

If we remain in the EU the NHS is in serious danger. Millions more people will be eligible to use it and we will have less money to spend on it.

Countries like Macedonia, Montenegro, Serbia, Albania and Turkey are now waiting to join the EU. This means millions of new EU citizens will have the right to come to the UK and use our NHS, putting it under even more strain.

Also, the £350 million a week we send to the EU is going to rise. This money could already pay to build a fully equipped hospital every week or could provide the money needed to settle the junior doctors' pay dispute in just over two weeks.

But it’s not enough for the greedy EU; they want even more money so we will have even less money to spend on the NHS, just as junior doctors want pay rises and demand for health services increases.
If we remain in the EU we will not be able to guarantee the same access to healthcare that people currently enjoy.

Because this is so important we’ve created a new film to show the dangers the NHS will face if we stay in the EU. Please join all of the people who’ve viewed it and shared it on social media by clicking here. voteleave.nationbuilder.com... ave&utm_source=voteleave

Now the EU plans to sue us for protecting our own domestic companies


Brussels officials are plotting to haul Britain before the EU courts for charging

foreign lorries to drive on UK roads.

Two years ago the government introduced a levy of up to £10 a day - to *level the

playing field* for British truck drivers who have to pay tolls on the continent.


European Commission president Jean-Claude Junker's chief of staff, Martin Selmayr

has boasted infringement proceedings will be taken against the UK that could

result in the policy being found illegal by the *European Court of Justice* resulting

in the UK facing a hefty fine.


However commission officials refused to comment, in case it led to accusations ....

They are keeping it under wraps, in the run up to the UK referendum.

www.dailymail.co.uk... s.html

originally posted by: 83Liberty
a reply to: RP2SticksOfDynamite

Did Vote.Leave get back to you about the £350million figure?

Guardian is reporting the misleading/incorrect figures now...
www.theguardian.com...

Why are people going to believe anything Vote.Leave says when their most biggest claim is WRONG?

See follow up response from Vote Leave:


Dear T,

I'm very sorry for the delay in responding. The rebate is a discretionary grant paid in arrears by the EU
institutions to the UK - this grant could be withheld at any time by the EU and should not be deducted from the UK’s gross contributions. As the Chancellor, George Osborne, made clear: ‘It is not a unilateral decision of the British Treasury or the British
Government to just say, “This is our rebate. We are entitled to it. Pay up”. The way this works and has always worked is there is a negotiation with the European Commission.’ (Evidence to Treasury Select Committee, 17 December 2014,
link). data.parliament.uk...


I hope that helps.


Many thanks,
Hugh

Cameron's in mob would want the public to ever know what they discussed in secret would they


www.msn.com...

The so called Brexit referendum, will not actually destroy the EU. The EU will be destroyed for other reasons. The referendum in itself means very little and won't bring anything except another big chunk of buffoonery in the BBC and other TV stations. Although the fact that there's a referendum indicates a condition of unease and orchestrated disorder within the EU. The EU is pure chaos and can only bring suffering in a kind of medieval style feudalism and obscurantism.
That, per se is not tolerable in the 21st century after industrial revolutions and after FDR. Therefore, the EU will have to be completely destroyed and returned to nation state, or reformed in such a way that it won't look at all like the EU, but some sort of federal republic, vafuely resembling the CIS. The armed forces must never be united, the secret services will be disbanded as their only purpose is to create terrorism and chaos. The police will take over the work of the current agencies, will be accountable in front of the law, and their operations will be bound by the law!

Karl Van Gelder is an administrator working in the National Health Service and he says:

I see at first hand how our EU membership does untold harm to our NHS.

It was a National Health Service set up to bear the burden of a *nation* NOT

the growing number of EU states.

see full story....leave.eu...

More from Vote Leave:

Vote Leave for economic growth and to control immigration

The EU-funded OECD became the latest body to publish a report with ridiculous claims about what would happen after we Vote Leave. However, even when using extremely pessimistic and unrealistic assumptions - including that the UK will not strike a free trade deal with the EU or any other country - they make clear that the UK economy would continue to grow outside the EU.

Significantly, the OECD find that after we take back control of our borders, we can reduce net migration to avoid a city the size of Manchester being added to the UK population by 2030. This will ease the pressure on our NHS and public services which are already under severe strain.

As the fifth largest economy in the world, we will strike free trade agreements with the EU and with growing economies around the world. We can take back control of our immigration policy and welcome in the brightest and best from around the world. The only way to do this is to Vote Leave on 23 June.



EU policy hurts African farmers

James Cleverly MP made an important speech today in which he highlighted how the Common Agricultural Policy is making African farmers poorer. The Conservative MP outlined how the EU’s protectionist policies subsidise European farmers to produce food in such large quantities, and that it makes it more difficult for African farmers to sell their goods.

He argued that ‘far from levelling the playing field, the EU reinforces the structural inequalities that favour big businesses and powerful countries at the expense of developing nations’. He noted that the EU is guilty of ‘hypocrisy’ as it supports its own farmers whilst relying on African raw materials.

After we Vote Leave we will be able to continue to support our farmers, whilst ensuring that those in developing countries are not disadvantaged by unfair tariffs. Let’s take back control on 23 June.



UK paying billions for countries to join the EU

Research www.voteleavetakecontrol.org... voteleave by Vote Leave reveals that the UK will pay nearly £2 billion by 2020 to Albania, Macedonia, Montenegro, Serbia and Turkey to join the EU. The EU Commission describes this as an ‘investment in the future of the EU’, which ‘creates incentives for EU future members’.

Rather than sending this money abroad, it would be better spent on our priorities like the NHS. However, the Government is instead planning to give an extra 88 million people access to our public services which are already under huge strain.

On top of this, it could also undermine our security. The Home Secretary Theresa May warned against these countries becoming EU members, saying that they are states with ‘poor populations and serious problems with organised crime, corruption, and sometimes even terrorism.’ This comes as a www.telegraph.co.uk... top US security chief today warned that the EU’s open borders have allowed Isil cells into the UK. James Clapper, the US Director of National Intelligence, said that terrorists were taking advantage of the migrant crisis and that free movement is costing the EU its security.

After we Vote Leave, we can spend the £350 million we send to the EU every week on our priorities. We can also take back control of our borders to strengthen our national security. That is why it’s the safer option to Vote Leave on 23 June.



Today’s must reads:

Open borders let Isil into Britain, warns US spy chief - Telegraph
www.telegraph.co.uk...

EU splashed £1bn of British taxpayers' cash to boost Turkey and Albania's membership bid - Sun
www.thesun.co.uk...

Africans suffer at EU hands, says Tory seeking ethnic vote - Times
www.thetimes.co.uk...

The 250,000 EU migrants 'that weren't counted' - Mail
www.dailymail.co.uk... 50-000-year-meaning-migration-inside-Europe-higher-rest-world-combined.html

Britain will be at the front of the queue for a US trade deal - Ted Cruz, Times
www.thetimes.co.uk...

Brexit could be a celebration for the City, not its funeral - David Buik, Evening Standard
www.standard.co.uk...

MPs criticise government over European Commission fines - BBC
www.bbc.com...

The voting in the Scottish Referendum ended up 55% stay and 45% leave. And we were told this was an overwhelming vote in favour of staying, never to be looked at again.

Tell me, if the same figures happen in #EUref will you be happy and content with the decision given the amount of #ProjectFear, influence, and media bias being thrown being the remain side ?


sorry for laughing can't help it

originally posted by: bigyin
The voting in the Scottish Referendum ended up 55% stay and 45% leave. And we were told this was an overwhelming vote in favour of staying, never to be looked at again.

Tell me, if the same figures happen in #EUref will you be happy and content with the decision given the amount of #ProjectFear, influence, and media bias being thrown being the remain side ?

sorry for laughing

can't help it

Not be happy but obviously have to accept it. But will wait for the moment........"I told you so".

a reply to: bigyin

If there is no evidence of direct electoral fraud then I'll accept whatever the result is and move on with the new reality.
You certainly won't see me whinging and bleating about it on ATS like so many bitter Scottish nationalists.

*Edit*
Oh, and right back at ya, I laugh at the bitter whinging 45%, every time I see you lot bleating like lost lambs on the hillside lol

It just gets better

From Vote Leave:


Dear Friend,

Some of the saddest and most disturbing reasons for Africa’s continued poverty are the EU’s policies.

My mother was from Sierra Leone so I hope you will forgive me being passionate about Africa. I'm disgusted that both the Common Agricultural Policy and EU trade tariffs keep African farmers poor and use your money to do it.

Continental European farmers are subsidised to produce more food than we can eat, distorting the global food market. African farmers cannot compete and are forced into subsistence farming, where one bad season brings economic ruin and a couple of bad seasons means starvation.

Tariffs mean that in 2014 the whole of Africa made just under $2.4 billion from coffee exports, while Germany made $3.8 billion. Germany made more money from coffee without growing a single bean than a whole continent which grows vast amounts.

Germany’s coffee producers need cheap, raw beans to make money, so there is no import tariff on green, unprocessed coffee. That’s why the vast bulk of African coffee exports are unprocessed. But there are import tariffs on processed coffee because it is in the processing, branding, packaging and marketing that Germany makes its money. These tariffs protect it from African competition. It’s the same story with cocoa.


You are paying for this.
The £350 million we send to the EU every week is helping it to keep some of the poorest people in the world in poverty. The EU is using YOUR money to do it.

But what about our farmers? They receive EU subsidies too, don’t they? Well, just enough to keep our farming industry addicted to EU membership. But think about what happens to the rest of our money, It goes, in large part, to those heavily subsidised farms on the continent. Our farmers are being taxed to subsidise their competitors to keep African farmers in poverty. It's indefensible.

The EU won’t change because it doesn’t see the need to. But Britain isn’t like that. Not the Britain I know. Not the Britain I love. That is why I will vote to leave the EU and that is why I urge you to do the same.

We need to tell as many people as possible that a vote to Leave is also a vote to help some of the world’s poorest people. The EU-funded IN campaign is outspending us in this referendum.

originally posted by: bigyin
Tell me, if the same figures happen in #EUref will you be happy and content with the decision given the amount of #ProjectFear, influence, and media bias being thrown being the remain side ?

sorry for laughing

can't help it

I'm sorry but you sound very bitter and spiteful.
Obviously you're not a man of principle if you can't help laughing about it.

But to answer your question, I agree with what grainofsand said.. 'If there is no evidence of direct electoral fraud then I'll accept whatever the result is and move on with the new reality'.

However, if we do Remain, I would probably continue to vote UKIP and hope for another referendum in 20 years or so, if it's not too late by then of course. I read a rumour that they may change the rules so in order for another country to leave the EU, it needs to be voted unanimously within the EU Council.

a reply to: 83Liberty

Agreed, I'll be voting UKIP in council/parliamentary/European MP elections every time if the vote is to remain in June.

...but I won't be whinging and all bitter with hate, just accepting of the new reality and adapting as appropriate.